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Gen rushing is a huge problem.
How is it that a gen can finish before my TVs spawn as Sadako? How can I constantly have 2 people on me, and 4 gens are done in 3 minutes? How is that even playable? Gens get done so fast that I can't even play the game even though I have 25-50% of their team occupied. It's driving me insane because it feels unplayable.
Comments
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If the team is efficient and brings the good stuff (BNPart, Tools, Prove Thy) gens can be pretty fast.
Some killers get their chances only when 2-3 gens are done which can be very discouraging.
If you can´t get into the down/hook snowball or they loop to good there is no real chance for most normal killers.
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Because this is the #1 problem in the game and always has been, gen rush. Which in turn causes the #2, #3 issues camping and tunneling. If I lose 3 or 4 gens for 1 hook why the hell would I leave the hook and go for more chases lmao.
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Why does this term gen rush even exist, the primary goal of survivors is to do them to leave as soon as possible just like horror movies where people wanna try to do whatever it takes to get away from them as soon as possible. I guess survivors arent to do their objective lol.
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I have to disagree. Camping and tunneling was huge before the gen regression perks were NERFed. I'm not saying there isn't a problem, but using gen speed as an excuse to tunnel and camp is bull. Most do it at 5 gens anyway. Maybe camping and tunneling has caused "gen rushing".
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That's what happens when you delete every alternative playstyle.
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Yes and no.
It is the goal and you can do it but you won´t get much points for that.
The most points you get for all kinds of interactions like repairing, totems, saving, chasing, healing. Doing all of this is like the game is intentional designed. Therfore you need all of this to level up.
But you can simply ignore all of this and only do gens as fast as possible -> Gen Rush.
Some players want to do this and some not.
This is the same thing that the killer also should engage with all survs. This would work if the survs also do all of the stuff.
But as @DyingWish92 said if one side is speeding up, the other has to react. So, more gen rushes, more killers try to tunnel someone out asap to buy time -> survs try to repair faster because the killer tunnels... and so on
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You have to have at least one gen regression perk to have a chance, most of the good streamers I see run multiple, consistently. Corrupt and Deadlock are solid choices, Jolt on M1 Killers. Meanwhile Survivors have 4 free perk slots and can do just fine with any build.
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It exists because there is a median time in which gens can take to get done, but the actual time can be pushed to be much faster and on the opposite side we used to have more ability to make gens take much longer to complete.
Yes the survivor objective is to repair generators and escape, but in order for the killer to try and do their objective they need to be able to keep up with the speed at survivors do their objective. If the objective is being done faster than a killer can reasonably be expected to match then they are literally being rushed. The game is balanced more around the median time to complete survivor objective than it is at the rushed pace. Some killers do not have the ability to keep up with a rushed pace because some of them don't even really have powers until later in the game.
Why try and play pedantic word games and make it seem as if the OP didn't want them to do their objective? A game having a time variance of 3mins and 60mins when the sweet spot is supposed to be between 10-15mins is a problem. Sadako doesn't even start with the bulk of her power and has no other mobility at the start of trial. Even highly experienced players would find it a bit difficult to match a rushed pace with her on a majority of maps considering they're far too big for her until her tvs turn on and there isn't really much early game stall available to her via perks. She needs to snowball and that takes time she might not have in a lot of circumstances.
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reality is.....its the killers job to take you off the gens. not the survivors job not to do gens
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Why I stopped playing. Waiting for a time when gen speeds get nerfed again.
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lol...they dont need to be nerfed again. you should apply more pressure
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Pop and scourge together can be pretty good on high mobility killer i think, i was running Corrupt intervention/Pop/Scourge/Bamboozle on wraith and seems like a decent build, with sloppy butcher add on and faster uncloak add on.
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I agree but same argument can be made for camping and tunneling. Killer is just doing their objective.
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Just pressure gens, bro!
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I feelt the same with every killer under A Tier. I mostly played Pig, Dredge, Fredy etc. So mostly weaker Killers. I always got genrushed as fu and called a baby killer after the match. So what I do now is only playing Nurse. It seems like Survivors want that so they get that. Now I think I had 20 4ks (hatch escape not count) in a row and the average gens that got done where 2.
So if they bring the best stuff I bring the second best Killer. So dont complain if the first down is in 15 Seconds, when there are 2 strong Medkits and two strong Toolboxes.
Btw all of these matches where 12 hooks so no tunnel no camp and with brown addons. So if they want more sweat they allways can get more.
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I would say genrushing causes the camping and tunneling. Gen rushing got countered by Regression Perks for weaker Killers and Camping and Tunneling by good survivor teamplay and skill. Now the Regression Perks are gone weaker Killers need to tunnel to counter gen rushing. It isnt relevant how mutch gens where done, because mostly min two get competted at the same time. So the game can turn very fast. So if killers now cant delay the Survivors objektiv zhey need to do there objektiv faster (camping and tunneling). For me as a Killer main that loved to play wesker Killers these Perk nerf where rlly rlly bad. The game turned from hard but fun to unplayable without tunneling. So I dont play weaker Killers at the Moment and switched to every Round Nurse, because you get slowdown from quick downs. Something weaker Killers are not able to do.
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And gen rushing has always been in the game. What's your point?
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Also I'd say 1 in every 20 survivor matches I play does a killer actually truly tunnel and camp. And I'd say 50% or more of survivor games I play 3 or more gens are done by the time the killer has 2 or 3 hooks. And don't say the killers are bad because that's a load of crap. Maps are to save and no matter how you are at killer downing can be very difficult before multiple gens are done.
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Reality is....there are 4 survivors and 1 killer. Push survivors off one gen and if the other survivors have brain cells they will be on 2-3 other gens. Is the killer supposed to be 3 places at once???
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Tbh, I don't think it should be the case that a gen gets done before a killer can possibly walk to you from the start (assuming the are actively heading directly to you). Yes, corrupt intervention exists but that's a bandaid fix for a design flaw imo.
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Yeah and then they raise their mmr so high instead of getting better at chasing gets full swf bully loopers and cry nerf swfs and survivor perks or in solo que instance wonder why survivors dc or hook sucide. Funny thing is swfs dont seem to rage quit like babies like how solo que would or if so its rare in swfs end.
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I feel like the problem is that most survivors (especially solo survivors) have such a poor escape rate, that anything other than sticking to a gen feels like throwing the game. For example, you often hear people talk about team mates "throwing the game" for Rift challenges. Some absolutely do this intentionally, but others (like myself) try to complete them slowly if necessary so as to not screw the team over. But the reality is, not sitting on a gen makes your team view you as useless.
Content creators don't help either. I watch streamers sit there yelling, asking why their team mates aren't on a gen or carrying on if they see someone is opening a chest instead. Everyone wants to have a win sometimes, but if it's not happening often then you're going to ignore every objective that doesn't help and only focus on what does.
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The longer a match goes, the more of a chance the killer will kill survivors, thus there is no incentive for survivors to do anything that not decrease their time in the match. Aka, survival.
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If the killer is efficient and brings the good stuff (instant down, iri, favor map offering), kills can be pretty fast. And no real chance for most normal survivors.
Its obvious that things go for both sides...
Equal skill and equal investment, who try harder win the game.
Equal kill and equal try, who invest more win the game.
Who try harder and invest more will beat the better skill player who dont try hard and dont invest.
Its easy to invest as killer to win, play top killers with double purple/iri addon and map and chance to win guaranteed. For survivors, a 3 people SWF can be screwed by a random who just play for fun.
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If survivors do a gen under 30 seconds it takes to get Onryo's tv's on then that is actually a good thing.
It means that most likely all of the survivors had to be on that gen and blew all of their resources to get that single gen done fast. It would be way worse if they split up from the start and pressured multiple gens.
Early gens don't mean as much as people want to believe. The only gen that really matters is the last one. Once you realise that it's easier to keep your head cool.
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don't play sadako. play nurse, spirit, wesker, or blight. problem solved.
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Lol sure, good luck without any anti tunnel
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Being told to play just 4 of the 30+ killers is not a solution and if you genuinely think it's not an issue for only 12% of the killers that should be a red flag
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I do get that, but when I find someone in the first 20 seconds of the game, hook them within the first minute and 2 gens are already done there's not really a chance for me to go and shove people off gens.
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Killers are not supposed to win all the time! Same for survivors!
As a 50/50 surv/killer I have my Killer games where I get 0 kills and like 3-4 hooks total. Does it suck, is it defeating? Yes and yes. Then I have games where I obliterate survs and get 4K at 3-4 gens. And I don’t camp or tunnel unless I’m not getting hooks. Even then I try not to.
There are a lot of pieces to the puzzle here: skill, going against 4 ppl of equal or better skill, maps, items, perks, etcetc
We sure like to complain when we lose, but when we win the game is working as intended 😂
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sure thing as soon as they shrink the maps.
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This comment just isn't it.
How is a killer supposed to apply consistent pressure if A. The team is full of good runners and B. Everyone brought genspeed perks and toolboxes?
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Thats the flaw in design. The gaps of strength between 3 and 4 survivors is too great. Not mention limited in resources.
Its either 1 second of chase, that title connected to title and double pallets, that exchange to 3 seconds of Gen.
Or holding W until getting hit in a few seconds, that exchange to equal second of Gen because teammates died.
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Because the objective itself is poorly designed. I dont think I, or any other person that plays killer more than surv, want the survivors to just intentionally not do their objective because thats dumb. However, due to the devs refusing to rework the objective itself to make it take a base amount of time at its fastest, as well as making it more fun to do so that you aren't just holding m1 for x amount of minutes, here we are.
Your comment literally adds zero value to the conversation and just comes off as dismissive. It isn't super difficult to put yourself in the other sides shoes and go "ya know what, that probably feels pretty bad to go against"
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I mean this is literally all the survivors are supposed to do. If theyre getting gens done too fast youre chasing good looping survivors too long.
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Perks, repair box and addons.
All the gen defense perks got nerfed, but gen speed perks and addons don't get nerfs, that's why.
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Some games you don't have any "weak" loopers. And in that case you're screwed. Even mediocre loopers who played the game for awhile can be a problem because they know the basics and what's safe and not safe, god pallets, predropping, and they can cause problems as well. So not everyone has to be a god looper to cause a big issue. The sad reality is you need 1 or 2 weak links on the team or its gonna be a bad time. Drop chase? And then what if they next person you find is good to, this can repeat and it's GG.
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I think a mode where no Iri addons/offerings are allowed or whatever would be nice until they fix the current economy and balance of the game, now that everything is cheaper BNP/Killer iri's are far more common.
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So you are complaining that if the whole enemy team is better then you, then you should still win somehow? Why? How is that fair? Also you can still create deadzones and no matter how good said survivor is - he will still go down. If there are no resources to loop around, then even best player in DBD will just die.
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Sadako is a weak killer unless you have a condemn build. Her early game is difficult and she lacks pressure, like many stealth killers. Her optimal playstyle is hit and run, Sadako is not a killer that can commit to a long chase and be successful. Concentrate on gen patrolling and catching survivors off-guard and it works, though never expect a 4K with her unless you use a condemn build.
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The problem is that the game has reached a stage now where #1 and #2 and #3 can be flipped. Survivors might feel compelled to get through gens asap to avoid the snowball caused by 2 and 3.
Killers may go into a match with the intention to do 2 and 3. Because they assume survivors will do 1. And survivors will go into the match to do 1 presuming the killer will do 2 and 3.
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As someone who only does solo Q I can assure you most of my games are full of people who can't loop for more than 5 seconds.
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dude............ theres people getting 1000+ win streaks as killer. theres no way this should be a thing.
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Adding MMR to the game only made it worse.
Removing viable gen regression perks only made it worse.
Then because everyone knows the gens will always eventually get powered the survivors all use adrenaline - making it once again worse.
How did we get all the gen regression perks nerfed to oblivion without Gen Rush perks getting the same treatment? I really don't get it from a "balance" perspective. It makes sense from a - let's make the larger audience side happy so we make more money.
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-"So you are complaining that if the whole enemy team is better then you, then you should still win somehow? Why? How is that fair?"
Funny you should say that but because of the extremely generous map designs and game mechanics of things like "shift W" most of the killer roster requires you to be massively better at the killer role than they are at survivor just to be on even footing.
Nurse and Blight are skill based. If you play well you crush people who do not loop perfectly. Most of the other killers usually end up in situations where they are literally powerless. Say you're Pig on "the game" and someone throws a god pallet. That means the chase is "over" unless you stop to break the pallet at most loops.
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It's 4 vs 1. If 4 people are all better than me then the matchmaking sucks. Also anyone can drop a god pallet and escape a chase, a good looper or a horrible player can do this. The poor balancing of the maps and all the safe areas make it impossible to know if you're actually against players better than you or if the map is just carrying them to victory.
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"So you are complaining that if the whole enemy team is better then you, then you should still win somehow? Why? How is that fair?"
And yet Survivors whine about the Killer being better than them and 'tunneling' and 'camping', and how it should be changed NOW if not sooner than NOW!
Weird that Killers talking about genrushing are met with 'Git gud', but Killers killrushing (Tunneling and camping) are game-breaking tactics that should never exist & every Killer who does them should have their PCs burned in front of them.
I guess winning quickly is a Survivor-only thing?
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There are 1 or 2 god pallets in most maps. Sure you need to break them when they are thrown. You also need to break some extremely good pallets too (provided your killer's ability can't play around it). But huge number of pallets can be played around and some pallets are even better left unbroken (so there's a temptation/chance survivor will decide to play it).
Maps are a big factor, but there are no maps in this game that are autowin for one side. This is true for cowshed, garden of joy, midwitch and saloon.
Interesting. And I swapped to killer from survivor (talking spent time in game - iri1 as killer for 10 days now while gold 2 on survivor), because I am fed up with how hard it is to play survivor if you don't have very good 4-man at ready... I can enjoy my strictly no camp/chase Bubba and still win more then I loose. While you can super tryhard on survivor and have perfect games with 0 mistakes and still get heavily screwed...
Camping and tunneling as killer player is ok. It's problem for the game (not engaging thing to 3/4 survivors, and feels unfair to 4th) and it should be addressed by devs (sole reason being, that meta should be things that engage + are fun for everyone involved. If best thing to do is staying on a single spot, looking at unmooving target and gaving hands outside of keyboard+mouse/joystick, then the game has clearly some problem).
It's stupid to ask killers to not play like that. But it would be good move, if those tactics were (usually - it doesn't even need to be always worse thing) worse then some alternative (yes there should be viable alternative) and that alternative should be engaging for everyone.
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I swapped to killer from survivor (talking spent time in game - iri1 as killer for 10 days now while gold 2 on survivor), because I am fed up with how hard it is to play survivor if you don't have very good 4-man at ready... I can enjoy my strictly no camp/chase Bubba and still win more then I loose. While you can super tryhard on survivor and have perfect games with 0 mistakes and still get heavily screwed...
The thing is you're in the "baby bracket" if you're playing like that. If I sat you down on my account you would play every game vs the tryhardiest survivors and probably say "huh" at the very least.
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This is not the first month I got iri1 on killer. Considering soft cap exists, we do get same survivors (as supaalf and lilithomen and onepumpwillie)...
Also. I do get such hopeless games from time to time. But most killer games are chill (at least to me), while as survivor you will loose good chunk of your games even if you play picture-perfect (provided you don't have good 3 teammates at ready). Now considering you also loose some when it is your fault, survivor is just too hard and I prefer chill killer experience...
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