Killers are going to slug
When 7.3.0 patch goes live, killer's only option are slugging the survivors. The new AHC mechanic is disgusting and SWF are already abusing it to the fullest. 2 floors are impossible to play on without being baited to the hooked survivor beneath or above you. When I play survivor, killers heavily slug me. The new meta is going to be all about anti-slug perks with a range of perk options to choose from like unbreakable, buckle up + FTP, soul guard, no mither, tenacity, etc.
This patch needs to be looked at ASAP. Both roles are going to play less in time without drastic changes made to the new patch, and this game will be losing fans and casuals alike out of complete boredom and unsatisfied results.
Comments
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Devs seem to be ok with slugging so I see no reason to not do it. If hook becomes a hassle then slugging 2-3 Survivors before hooking makes more sense
Rapid Brutality + STBFL + Infectious Fright/Ultimate Weapon + Knock Out for M1 Killers
There’s anti slug builds for Survivors so the meta can switch to that it the needed arises.
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Ok... and?
Let's say you're right and all killer's replace camping with slugging.
A This will make pick ups easier because the survivor can move.
B Their teammates have far longer to complete the gens because the bleedout timer is longer then the hook timer.
There are also more perks to deal with that. Unbrekable. Soul guard. flip flop. buckle up. Even if everything you said happens... this only seems to be an improvement?
The main complaint is the 2 floors and honestly that's fair and should be addressed. As for swf elaborate? This isn't like the old one, neither the killer no survivors can go near the hook. So please provide more details?
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If AHC means antifacecamp feature, then I disagree. I see no reason why hooking should not happen. If survivors swarm the hook, timer is so slow, that it basically does not work. If we are talking about hooking altogether, then this does not change anything at all. If we are talking about facecamper - that's intended mechanics which makes the game much more interactive. If we are talking about proxy campers - this mechanics does exactly nothing. I literally see no problem here.
As for the multiple floors problem - I said so in different post already. Nurse being on the different floor does not mean anything. For other killers it very much depends - say garden of joy camping bottom of stairs (which is super close to top-floor hook) most definitely is camping that is basically comparable to facecamp. Being on a different floor in Midwitch on M1 killer is like being on the other side of map.
But after thinking about it - say trapper has no reason to stay directly above/below hooked survivor for prolonged time if he's not chasing someone - so this shouldn't be any issue. But camping stairs (to basement or on GoJ but even in Thomson house) makes perfect sense for a killer - so given these interactions I would leave multi-level logic the way it is in PTB.
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I dont get why we're even removing camping. like sure fine Its unfun but its literally the easiest 3 out of your life. if every game just removed everything people found annoying like this then most games would suck. like imagine if valorant made it so only your first bullet could headshot so you couldnt crossmap snipe after spraying.
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The devs have explicitly stated on many occasions that they don't want to punish killers if survivors choose to loop next to hook. As part of the anti face camping feature, the bar progress slows down or stops completely if there are survivors in the area.
Feel free to tell devs that you think the existing reduction in self unhook progress for nearby survivors is insufficient and should be buffed. I think that's far more productive than baselessly claiming it will be impossible to so much as start your primary objective as Killer
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Its perfectly fine to slug, You can only do it for a short while though or Survivors can get up again in seconds.
If you feel like your only tool is slugging, you are lacking in other departments of Killer skills to use in a match.
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In My country community, most experts debate the scale of the disadvantages in proportion to the advantages of onhook survivors.
If you are a killer who reigns at the top, mass production of slugs may be realistic because you can nullify the perk that requires on-hook to be activated.
For other killers (Example: Wraith), it's useful as a strategy to temporarily try and gain an advantage in the battle, but it's not realistic to do it throughout the match, unless you're better than your opponent.
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The future you are waiting for. Closer than you think. At the moment, some of us are already starting to test games without hooks. The results are beyond all expectations. It’s been a long time since I saved so much time doing useless carrying to the hooks.
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Has nothing to do with anti facecamp tho, it's just knock out vs solo Q... it's not new
guess what will happen if many players start abusing knock out
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I agree the new anti-camp mechanic is flawed and doesn't seem realistic.
- The anti-camp timer starts right away the second I put you on the hook. - How is that camping? I'm doing a regular action and the second I do it it's considered "camping"?
- If you are on a different floor the timer still increases. - What if there's an objective below them that I need to do stuff like kicking Gen, or breaking pallets below someone are common and I get punished for doing different objectives other than camping because I'm under the hook?
- Ranged killers or killers who have powers that give them a shorter hit cooldown after using an m2 will still be able to effectively tunnel.
Expect more people to consider tunneling or slugging as a different option. Because at the moment the other two options aren't punishing me the second I decide to do it. The new mechanic is too simple and doesn't account for realistic standards like being under or above someone to do other objectives. Even starting the timer the second I hook isn't camping yet the game says it is.
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Even starting the timer the second I hook isn't camping yet the game says it is.
you are technically next to the hook. the camping system is cumulative system where if you camp near the hook for too long then the survivor get to unhook themselves. that is why is there is no restrictions. as long the bar does not fill from 99->100% then you do not get punished.
i am curious to see killer attempt to slug. judging from anyone who has ever attempt to play twins, it is not that easy to down all 4 players simultaneously when survivor team is competent. the only player that i have ever seen actively try to slug an entire team are alchemist ring blight's that often have crow or iri tag with infectious fright. other than that, I almost never face slugging killers. most of slugging situations are preventable or very easy to gen-rush.
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This means that many survivors need not feel threatened killer slugged all survivors.
When anyone seeing slugging as a threat, it means that person lacks the survivor skill.
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The game said you were (face) camping only when the bar gets full. Not a millisecond before. The meter just represents cumulative time spent next to hook. And even if you leave ASAP, survivor's time on hook is going down regardless. This is the same thing - progress bar has enough distance-seconds to accommodate for all legitimate basic actions you would ever need next to a hook (meaning both kicking gens and leaving the hook right after you hooked someone).
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It's an approach that hard-counters anti-facecamp, basekit BT, Dead Hard, OTR, Deliverance, Reassuarance.. and probably a couple others perks I can't think of right now.
Also what will happen? Will survivors drop a few chase and gen-perks, and No Mither meta finally arrives? Sounds fun.
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If you think this game need a knock out sluggin meta I don't know what to say, maybe community will finally kill this game for good after all, I see it getting worse and worse despite devs efforts
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Boon exponential new meta let’s goooo
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That will happen. But dont worry, BHVR is trying to maintain a 60% killrate for killers. With this change the killrate will drop down, and than killers will get a generall buff or survivors will be nerfed.
So killer who dont used this technic will benefit from it
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Do you remember when the HUD was gonna turn solo players into SWF?
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Even if I thought that, the meta does not form over random players thinking it should be this way or the other.
It follows changes. Nerf one approach enough and people will try other approaches. It's only natural.
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Please do abuse slugging. It'll just lead to another basekit change to prevent excessive slugging if killer mains are obnoxious enough about it.
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Because it's terrible for the person on hook? They don't get to do anything
And its only a 3 out if it's an experienced SWF, if there's even 1 that is new or unexperienced/throwing then it's gg
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I look forward to the slugging, its more fun for me in both roles. Good altruism will allow for more chances then hook play.
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TIME TO 4 PACK BOONS AGAIN LETS GOOOOOO!
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Already bored of the "well if I can't camp I will just have to slug" huff mentality.
Do it then, so what. Would much rather be on the ground with a chance of crawling away or being healed than being hooked with some drooling camper staring at me.
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The problem is that murderers are deprived of the right to choose. The rights that I want to remind you were guaranteed even when the game was created.
I have always followed the precepts of this wise man. After all, how else can I play with the people who send me to the Garden of Joy.
But these are all minor things. The main question is this. Who will we play slug on? We cannot avoid the update, so we must get together and create the most effective slug method. Doctor, Legion, Artist and Plague already at least look promising for the slug. You just need to be a little creative.
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You're literally begging for them to implement a basekit unbreakable...
I can see it now... All 4 survivors downed? or 3 downed and 1 hooked? Unbreakable can activate.
Also knockout will be nerfed SO fast.
Play the game not rely on broken perks/strats.
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Exactly! It's wild that they don't see the seeds they are trying to sow..
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If that happens, it doesn't matter.
Survivors will object to tactics based on the large difference in abilities between killers and survivors, and as a result, adding base kits will become popular, and adjustments that only require changes to some killers may be neglected. In that case, management will have to terminate DBD themselves.
I just watch that stupid scene from afar.
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Bubba facecamp got nerfed so Bubba pulls out Knock out from his arsenal.
Even in a team with comms, there will be some delay in communicating their downed location unless the team is very familiar with the map or using clock callouts.
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its only not a 3 out if the survivors dont have brains. they should know going for the save is a stupid idea for the most part (unless they are planning a trade to extend the camp) and just do gens. if they dont, thats not a soloQ issue thats a skill issue.
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I would suppose it just depends on gens left
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You know that if a survivor beats you to the hook, the meter will stop? So I don't understand your argument here.
Proxy camping is still viable as the meter's range is 16m from the hook. So it's not a big deal unless you liked to face camp with Bubba a lot.
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I wish you all 4 No Mither's all day.
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These are actually the most fun games I've ever had. I still remember that game fondly.
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How would be in another part of the building is the same as facecamping?
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I mean when you actually slug.
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Some main buildings have exactly 1 entrance to upper floor (that being stairs and killer having hook on upper floor). Any survivor that wants to rescue their fellow teammate literally have to touch killer that decides to camp at the bottom of the stairs.
It means you are technically not face camping if you are staying there instead of staying 1m away from hooked survivor. But what is practical difference between those 2? I literally see none. In both cases you need to let hooked survivor die or go within 1m of killer. Why would you not consider such a thing effectively face camping?
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Shouldn't fix for this be rework problematic area of the map?
Implementing flawed system should definitely not be the solution... That will simply do more damage than actual fixing.
Like really, how do you expect killer react when they get screwed by this system? Short term answer is to take frustration on that survivor, tunnel or bleed them out. Long term solution is stop playing.
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it almost feels like these exact issues were brought up before and everyone ignored them 🤔
we’ll see how this unfolds
im not changing how I play though the memes will never stop
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but is it that bad? I have to admit I didn't play this PTB so I don't really know specific implementation (but I saw videos and it looked fine on a first look - but sure I can be wrong).
But if you time it correctly and give some leeway for killer "to be allowed to camp for a short time" (which IMO is perfectly fine - securing hook stage and checking if survivors are hiding next to a hook is perfectly valid - problem is if killer facecamps for a full hook stage without ever leaving said survivor), then I see absolutely no problem with keeping everything the way it is (again - provided killer has enough time/leeway to be close to hook for any reason).
And to answer your last sentence - same way as survivors have to deal with getting facecamped by bubba to death. It really sucks, but you'll get over it (also as I said before - it should in practice have enough time-buffer to gently tell you, that you indeed facecamped)
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Basement is completely useless because of this for example, which is kinda big deal. You can't hook more than one survivor there, you can't defend it either.
Midwitch is going to be hell too.
This system basically remove a lot of snowball potencial for most killers. Even when survivors screw it and get downed next to hooked survivor, there is not much killer can do with it.
Only option killer is going to have is tunnel when this system triggers, because it removed a lot of pressure he had and tunnel is best way how to get it back.
Any survivor who used Deliverance knows how big deal this is.
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Didn’t this exact same scenario happen in the project W chapter with reassurance 🤔
guess they didn’t learn their lesson
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That's a perk, not base mechanic. It also doesn't work against basement.
Reassurance is basically Unbreakable level. Doesn't always work, but it's worth it when it does.
I don't really have issue with that perk.
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Well. Then you are right killer has too strict timing. But giving him more time should fix that IMO. Or did I miss something more? Usually it does not take 30+s to get to/from basement so I don't see anything wrong provided the timing is more liberal for killers
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It might be better to fix triggers than just increase time. You might get into situation, when it takes too long and I will just get there to face camp you into second stage easily and then tunnel you.
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I basically agree. But that's a lot trickier as it's hard to define those trigger conditions correctly. But I basically agree - if done right, that's also way to go
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I was talking about SWF abuse and through floor usage
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And to answer your last sentence -
There is always a specific player called as a commentator in the tournament, but Cannibal can completely disable the AFC system underground and instantly create tunnels with one time of chainsaw. Verified and proven by players.
The person laments why management failed to discover this level of truth before starting AFC.
AFC is not grasping the essence of the situation and is acting in a direction that is contrary to AFC's implementation objectives.
Either they are ignorant or they have no intention of abolishing FC.
If we really want to remove FC from the game as malicious harassment, we need to rebuild the current AFC from scratch.
FC should not be judged by distance and time from the hook.
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There are worse things SWF can do and still doesn't work on basement.
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i mean I don’t think I’ve ever heard anybody say that SWF COULDNT abuse mechanics in this game, except maybe sluz
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