Why is BHVR so afraid to buff weak killers?

That's exactly what the simple killers are. Killers like Trapper and Wraith are absolutely viable at high MMR and both of them do a great job of teaching you the basics of the game. I play at high MMR and have no problem getting 4ks with either of them. If you learn how to chase with Wraith, you'll be able to win with anyone. The problem is that new players immediately look up tier lists and never actually learn how to chase as an M1 killer. Until you get to the competitive level, every killer is viable.

The only change The Trapper really needs is always being able to start with all your traps.

Ok I accidently went back a page and deleted my entire response/question so I'll keep it short and to the point.

Surely, bhvr doesn't consider GF and legion to be reworks right? They got minor base-kit buffs and large add-ons passes, there was no massive kit change like OG doctor. Just want to know what bhvr thinks a rework is.

There's a lot of killers who simply will never be good without making them extremely unfun to play against due to the nature of their power. Trapper, Trickster, and Doctor are pretty good examples of killers who are more victims of having powers that are missing aspects of what means a good killer power like map control/chase

CLEAR! As in the statistics it says that he is the killer WITH THE HIGHEST KILL RATE, well THIS OP, please, use your head a little, it is like saying that Freddy is the strongest killer when his KILL RATE is also around 60% and it is the worst killer in the game xDD when his play rate has probably dropped a lot.

Statistics are not everything, there are many factors that many players do not know, and you only think about stats, when possibly, for example, sadako has killed all 4 because one of them has committed suicide, and one of them does not know how to play against sadako yet, but I assure you that putting 4 half-good survivors, tell me if you are capable of making at least 6-8 hooks...

Yeah they do those good players actually have to play to be good isnt it?

Do you actually trust the Devs to put that amount of finesse into it?

I'm for everything except the God pallet thing. There's really no need.

To be fair to Trapper, he has to be simple enough to be a training wheels Killer also. I would say adjusting trap spawning to be open and touching loops would help him without altering him to be too mechanically difficult to learn.

Again, the kill/win rates have to be taken in context with the pickrates. A tiny cadre of specialists who are really good with a particular killer posting similar numbers to a much better killer with multitudes more users isn't a sign of the weaker killer's health.

I'd like to see a situation where you could choose any killer and at least a have loose approximation of the experience you'd get with any other killer.

Obvs you can't bring all killers into total line (especially not in a world there Nurse exists), but killer balance could be worlds better.

And yes, this might also mean kneecapping the entire S tier.

According to Peanits in a thread a day or two ago, all Killers have about the same pickrate iirc.

Well, I didn't recall correctly, so that explains that.

It's entirely possible to significantly buff killers and raise skill ceilings without making them oppressive at lower ranks, you can give them a more complex strategy required to win at high levels while making them simple to understand, something every professional game dev needs to know how to do.

The 3% figure is also misleading, sure you can assume 3% of the killer base plays that killer but every survivor they face encounters the issues that the killer brings. If you have a very unfun killer (like Skull Merchant according to most), you'll see very widespread complaints even if its just that one killer out of 30+.

Trapper being the poster boy doesn't warrant making him weak, again, killers can be designed to be simple to new players, and produce average results, yet still have an extremely high skill ceiling. A good example is Ghostface; as a 7k+ hour ghostface main, I can say his power is pretty straightforward mechanically speaking, but there's a ton of depth to doing well; you can theoretically beat any team through sheer foresight and cunning despite most of the community seeing him as a below average killer. You'd need a solid understanding of game theory (which will also separate the experienced players from the newer ones) to implement such a killer but it's your designers' job to understand how this works.

He was saying IF all killers had the same pick rate while discussing a hypothetical. He was most certainly not saying they did, and there's absolutely no way they actually do.

There are ways to address gen speeds without just throwing bigger numbers on them. Having meaningful regression/progression blocking potential, rubber banding gen progress speed vs survivors in play, secondary objectives, we need more creative changes than just throwing extra seconds on top. Like you said, just throwing a bigger number at gen charges only hurts low level play, which is why solutions need to address the potential (specifically) of high level play more than anything. That kinda goes for most imbalance in the game, the extremes need to be addressed rather than just blanket adjustments and bandaid fixes.

right. generators are an ok spot. it is killer power in relationship to how looping works that could be more improved but apparently weak killer do not exist and everyone has great kill-stats.

i don't think most pallets are meant to be mind game-able tho. There plenty of killers who force you to pre drop for one reason or another

@Peanits

"Something else that we need to consider are the players who already enjoy these Killers the way they are. Legion is a perfect example of this. There's no shortage of suggestions to rework The Legion's power to make them stronger. Yet in spite of this, The Legion is consistently one of the most played Killers. While they might not be the strongest in high end matches, there is still a large crowd who enjoy them as is. That raises the question, is it worth reworking a Killer that many people already love to play just to make the people who don't play them happy?"

you contradict yourself with the recent sadako "nerf"

you guys should stop focusing on data & analytic, on asymmetrical game that kind of method is not really effective..

maybe start with making a small team to actually looking into each killer weakness.

it doesn't really need to be super strong like nurse or blight, but make the killer at least can keep up with the current meta.

How weak are they in reality though? Killers already dominate solo queue, which is the majority of the playerbase. You can buff them to compete with high level SWF's but it will result in even more one-sided matches for players in solo queue. Imagine if Doctor and Wraith were as powerful as Blight, but with none of the work needed to play them well. Solo queue would be even worse, and it's already an awful way to play survivor.

I'd like to see buff's to weaker killers to add some variety to the killers I face, but I feel like solo queue needs more work first.

casuals are still important to the health of the game, they get alienated and the game dies. This coming from someone who also wants high level play to be better balanced.

That depends on how the balancing is done, which is why Its important to consider both high and low level when making changes, and not just ignoring either one. Other games also have features specifically for beginners/low level play, even street fighter 6 came with a simplified control option.

No. I want the game to be balanced in a way that doesn't screw over solo queue players. Buffing killers whilst solo queue is such a mess just makes solo queue even worse. I'm not sure why you think it's unfair for average Killers to struggle against SWF, but it's okay if solo queue (the majority of the playerbase) gets made even weaker. I personally think both situations suck.

Solo queue isn't weak just because the matchmaking prioritises speed over matching players appropriately or survivors rage quitting. There's just stuff that is inherently harder to deal with. Try breaking a 3 gen in solo with no communication, it's a miserable experience even after the gen regression nerfs.

SWF holds solo queue hostage, but there's no way to nerf SWF directly. All you can do is water down survivor tools or buff killers to compensate. But that screws over solo queue in it's current form. At no point should you harm the majority of players who already play the weakest role in the game just to harm SWF.

I think they need to keep improving the solo queue experience. That way they can buff average killers without making solo queue increasingly unplayable.