Ultimate Weapon is an easy mode perk
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omg just realized yer PFP is Maurice! It was Jeff for awhile, tho. Haven’t ever seen anyone w Maurice n never knew that was an option, so awesome!😄
Yesss, UW is Ultra poorly designed. Haven’t played since August, so haven’t really experienced it, tho yesss, UW is Ultra poorly designed.
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My claim was correct, you just misunderstand... I didn't mean survivor perks that protect you from being auraread, but perks that enable your aura reading perks again... If you suffer from the blindness status effect your own aura reading perks don't work, and there is no perk that removes this effect, only one that makes it tick down faster...
The blindness status effect hurts solos more than swf because those guys are the ones that run aura perks like kindred and bond for example.
Those perks do nothing about the blindness, the entire time that was my only point... Blindness hurts the solos more than the swf.
Because usually when people are talking about genrushing all they mean is survivors doing gens, and that's just plain stupid.
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knowing where survivors are is only half the battle and it requires you to give up a perk slot that could be used for a chase perk or slowdown perk instead, I think its a fair compromise that tracking perks find survivors
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I dont understand why the blindnes is a problem for you when you also claim that is the weakest status effect in the game?
When i say genrusing in this matter i mean you have a full build ment to fix gens fast, i still dont see it as offensive.
Virgil can help you getting out of blindness faster.
But really everything in this game hurts SoloQ worse than swf, so i think thats a strange argument.
Being hooked as you only have 2 hooks where swf can "switch" and get up to 6 hooks and still be live (assuming they are 3 people).
Also SWFs are more likely to help their freinds than you should they have to choose. I have also been used as killer bait by SWFs, where they unhook me in the last second when the killer are in front of me, while they rush the gen, and then the killer ofc. goes for the quick kill.
Also the perk Residual Manifest do give the same blind effect to the killer for 30 secs, it works with both Flashlight and Blast Mine
Post edited by Unknown2765 on0 -
it is because his static blast has worse tracking than this perk. the thing about doc's tracking is suppose to come from madness effects. It is just that doctor's madness is currently very weak because static blast spreads madness very poorly and when you recover from madness 3, you go to madness 1 which has no status effects.
Restraint gives you illusion doctors to track position but these doctor will not show up if player is madness 1 and applying madness manually is pretty slow because he has no traversal map mobility.
Calm add-on gives illusion terror radius. this is very bad because it only works in chase in tier 2 for 6 second after chase ends and when it works constantly, it is in tier 3 in which you snap out. It is suppose make indirectly stealth killer where survivor doesn't know where your coming from but it fails terrible at that job.
Order Illusionary pallet are ok because they happen in the chase. Discipline gives red stain which is chase effect so that works
if he had global tr or bigger tr to spread madness better then calm/restraint effects would be active more through out trial though calm add-on status effect needs buff or something. maybe it makes skill-check harder or something the more time you snap out.
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Because UW is literally Static Blast but way stronger since it has a moving range for 30 seconds. That’s why it’s an overpowered perk, you get tracking which is better than Doctor’s, who is supposed to be good at finding survivors, and can put it on any killer including those who have strong chase powers.
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That’s a bug which was actually affecting all screaming perks, not just UW. I had it happen with Iron Maiden too. It seems random though, in most cases Calm Spirit still works correctly.
I’m not sure if that got fixed yet or not, but they did fix the issue with UW working in lockers.
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Ive had decent luck countering it with alert and metal countdowns when hearing teammates scream. Its good for locating survivors but doesnt make downing them in chase any easier.
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I think people only hate Ultimate Weapon because it makes itself obvious. You scream, killer finds you, downs you, you angrily shake your fist because you know Ultimate Weapon helped them do it. But if it was an aura perk like BBQ or Nowhere to Hide, you might not notice its existence at all so you don't think about it, and you don't hop online to make angry posts about it.
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WoO is a crutch because it gives info you can have easily but UW isn't because it gives very important information the killer doesn't have ? what kind of logic is that lol ?
If UW is fine because "the killer will find you anyway" how is WoO not fine because survivors know the loops anyway ? Also because chases aren't about "if" the survivor will get caught but "how long" does it take we might as well start the game with them on the hook, you know, just to speed the process up a bit.
Tracking and finding survivors is literally half of the killer's job, and UW reduces it to opening a locker and basically denies any stealth, so yes it's a problem.
And a perk that does half your objective for free is definitely more of a crutch than one which lets you know where your teammates dropped pallets.
Post edited by Annso_x on5 -
One perk is a manual on how to play the game, the other helps the killer to get into the next chase slightly quicker. Guess which one UW is.
The thing is, that survivors don't know the loops. That's exactly why WoO is a crutch. It bridges the skill gap of people that do know maps and people that don't. And when maps are such an issue because most of them are stacked to the point where pre dropping and the occasional visit to shack can easily delay most killers to get a hit for way longer than it should take to get the down, then that is a problem. One that will never be fixed, let's be honest. This discussion is about as old the game itself but nothing has changed in that regard.
A survivor can NEVER, under no circumstances, in no possible set up, in any timeline or different universe be equal to the killer when it comes to the chase! The moment that happens, is the exact moment the killer role becomes pointless. Survivors naturally have an advantage in their number. If the killer doesn't have the upper hand when these numbers are negated, then there is no possible way a killer should ever be able to perform even remotely ok. Especially not with SBMM. The killer will down you eventually, because that is how it has to be, when you want to achieve some kind of balance. The question is never, "if" the killer can get a down but "when" (which slowly seems to change and a problem on its own). And this is where WoO and UW come into the equation.
The killer will make their way across the map, open a locker and then have UW, which will activate when they get close enough to a survivor. But since survivors work on gens, the killer has a pretty good idea where they will find the survivors anyway. So they'll make their way to one out of the 7 gens and when they hear, that that gen has progress, they also know that someone was around that area before. Ultimate Weapon doesn't tell the killer which gen to go to but the direction the survivor is in. This can help when survivors try to hide around the gen or run early on. But the effect is only a decrease in time until the killer finds that survivor. The chase will happen, no matter, if the killer has UW or not. I don't know which game you have played up until now but in my games the bulk of the killer's work happens in their chases and the way they play around the map. Not finding a survivor. That is the bare minimum that a killer has to do. Why do you think info perks are a thing to begin with? So, that you can focus on what is actually your objective. I'm sure the pink Bunny Feng and Neon Nea as well as Gabriel and Ace with his golden tux care a loooot about stealth. That must be why survivors play so aggressive these days and don't try to avoid the killer. Hiding in plain sight.
WoO on the other hand will lead to things that otherwise wouldn't happen. When a survivor has no clue where to go and they run into a dead zone, then that is their mistake and they pay for it. When a survivor has WoO, that can't happen. It eliminates the potential for a survivor to make such a mistake and it also shows the survivor how to get to certain loops, which one is the shortest path and (this is the most scary) how much they actually have to work with. So they will be less likely to take any risks and instead play in the most boring and safe way possible. The same way comp players do. A whole lot of pre drops and a bit of good old fashioned Shift + W. A new player should always play distinctly different from a veteran player, just as a bad player should play different from a good player. WoO bridges that gap. That is why I refer to it as a crutch. The old version of WoO told you where your team mates had dropped pallets too. Yet, that one was too weak. Funny how that works, isn't it?
Post edited by Xernoton on5 -
it might be, so? istg if any killer perk gets nerfed before mft...
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I don't think it does anymore. Perhaps at some point it did cause of a bug, but I tried like a week or two ago in a custom bot match and nothing popped up.
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Bad argument, because that's all he has and he even has a big cooldown on his radial dischange.
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I never understood the widespread use of blindness debuffs. Blindness just further increases the effectiveness of SwF over soloQ targeting the very info perks that would pull the two survivor experiences closer to each other.
UW could use a more elaborate trigger (opening a locker? how is this even a thing for the effects that follow), and/or a more predictable presence that has some counterplay - and by counterplay i mean in-game agency and not picking "the correct" perks before facing it.
And drop the blindness from it, maybe replace with something else, idk more frequent / higher speed skillchecks, something that actually fits the theme of an oppressive presence of a killer approaching you.
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It is still the worst status effect, just compare to hindered, oblivious, incappacitated and so on... The reason it is still problem is that it can be easily and repeatedly applied to the entire team, therefore making all aura perks somewhat useless. What makes it also problematic is that you might accidentally run the killer into your teammate despite running bond for that not to happen, which once again does not happen if you are on coms.
The other status effects are stronger but not as easily applied, so despite blindless being the weakest one it can still hit pretty hard on certain perks, and such a thing somehow kills perk variety on both sides, because when every killer runs ultimate weapon survivors probably won't run aura perks as much because they don't get too much out of it and once again those perks help in soloq.
I don't think everything hurts them more, but there are for sure certain perks or powers that do more in particular.
I mean I will still do a 1 for 1 even in solo queue if it is necessary to keep 4 people in the game, and so should you, just because some people do stuff like that does not mean it is the optimal play to do, just shows you matchmaking is terrible and many people have know clue how to play the game.
Yes, I mentioned the perk already when it was about which perks give the blindness effect...
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You open a locker and it activates for 30 seconds. Everyone caught in the terror radius screams once, it goes on cooldown for 30 seconds after it's initial duration. So really your position is revealed once every 60 seconds if the killer is on the dot using it as much as possible.
.....It's really not the worst thing in the world to go against? Like getting found out once every 60 seconds is the least of my issues. I'd argue that UW is only strong against survivors who spend the whole match trying to avoid the killer as much as possible and to that I say...eh? I'd argue that UW real obnoxiousness comes from it's easy application of blindess, pair it with mindbreaker and you get incredibly long lasting blindess but that's about it. There's honestly so many worse things out there that you gotta deal with as survivor, screaming every minute or so ain't one of them and I don't see that perk much often anyway, maybe every 3-4 matches.
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Finding a survivor to start a chase is also something that need to learn.
Lethal pursuit helps new killers to start first chase early. And thats an entire perk. UW does almost same thing, with a “weak” side ability that deny over 20 survivor perks.
Overall, the only killers using this perk are high speed one like Wesker/Blight. They start a chase right after the scream. Just no react time. Trapper using this perk does not really matter beside Blindness.
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I agree. People act like it's an all-you-can-eat aura reading perk.
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Lethal Pursuer is a fix to a problem as old as the game itself. Spawns. Tell me, how do you know which direction to go to when you spawn in the middle of the map? Or when you find yourself on Haddonfield, where spawns are about as random as it gets? The game does not give the killer any extra time to find their first survivor, when it clearly messed up. When a killer loses the first gen before they can get into a chase just because they got unlucky, that is not something, that they can learn to circumvent. But it does leave them with a severe disadvantage, that the game does neither consider, nor compensate for. That's why Lethal Pursuer fixes a problem, that no amount of skill and knowledge could ever fix.
Blindness was never an issue before. And it definitely wasn't for a lack of ways to apply this status effect. Third Seal for example has been in this game for longer than most of us have played. Yet, it sucks. Because Blindness has only one single use. To deactivate WoO. What other aura perks do survivors commonly use? That's right, none.
Are we really going to nerf a perk, that is fine because the very strongest killers in the game are too good with it? Again? This has happened and if I recall correctly most of us agreed, that nerfing Awakened Awareness because Nurse was / is too strong was not a smart move. I guess it's also time to nerf Lethal Pursuer, BBQ, Pop, Pentimento, Nowhere To Hide, Discordance, Floods Of Rage, Pain Res etc. then?! Because all of these perks are much better when you use them on a killer that is already strong. Nevermind, that even STBFL, a perk that is widely considered a helping hand for weaker killers, is stronger on Spirit than it is on Trapper. The stronger the killer, the more use they can get out of each perk. It's called scaling.
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Blindless also removes the ability to see hooked or slugged survivors my man, which is why knock out and third seal are so annyoing to go against.
You do see bond or kindred from time to time, Windows of Opportunity came in the meta not that long ago...
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UW will get changed, eventually. The fact it only has a 30 second cool-down feels like an oversight.
I ran Calm Spirit and Distortion today. It is quite funny to see how reliant people have become on aura perks in modern DBD. Sometimes I would almost be right next to them and since their perk doesn't reveal me, they are completely oblivious.
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Can't believe Blindness is considered a problem now... All because of one perk that got popular on both sides.
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UW just need to activate inside the killer's terror radius the moment they open the locker, and thats it
the 30 seconds linger is too much
then they could reduce the cooldown
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It doesn't for hooked survivors. I'll let you in on a little secret. When there is a huge bubble on your screen and someone is hooked at the same time, then you can deduce that this is the hooked survivor's location. Blindness will not remove this bubble. You still know exactly where to go. Well, as long as you can be bothered to pay the least bit of attention and don't actually fall asleep. Oh and you'll need to remember that for the next few seconds while you play a thrilling game of "holding M1 and pressing Space every once in a while".
For slugging, you can make the argument that Blindness helps. That's true. But you know what's also true? You can keep track of the killer and you can see when someone goes down. So you still have a pretty good idea where the slugged survivor is. The only killers that can really capitalise on this are the same killers that dominate anyway. Because they need to traverse the map and down survivors quicker than they can get up. Again, this is a problem with the very strongest killers. A Myers will not suddenly teleport across the map, Blight rush to get near you and activate tier 3 in the process just so he can slug you.
I can't remember the last time I actually saw someone (other than myself) using Bond. Even Kindred isn't all that popular. WoO has slowly gained popularity since its buff all the way back in patch 5.3.0. One of the reasons it wasn't quite as popular is, that survivors only had 4 perk slots, one of which was used for BT, one for DH, one for DS and one for something else. Then, we headed into a healing meta, where looping didn't matter all that much either. Now we have a chase perk meta and WoO needly fits in there.
Third Seal has, as I said before, been in the game for way longer than most of us have played. It was never a good perk though. Because Blindness is not a big deal when survivors don't rely on aura vision, which they don't for the most part. You really see the difference when a player has WoO and when they don't due to Blindness. WoO does not serve its supposed purpose anymore. People that rely on it do not learn maps because there is simply no need to. But when this fails, they crumble. So Blindness is in a weird spot, where it is way too strong because it gives survivors a huge handicap in deactivating a crutch perk, that some can't play without, but it's also pretty weak because survivors can just as well play without it. A noob stomper if you will. Though, even some very experienced use it.
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But windows also serves as a solo queue perk becaue even players that know the map already don't know which tiles have been used already by a teammate so it help them keep track of where they can bring the killer... Which brings us back to my initial claim that blindness hurts solos more than swf, because if you have coms you don't need to see the aura your teammates can tell you which pallet they already used...
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However did people play without WoO, I wonder. Solo queue is not a new thing and neither are the issues that come with it. The old Windows of Opportunity did that too. You do not need permanent aura vision on your surroundings to know, which pallets have been dropped / destroyed. Even with a cooldown you can still look around and see where to go. But it wasn't used back then. Almost as if this was just a strawman to defend a crutch perk.
The game has never been balanced around SWFs. It will always be the hierarchy of SWF, then killer, then solo queue. And solo queue can perform perfectly fine still. Just as a full blown SWF on coms can easily lose to a Trapper with no perks, if they screw up big enough. Almost every single perk in the game either works better in a SWF (even WoO because SWFs use longer chase times more effectively and can communicate set ups) or is a bigger disadvantage for solo players. The same goes for every killer. Are we going to remove all perks, addons and offerings as well as all killers, so that solo queue and SWF can be equally strong?
The point is, you'd need to break / change the metric to achieve that. But this is not an option as it would also completely break the game's balance or mean we'd arbitrarily enforce a certain result.
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Or did people just find out that knowing exactly how far away a certain tile is can be quite usefull? Also I think a few content creators changed their mind about WoO not being useless and therefore they might have impacted the pickrate as well.
But the devs are working on closing the gap between solo and swf so we will see if it stays the way.
Windows basically does nothing for swf, they can call out everything over voice, same for perks like bond or kindred, so I don't agree on that part at all.
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you cant see hooked survivors with blindness
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And you want me to believe that this happened out of the blue? 5 years into this game's life cycle and 3 years into the perk's? Seems unlikely. Or like a convenient guess.
No matter how much work they put into it, the hierarchy will stay. The only thing they can do is bringing solo queue and SWF a bit closer together. But then they'd also have to deal with a new issue. The fact that SWFs have such a big advantage, that balancing killers around that, is a catastrophy waiting to happen.
You can. You still see that giant bubble in the distance. If that is not an indication, that something is going on over there, we are not talking about an issue with Blindness anymore but about an issue with the player, that can't identify very obvious clues.
The fact that you don't see the survivor themself makes little difference. How hard is it to remember the hooked survivor's location for a while?
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Another Distortion / WoO user complaining about a perk that is only really useful in a bunch of killers. Nothing new.
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In the end it is still mostly player skill, you can communicate as much as you want, if the individual players cannot last a bit in chase it is worthless...
You should just look back to the history of this game to see how bad people played like 2-3 years ago and how even worse they played even with literal infinites and what not... I totally think it could be just that.
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Then by that logic, WoO should have been the most used perk for years. Because it allowed (and still does) players to bridge quite a lot of the skill gap between good and bad players. But that wasn't the case. It would also mean, that as time goes on and players supposedly get better overall, WoO becomes more and more obsolete and its pick rate would drop. But that's not the case either.
Most people 2 years ago knew just as well how to play the game as they do know. Maybe even better because back then there weren't as many demands for base kit perks (people understood that not running a perk would mean they couldn't capitalise on it), but that is material for a different discussion.
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Exactly not, because they didn't realise it was good... That's the point... You are still missing the point... It is not a good perk because it shows you what you already can see, where certain map tiles are, it is a good perk because it shows you what pallets are still available, which you just cannot know from a distance.
I disagree on the second part as well, people were way worse 2 years ago xD
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UW is busted because it blinds you for a good while for no reason. When I see killers with UW they will slug.
That’s what I did with Pig. Blind Pig. UW, Knock Out, Septic/Call of Brine, and Sloppy. Combined with Face Mask.
Open a locker while crouched. Rise up and crouch as normal to activate TR. Survivors will scream. If you see multiple bubbles together while anyone is injured that means any heals they attempted got interrupted. With Septic they suffer from exhaustion/blindness. Taking away their speed perks right as I chase them. Septic works with Pig lowkey because she can control her TR.
Remove blindness and UW works just fine.
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Unpopular opinion: People can think for themselves and while content creators do have an impact, they don't create the meta. The recent Otzdarva video where he talks about "problematic" perks is a pretty good example for that. Many of us disagree with most of what said in this video and Otz is pretty much as influential as it gets when it comes to DBD because he has the biggest platform.
Pre 6.1.0 DH was not used so much because content creators constantly told everyone to use it but because it was ridiculously overpowered. It had literally no counterplay when used for distance. By now there are also some content creators, that suggest survivors run anti tunnel perks again because they aren't quite so bad as some would like you to think. Yet, no DSs or OTRs in most games. Almost as if people would run whatever the hell they want.
The complaints about MFT started the moment we saw the what it did. By that time there weren't even any videos about it yet. But people already knew how strong it was. Demi is another popular content creator, who plays with a lot of different niche builds, that are pretty powerful, when everything works perfectly and pretty bad when they fail. You will often find him claim that these builds are "broken" or "overpowered" but everyone understands that they are very situational and overall more fun than powerful.
It's pretty much impossible to tell, if players have really improved over the last 2 years. Personally, I think it's about the same as it has been before. Survivors make less stupid mistakes, not because they play overall better but because the game gives them way more information to tell when something might be the wrong choice. The game has changed quite a bit in that time and any comparison would require us to define 2 entirely different norms to even get an idea of how good players actually were at the time, which already affects the integrity of any results we could get. Basically, it is impossible to tell because this is not the exact same game it was 2 years ago, which means a 1 to 1 comparison would not work and any attempt to fix that would further falsify the results.
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I'll trade you Ultimate Weapon for Made For This any day.
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So the problem is blight. Got it
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It's not an easy mode perk, that's MFT.
People just don't like their agency interrupted.
When gens can't be completed as fast, then a nerf would be in order.
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Ultimate weapon is fine. Windows players need to learn to play without that perk. its become such a crutch that 30 second blindness throws them off badly.
Everytime i use UW and i chase after a windows player they are lost. They don't know where to run. I've never used windows and after 3500 hours i've learned the maps and where most of the pallets usually spawn. I feel like survivors nowdays are so used to having perks do everything for them so when they are taken away they just become lost.
If UW is easy mode perk then survivors have plenty of those. WOO, MFT id even throw resilience to the mix.
Let's talk about actual issues for once instead of nerfing killers all the time hm.
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Ultimate weapon is objectively worse than BBQ, lethal, or nowhere to hide.
Also doctor exists, is he a problem too?
The cooldown on ultimate weapon is already very long. You can use it once every 60 seconds (cooldown is 30 seconds, but it stays active for 30 before the cooldown ticks). If you are going to say its good at finding people early into the match, lethal is objectively a far better perk for that. And as i mentioned BBQ is better once the game gets rolling, and nowhere to hide is so much better at gen defense.
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meanwhile mft exists
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If you compare dbd to other online games you can easily see that people always get better at the the more time passes, look at Dota or Starcraft for example if you look at how bad even the top teams for example at TI played 5-6 years ago compared to now then you can easily imagine that across all players the same thing happened, and that is exactly my point here, people just were not that good to realise it (same with item choices in Dota for example)... Also I don't see how it is not the same game anymore? Because there were patches? Because new content got added? That would be the same for every game...
It is fairly easy to tell if people have improved... There more than enough gameplay videos from two years ago you can look and compare them to how the same people play these days, or look at old tournament videos... You can easily see whether or not the overall level has increased.
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You could see survivor's hook bubble across the map. But when you reach there with some turn, you may pass the hooked teammate, or they are at the other side of the wall .ect
Unable to see hooked teammates is a huge deal, you're supposed to deal with it at least 8 times a match. General direction is alot different than direct. A miss is as good as a mile. 5 extra sec to find them for each hook, means half a Gen time. A few extra sec can also cost the teammate another hook stage.
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I would let that fly, if DBD was still in its early days. But after 5 years people definitely know how the game works. This doesn't mean that players individually don't improve but overall nothing much changes in that regard. That's how I see it. Because not everyone keeps playing the game. Some players leave and some players come back / are lured into the fog.
To say that 2 years ago, we didn't understand the game enough to see, if perks were good or bad is outrageous. Just look for how long the second chance meta lasted. And when Mikaela was released with good ol' Circle of Balance everyone used that too. On the PTB we immediately saw that CoH was way too strong (healing was faster than the killer's hit cooldown). There are also perk and killer rankings from back then. And they changed gradually as the game changed not because they understood the game better.
Even competitive players go with the time and change their strategies. The one thing that might be comparable (the chase) was also impacted by many changes like 6.1.0's killer base kit buffs, map reworks, perk changes, killer buffs / nerfs and to a degree even survivor animations, if we look back far enough.
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Dota 2 is 11 years old in 2016, 4-5 years later people are still bad compared to today, and before that you even Dota 1 which is broadly the same game, and you think just because dbd is 7years old now that the people already knew everything a few years back? I don't think so...
I think Woo is the exception because most people just thought of it as an perk to get to know maps and not for the solo benefit...
So do all those changes change anything about how people played tiles? How they played 50 50s? About check spots and what not? Because I don't think so...
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in before people started huffing copium about how "balanced" UW is and how exhaustion perks are "unskilled and unearned"
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Meanwhile whispers. Either way boohoo one good info perk for killer and suddenly everyone has the pitchforks out
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in some maps its really hard
you probably don't play survivor
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