getting protection after a 4% self unhook is an absolute joke and needs to be removed.
Just what the title says. 4% on its own is already stupid (should the killer get a 4% chance to teleport you to a hook when a gen gets done?) but being able to just unhook yourself and then unhook someone else in the basement and walk right out the gates with 0 risk while the killer is right next to you is the stupidest idea that has ever been implemented into this game. Being able to ######### on hook in the first place as a free way to forfiet with no penalty is a travesty of game design and likewise shouldn't be in the game at all. Just remove self unhook attempts.
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It's a nessicary evil.
With the devs putting up an anti facecamp mechanic that allows survivors to unhook themselves if the Killer stays too close to the hook for an extended period of time, survives that unhook themselves need the protection so that the anti camp mechanic does something.
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If they unhooked someone else from basement after unhooking themselves, they wouldn’t have protection anymore.
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Rolling a lottery to get a cheesy win is not a solution for facecamping, it's just a detrimental element of chance to make one side get a free win after a fuckup that the other doesn't have any equivalent to, and going for it just throws the game if you don't get lucky. That isn't stopping anyone from camping. In the 96% of times it doesn't work, the camping killer is actually just being rewarded for sitting there and being so boring the survivor wants to leave the match. If the devs don't want people to facecamp maybe instead of adding thousands of annoying perks for survivors to get second chances they should just change their game so it doesn't explicitly reward camping and tunneling for killer.
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It doesn't matter, you're forced to hit them or they'll do it anyway.
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The protection is lost as soon as they touch the hooked survivor, not when the unhook actually goes through. If the killer is right there they can down them or grab them.
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The second they touch the survivor they're unhooking, they've performed a Conspicuous Action and are hittable. If you're already on top of them, react. If your timing is especially good then you get a grab and can just drop them right back on the basement hook they just left. And if you aren't there to stop that then the 10s basekit Endurance doesn't matter anyway.
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not the point. if they have off the record they can just sit there for an entire minute until you hit them or leave, and survivors exploiting this cheese will.
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1, the game IS designed around RNG. This is deliberate choice and reason why this game is party game. You can be better, but loose to map RNG or say 4% unhook. Devs want this as this provides that OMG I AM SO LUCKY feeling.
2, killers DO have same thing. How many times did you go around a gen that suddenly just exploded? Every case of this is survivor letting go of the gen and it just randomly doing 10% gen regression with 0 possibility to do anything about it. I have had games where I lost 50% progress on critical gen thanks to this (multiple people working on same gen and killer returning to it multiple times). But loosing 10% of gen is quite common.
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"(should the killer get a 4% chance to teleport you to a hook when a gen gets done?)"
ngl, that had me laugh. It's a bit off though. It should be: upon completion of a gen the killer can lunge (punch air), each time having a 4% chance to have the entity teleport him to the just completed gen. He has three attempts to do so in a span of 45 seconds. If he succeeds he gains 2% haste for 10 seconds, if he fails he's hindered by 2% 10 seconds.
Now on a more serious note: the 4% does serve a purpose; to give players the illusion of agency while effectively being timed out for a prolonged time. As for the 4% as a way out of a match; that can come from two places. Pettiness is one, being at the receiving end of unhealthy elements in the game is the other. One of those elements is being addressed soon: camping killers. Once the legitimate reasons to 4% are removed from the game we can replace the 4% with something else to keep a player engaged (idk, hit great skillchecks to slow down the timer). But that's kinda the last point in the journey.
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Endurance is lost once they touch the hooked person and protection is always ignored by grabs too.
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A minute is a full hook stage. You know if they have OTR because they won't make noise, and if you're already camping them then gen pressure is of no concern.
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downing two people and then watching as one rng's himself out of a losing state to then stand next to another hooked survivor with no risk whatsoever, turning an earned 2 hook into a forced 2 unhooked isnt camping, they can do this immediately and 2 inches in front of your face. if 4% was there to stop camping it wouldn't be available 2 seconds after being hooked.
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I'm kind of surprised you're complaining about the 4%, which is so rare anyway and not like Deliverance, which is guaranteed and also gives you protection. Although maybe now that you're reminded of it you also won't like that it gets endurance.
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Its absolutely necessary as well as the anti camping changes coming soon to deal with this long standing problem within the game. Don't forget that it is because of the excessive camping and tunneling that killer players have done over the years that these changes have now come to the game. Your situation seems to have had the basement spawn right by an exit gate in the killer shack. If a survivor unhooked themselves without the help of a perk like deliverance then I don't see what there is to complain about here in the context of it being unfair. They pulled off something that rarely happens in the game and you want that nerfed? I think that is unreasonable.
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i continue to misunderstand why you dont just check for otr and then wait out for the grab. if they've 4%'d (which will happen in a gigantic minority of games) in basement (even rarer) with another person right next to them (even rarer), then play around it. you have half of their team pressured minimum.
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4% are stupid and should go. The idea of respecting something that took 0 skill or teamwork in a team game is so ridiculous. Like oh wow, you won the 1/25 chance? Very skilled, I will now respect the 4%. What if killers could do 2 hook states for one hook action with a 4% chance? You might say thats broken and stupid, but I say its a clutch mechanic to keep up the variety.
also make basekit BT in endgame 6s
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Of course its stupid design. Like god pallets. Like BT at base, soon to be deliverance at base. They try to make it so easy for survivor but there are too many ignorant and entitled survivors out there that preach this nonsense.
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Like god pallets.
expendable resource, break them and restart the chase.
Like BT at base,
added to the game to address that without BT tunneling fresh unhooks was monstrously easy, so every single survivor was required to bring it.
soon to be deliverance at base.
"deliverance at base" leaves out the most pertinent piece of information regarding the upcoming changes - they are only giving survivors self-unhook in the event that they are being face camped (or proxy camped for an extended period of time).
calling measures designed to minimise the amount of situations in which a killer can tunnel and camp "stupid design" in my opinion overlooks the reason why those changes were/are being implemented.
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So should they add a 4% chance for the killer to make a survivor to instantly teleport to a hook without chasing them? If it's a rare chance, it's automatically balanced, right?
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You're seriously saying that a survivor unhooking right in front of you is fine because you can just wait out the grab for the entire 60 seconds the person is on the hook (longer with deliverance) until they finally go for a grab. And you don't see anything wrong with that being a thing someone would have to do when they already earned their hooks.
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Sure. But let's go with full picture. 96% that the gen/gate progression will raise by 33% for each try (in case of open exit gate, TP survivor out for each attempt - the one closest to killer)
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Deliverance requires a perk slot and has a high risk because you might get hooked first. It does not rely on chance, so you can use your ability to unhook yourself as part of the team strategy. 4% doesn't require any perk slots, any thought, any skill, any planning, or any brain activity at all and has no risk in situations where you don't think you'll get unhooked anyway. (In which case the killer earned a 4k. Should survivors have a 4% chance to instantly get hooked if they do gens too fast and the killer isn't good enough to down them?) There's nothing broken or unfair about deliverance.
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Yeah, sure. Why even have any skill based gameplay at all? Just let either team press a button that has a 4% chance for an instant win and a 96% chance for an instant loss. It's fair and fun gameplay if it's a rare chance. No. The point is these mechanics have no place in the game, and your trolling game is weak.
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But there's point in that mechanics. It's to a, give player some agency b, if everyone is downed it's actually correct play
You are saying how unfair it is for killer - yet if we implement the same thing for the other side it's stupid?
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You always bring this argument up and completely disregard the downside of 96% of the time, the unhook attempt just taking a good chunk out of the hook timer lol
Also what about other RNG mechanics? Like skill checks the moment that survivors let go of gens. Do you think we should make a survivor favoured interaction as well? Maybe that survivors have a chance to dodge killer attacks, even if they were supposed to get hit? Or let's just let killers randomly trip. That would be fun.
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You do realize hook grabs are being removed right?
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What difference does that make? Ah I know. You can't get immediatelly flashlight saved that way by 3rd person (downing someone with hit does not allow flash save. Flash save is possible only on pickup).
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Nope, because this is entirely a killer made problem. Because of the endless excessive toxic playstyles of many killers over the years these changes make their way into the game. Your comparison is not an argument. Its wanting something to change where there is no problem because a solution is being offered where there is a problem.
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So we should remove all toxic play styles then? Okay how about gen rushing, running four flashlights and flash bangs on a single team, boil over combos, honestly we have to get rid of map offerings entirely so survivors can't run stealth builds on massive maps and just completely hold the game hostage, not to mention endurance stacking with dead hard and made for this, the sheer amount of misery and toxicity survivors are currently capable of far exceeds that of the killer.
The amount of survivor bias on this forum never ceases to amaze me.
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Sounds like you have a problem with SWF. This hardly ever happens naturally in solo que. Survivors cannot do anything as match controlling as camping, tunneling or slugging. These are things many killer players have abused for years. These situations always favored the killer and placed survivors into near to impossible ways to deal with it. You're trying to create a problem where there is none because survivors are getting ways to counter things that has given too much control of the match to the killer for too long. There is no bias here. Don't forget that these changes are entirely based upon the playstyles of killers over the years. If these things were not common we wouldn't need solutions to deal with them. DBD could very well be the same environment it was years ago had most killer players simply not played in a way for so long that required these changes to be made.
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I made that comment in June before they announced that they were removing hook grabs.
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Your problem is that you are viewing everything a survivor does as toxic which just isn’t true. I’m sorry you’ve had bad games but having all gens done quickly, getting blinded/stunned for a save, and being on the other end of boil over are all counterable and not toxic gameplay. They also are not always easy to pull off whereas camping and slugging are both easy and effective.
Back to the 4% I cannot believe you are even complaining about this. It’s 4%. That’s almost NOTHING. It also punishes survivors for every failed attempt of which there will be MANY. Survivors need the ability to at least try and unhook themselves because of camping killers and being abandoned by teammates. The entire game was built around the dynamic of hooking and unhooking and whereas killers can abuse that mechanic through camping and slugging survivors have no way to do so. The least we can give them is the measly 4%.
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