Unaliving on first hook should be bannable
There is no reason for this to still be allowed, it's just a way to circumvent the DC penalty, and doesn't even give your team a useless bot that won't do gens. This happens way too often, where a survivor doesn't like the way they go down, and simply suicides on hook instantly at 5 gens. This gives the other 3 survivors no chance to come back whatsoever.
Comments
-
The devs refuse to put in any measures to tell hookicides apart from legit kobe attempts/missed skill checks. they are unable to tell them apart internally.
6 -
How do you know people aren’t actually trying to 4%?
31 -
Because they don't hit skill checks on stage 2, and try the 4% as someone is running to them to unhook them.
6 -
they could just remove them entirely, it'd be a net positive for sure.
6 -
No
15 -
Give one argument for why they should still exist in the game, outside of being a loophole to get around DC penalty.
8 -
somebody likes his free out
10 -
I'm not dealing with any Skull Merchants. They can hold the game hostage all they went but don't force me to stay in the game and watch it unfold.
35 -
You can free youself out
9 -
No, survivors rely on teammates but can't choose them and have no comeback mechanic, if the game is lost early I want out.
Last game I killed myself on first hook was just today, none of my teammates touched a gen even for a split second (I watched the HUD closely). I was the only one who did a gen. By the time I was done, everyone else was dead on hook. Why force me to stay in a game where at 4 gens everyone's dead on next hook and taking killer aggro would be pointless because nobody would touch a gen?
Or, current example, the new Onryo. If my teammates don't understand new Onryo and somebody's moried out of the game at 5 gens and the others are close to being moriable, why play a lost game? I'm not remotely in high MMR, if one survivor dies before the last gen is finished in the vast majority of games the last gen will never pop and the killer gets his 4k. A 3 vs 1 at 5 gens? Nope, not playing.
It would be ok if bad games were rare, but there are way more bad games than good games, so a quick exit is necessary.
27 -
Luck build.
3 -
Remove DC penalties for DC's.
Add penalties for hook suicides.
15 -
You have an 11.5% chance to unhook yourself. That's about a 1/9 chance. It's very obvious when a player is doing it deliberately to circumvent the DC penalty. This entitlement needs to go. If you queue up for a game, expect to play the game. If you don't like how fast you went down, play better. Don't punish your team for it. And if you do something that results in the team being unable to play, you should receive a penalty.
2 -
If I had to quit playing in order to do an important job, I would commit suicide on a hook
3 -
Unless everyone is slugged or hooked, there is literally no reason to attempt a kobe. Only reasons i can think off are trolling and attempting to leave the match without the dc penalty. Luck builds also don´t count, as encountering those in the wild are as high as getting matched against Twins.
So why not just remove the whole self unhook and struggle mechanic? As it just promotes toxic gameplay. Since it ruins the match for everyone else.
1 -
While the DC penalties are still in place, and they do seem intent on keeping them, I'm not certain anything can be done.
There's also the part of lots of parks, add-ons, and challenges they'd have to change. That alone is more work than players realize. There's also the minor part of dedicated builds and playstyles around it.
2 -
Bc perks let you free yourself plus removing it would be a net negative, a lot of people would just leave the game
4 -
People would leave the game if suiciding on hook wasn't a thing? I haven't heard that one before. I sure didn't hear it for COH, Dead Hard, DS, medkits, now MFT... It seems like people will leave game for just about any reason.
2 -
I would agree with this so long as they also make slugging for the 4th not possible. No reason why I should have to have my time wasted on the ground just because the Killer is feeling themselves and wants 4 kills.. Especially when 3 kills is a win... Why do they need a 4th?
3 -
And make the problem even worse in the process. Bots aren't a substitute for real players.
How about instead of allowing free ways out of the match we actually hold players acountable for queueing up? I can only repeat myself but if you don't want to play the game, then don't play the game.
4 -
Bots are legitimately better teammates than 90% of players. If you lock people in games, they aren't going to play.
I would rather play with/against a bot than against the average DBD player. I might actually have some sort of a challenge.
10 -
My guess is it's because the actual problem is players who give up and not the mechanic of hook suicides itself. Trying to quantify when someone gives up would be a game of whack-a-mole that never ends. Telling a player's intentions based solely on their behavior is tricky and can lead to false positives as you go down the 'what should get a penalty' line of reasoning. DCs are the most cut and dry but even then they aren't 100%. I've DCed from several matches over the past 2 weeks - not because I intended to but because my internet decided to flake out for a min or 2.
Say they eliminated the self-unhook mechanic - now a player will just stand AFK.
Now they start flagging AFK players (what constitutes AFK - crows, no input - what if the killer won't leave and you can only stand still until they do). Players will lay something on their keyboard or lean their controller stick on something to perform meaningless, move forward inputs.
Now they start checking for uninterrupted movement inputs. How long does uninterrupted mean? The whole match? If the whole match, they can just pick the can up and put it back down once in the match. If not the whole match, how many false flags will that cause?
All the while, they 'fixed' the issue of self-unhook suicides but haven't actually done anything to solve the actual problem and have created collateral damage of removing a mechanic that had valid uses sometimes.
9 -
Every once in a while posts like this are made and every time I say the same thing:
- U should not be forced to be in a match u dont wanna be
- Now more than ever there are ways to take the game hostage (i.e. Skull Merchant 3 genin at 5 gens) and you should have a way out
- and most importantly in a 1v2 scenario you should be able to ######### on hook to give the other player a chance to find the hatch right away.
- The devs themselves already said they are not gonna force someone be in a match so u should just drop it
22 -
RE: #3, I had a funny moment in a match the other day. Given the situation - our hook states, how the match was going, my stubborn insistence on going for saves, etc. I'm pretty sure the Mikaela DC'd so I could have hatch.
The result? I got death hooked and robo-Mikaela got hatch. lol.
1 -
- Boot up PC/Console
- Start Steam
- Start DbD
- Choose Role - Character - Loadout
- Start looking for match
- Ready up for match
- See Offering Screen (dc without penalty)
- Match starts and it´s against "x"
- Disconnect and leave a bot behind
- Repeat steps 4 to 8 until you finally got that one match where it´s going to your favor.
Maybe introduce a morality/salt system which after a certain regularity of dcs will make you matchmake with quitters as well?
1 -
points 1-4: There is a DC button, use it if you refuse to play. Take your penalty for refusing to see the match through and let a bot take over.
6 -
And take the penalty? Why? ######### on hook is just a stage in the process of opting out of the game. I can do that by running directly to the killer or waiting in a corner.
like I said if someone wants out they’re gonna be out
7 -
Because you refuse to play out the match you agreed to by queuing up?
4 -
Why do you think the penalty was even put in place? Again, you are allowed to leave and the game doesnt even require pulling the plug or closing the process in task manager, there's a sanctioned way out... yet it comes with a penalty because it disrupts the game for other players. I dont understand why this community is so obsessed with taking their ball and leaving.
Post edited by EQWashu on1 -
Bruh u simply do not get it. Lets say we take away hookicides. What then? People will just run at the killer and be killed anyway.
the devs will go outta their way, waste time getting rid of the 4% mechanics and rework a bunch of stuff in game to prevent hookicides and still not get rid of the “problem”. This will stay as is and it should tbh. Y’all just need to understand and accept this fact.
6 -
which are against ToS, so they should be reported and punished accordingly. Hookicides are only allowed because the devs refuse to put in a way to tell them apart. The "problem" is entitlement, which there is no cure for, so all you can do is discourage it (hence the penalty.) I understand plenty, and this is literally the only game I ever see such vehement defense of abusing ways to refuse to play, let alone openly skirting a penalty for doing so.
1 -
Reported for what? Lmao not wanting to play? Don’t u think ir a lil entitled rn? Its just a game yet u want to FORCE people to play it for the full extent, like?? Get a grip bro.
Also dcs are in an all time high just fyi. The penalty shouldn’t even exist tbh, DBD does not even have a ranked system so
11 -
griefing/sandbagging are against the ToS, which are your stated fallbacks for if hookicides were removed. and for the last time, there is no forcing when there is a disconnect button. All there is is the consequences of your own actions.
3 -
u really have no understanding lmao ur gonna have mass reports and mass dcs this way creating a whole new problem. How is that less “bad” than hookicide? Lmao u will be one teammate short either way, at least!
as I said people will be out if they want out u dont see it but TG the Devs see it.
7 -
It’s very difficult to prove though which is why BHVR seldom enforces that rule. You just never really know in a game where toxicity is inborn when a person is intentionally griefing or sandbagging.
4 -
I've been thinking about it and I'm kind of torn now. Hook suicides do no one any favors. But if they are removed, can you imagine how people would play? They would straight up sandbag, go AFK, lead the killer to teammates, etc.
At the end of the day, the killer had to down them, carry them to a hook and hook them. Survivors may have gotten half a gen done by that time. At least it's something.
4 -
Exactly
Band-aids are not the solution
1 -
While I personally have no problem with letting go on hook there are a couple things that might help if you wonder on whether they are 4%ing or not.
1. They have more than 3 tries, means they are using perks to aid the 4%.
2. Often times they'll try twice if someone is nearby and then stop if it didn't work. I do this just to see if I can get it because I know I'll be saved before I reach 2nd stage anyway.
3. Some people just don't know not to do it if they are new.
2 -
I don't want to lose Blood Point
3 -
Because it happens 20 seconds into the match? Better question is, why is the stupid 4% mechanic even in the game to begin with? Its a dumb mechanic that makes it so a match can be entirely decided by RNG. Same with the struggle mechanic. Both should go IMO because they allow for this type of thing, and there isn't anything lost by having them removed.
Things like deliverance are fine because it isn't RNG based, but i think the entire luck mechanic should be reworked or removed, along with perks like slippery meat.
0 -
Right, so you are actively circumventing a mechanic to discourage you from quitting the game. Especially in a world where they just added bots to deal with that. They should ban people for doing this because if you really want out, you take the penalty like you deserve, because you ruined the game for all 4 other players because of that.
2 -
I am in a good match and help my team and in the middle of the match I had to leave it and at the same time I do not want to lose all the effort in that match so the best solution is suicide on the hook
So I get blood point that from a match and went to my business
Therefore, there is no fraud to exit the match and try to enter another match directly
3 -
It’s in the game so that if a survivor goes down 20 seconds into a match they have some chance of resolving the issue because 1.) It shouldn’t be up to other players (killers or survivors) whether you get to play the game or not & 2.) If there is a small chance you can escape death you may play with less abandon.
0 -
The mental gymnastics are strong. I'll break it down for you: you clicked "Ready", you queued up in a match with 4 other people, you load ingame, you made a commitment to play the game through. If you want to break that commitment, there is a deterrent in the form of a DC penalty. You can press escape, and click "Disconnect", and your team will be stuck with an underperforming bot, but it's something. You eat the penalty, your team has a bot, everyone is happy.
Now let's play that same scenario back but you throw and let killer down you for free, then you suicide on first hook. Your team is now playing with 3 players and you don't get a DC penalty. This is a way to circumvent the system already in place, and defending it shows insane levels of entitlement. You are not entitled to leave the game you committed to playing simply because you felt like it. Four other people are queued in the same game and expect to play it through, your time is not more important than theirs. It's simple: if you queue up for a game, either play it out, or DC and eat the penalty.
5 -
The first hook is not the problem; the second stage hook is.
There are perks survivors can use to free themselves with (notably Slippery Meat, Up the Ante and Deliverence). Some may use it to kill themselves, but the likelihood of putting a blanket ban on freeing themselves from the hook doesn't make any sense. If someone wants to kill themselves, then they will just go afk. Some people would choose those perks and want to use them to escape by themselves.
Therefore, more to annoy those weaker players who do want to disconnect, simply removing struggle skill-checks from the second hook would be a far better alternative.
Whatever happens, a survivor who wants to die without disconnecting will do it anyway, even if going afk or running towards the killer for a quick death. There's nothing that will outright stop this, but there are things that can be done to make this act far less enjoyable. When I'm killer and see a suicider, I just slug them and leave them to rot.
0 -
What they need to do is keep DC penalties but make the harshest punishments less harsh. No one should ever be banned for more than one hour. People might be more incentivized to DC if they weren't worried about absurd penalties stacking up. That and remove skill checks from stage 2.
0 -
Right, it's a game not marriage. If you change your mind, you don't need to hire a lawyer. There's already a feature in place that's called Disconnect where you can eat a penalty and leave the game instantly.
If a survivor isn't actively contributing to advancing the game (aka AFK at hook, AFK in a corner, chasing killer to get killed etc.) then that should be reportable as well. Let's toss it all under one umbrella and make the reports require video evidence. There you go, each case can be inspected individually.
"I should be able to leave any game I don't like penalty free with no regard for anyone else's time" This entitlement is unreal.
1 -
And if you’re playing killer, you know you’ve just hooked a survivor, they’re freed and run right at you then wait? Or you slug them, see them up again and they’re once again in your face wanting you to basically help them leave the match.
1 -
Then you are playing the wrong game or at least the wrong side. That is entirely what the killer and survivor dynamic is designed to be. Survivor tries to do X and killer tries to stop them by taking away their ability to do anything. That's just how the game is.
2 -
If it was bannable they'd probably have a really small player base. While throwing a match isn't kind, it happens unfortunately.
If they got rid of depipping it might make it a bit better.
Also if I spend over five minutes kiting the killer and no generators go off, they are also throwing the match, so...what do you do about that? Am I to get unhooked and do all that again just for nothing to get done? Works both ways really.
4
