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Any chance we will be able to see our team mates perks in the pre-match lobby?
As somebody who mostly plays solo Q this feature is something I've been waiting for for the longest time, especially since the introduction of boon totem perks to the game. This is because for example if I want to run a build that plays around cleansing totems (Clairvoyance, Inner Strength, Counterforce and Overzealous, for example), I risk the chance of my team mates running boon totems perks and we literally counter each other.
This feature would be one step forward in the elimination of gaps between solo and swf that we have been looking for in the past years (HUD for survivor being updated, etc etc.) since it will help solo players be more syncronized with their builds. We will know who can be slugged without a problem because we already know they have Unbreakable, who we don't need to rush for a save because they have Deliverance, and so on. It would be a feature that would not make swf any stronger nor they could "abuse" and would put solo closer to their level and therefore get easier and more successful balance adjustments in the game.
As a final note... Please, I can see already comments coming such as "there is a chat for a reason". Remember that the chat is not a feature which all platforms have nor can use. Oh, and this is a feature already on DbD Mobile (1st picture below, 2nd picture is a picture I found that somebody edited to emulate how it could look on the core game version!)
Comments
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It would increase lobby dodging by other survivors. All self care gamers would be endlessly dodged. Meme build people would be dodged. You get the point.
It would be a nice touch, but I think the possible negatives would outweigh the positives.
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I see what you mean, but if the feature is already on Mobile (which I suppose have less players) and it seems to work for queue times and stuff, I don't see why it would be that much of a negative for core. I think they also stopped caring about longer queue times since the feature of hidden prestige was removed from the tests (I was one of those who got it, and got removed a few patches ago) even though other tested features are kept implemented.
In my opinion is very much needed and will make solo Q feel much smoother. At the very least it's worth a test!
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I think showing some perks might be nice but imagine how many dodges you are gonna get if you have to do a no mither challenge or a david adept if all perks are shown
Probably just show some perks that benefit a whole team like open handed
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They could test it like they did with hiding prestige. But I agree there is the potential for it causing more dodging.
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Imagine knowing a teammate has Deliverance and you can decide to intervene in their chase when they're inevitably the first survivor chased.
Camaraderie. Power Struggle. Those pesky heal perks that make 2 injured survivors fight over who heals who first...
Of course, this feature would have to be put off until after No Mither is reworked or until lobby dodging is not as feasible.
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Could be. I slapped in the totem perks because it's something that has happened in my games more really commonly, and I think that it can ruin many games. I'd just change my build if I saw somebody countering mine without a problem, but there is no way I can know that for now!
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Yes exactly. I agree and I can see why it could cause people to dodge, but I think that it would push more people to play team oriented and syncronize than cause people to dodge. Lobby dodging needs to be addressed as well but as a whole, for the health of the game and effectiveness of the MMR system!
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Adept David is gonna be near impossible
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I think the lobby dodging will fizzle out.
It will happen a lot at first until players realize
- "Bad" / meme perks are more common than they thought and will just have to work with/around them
- Cherry picking their teammates gets boring; eventually they'll have to settle
Players aren't going to start equipping "bad" perks now that the new system shows loadout. They have already been and actively are using them. Now, you get better forewarning and preparation. It's a plus.
That said, I do think that lobby dodging should have an accrued penalty system with slow decay, but it should be seconds into minutes into tens of minutes. Not like abandoning a match that goes from minutes to hours to days.
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I think the positives might outweigh the negatives. Solo queue needs all the help it can get, so it would likely be a net positive, even if dodging increased.
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I mean if the only concern of a feature that would help the game overall is the 0.00001% of the games that have an adept David on them... I think it would be worth it, I don't know.
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What if we went a step further and also made your team's loadouts visible during the trial via the pause/match menu?
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The perk needs to change. The devs said, years back, that No Mither was added as a Hard Mode perk.
- That Hard Mode also applies to the other survivors in their match.
- Sweaty players gravitate toward perks like pre-nerf Dead Hard and pre-nerf Made For This that make their match easier not harder.
Post edited by Nos37 on3 -
I don't see the problem! Clicking or moving your mouse/controller thingy on your team mates name on the pause/match menu could display their loadouts.
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I mean, why would anybody care? Whenever I have to play some ######### meme build or something I tend to tell my teammates and I have never been lobby dodges because of that...
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This would be an immense QOL for soloQ and I'm all for it.
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Survivor lobbies are usually fast, specially on SoloQ. I don't see a problem with this.
I really wish there were more info for SoloQ; starting with the possibility to see the perks of other survivors would be a nice thing.
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You could make it display on loading screen, then survivors can't really lobby dodge for this, unless they want to DC whenever you don't like something.
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The problem with my example of the totem builds would still persist tho ): that's what woke me up about this issue. Ever since the introduction of boon totems, it's a problem I have faced in my games and that could be solved if we knew prior to entering the match.
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This would be best. Show builds once the trial loads just as offerings can be brought up. Survs then wanting out deal with the DC penalties.
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You're missing the point of my example tho.
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Yeah, but this time make it so EVERYONE is involved in the test, not a certain group of players like that hidden prestige test they did 3 months ago (STILL no announcement about that prestige test btw...)
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But many other issues would be fixed and it would be way better than current version.
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But why not fix all of them from the source? Like I don't think it's that big of a deal to just make it in the lobby so everything can be fixed and everybody can play comfortably.
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Why would anybody care? Self care users are some of the most despised survivors on the game. You’re telling me people wouldn’t dodge?
Irrelevant that you don’t get dodged the few times you used a meme build. It would absolutely still happen.
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I mean maybe sometimes, but most likely not every single time... You will probably eventually find people who won't dodge, no matter what your build is, you could probably not run any perks and eventually people would not care. But as people mentioned before, the feature exists in mobile and people apparently don't have such issues there?
I think the vast amount of times it would not happen, and it is more than just a few times ^^ Let's go for a few hundred times ;)
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“You will probably eventually find people who won’t dodge”
Enough said. Lol
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Yeah because talking in absolutes about guesses is so much better than making an assumption and making it clear it is an assumption... Sure a way to go buddy.
Think about it from that perspective, assuming the mmr system is working properly, assuming you are in a really high mmr bracket and get matched with equally sweaty people with 10k hours each who all only care about escaping and nothing else, who only ever bring the strongest most busted stuff to matches, then you will probably have to wait quite some time until you won't get dodged anymore, but be in a normal bracket or matchmaking being as dysfunctional as it usually is most people you will encounter probably won't care at all, because they are tabbed out anyway and only tab in when the match starts or doing something else or whatever.
There are more than enough people in the game who don't really care about builds and what not you are bringing to the game and would not dodge, why even, they themselves probably also need to get this stuff done. Many people in the community are really helpfull with this and having a negative mindset that you would not want to add a feature just because you think everyone will only make the worst out of it is a great way to never change things, because everything could just turn into the worst possible case...
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Difference of MMR. The lobbies I’m in, self care would be dodged, as would other “non-meta” perk builds.
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The DbD community sometimes can be a ready-made joke. I lived to see people defend unhealthy perks/builds that can only affect negatively the others survivors.
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With how much crap survivors give killers for cherry picking lobbies, it would be hypocritical of them to then cherry pick teammates if this loadout preview were implemented.
In the long run, probelmatic perks that get dodged often like Self Care and No Mither will be more likely to be looked at by the devs.
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Tough luck, guess you just need to last second switch via the different loadouts, problem solved.
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Regardless of what you say on the forum people always look at the negatives and say no.
I say yes this should be added because it stops teammates doing stupid things in game when you know you could have saved them or saved time on going halfway to a hook when they had deliverance. There's always going to be toxic people and lobby dodgers. I for one could care less what others use. This would help with pipping and reduce the stress for it but after that it doesn't matter what others use. This is what I've wanted for months too and I'm surprised it's not already in the game yet.
If people still aren't happy as usual, give them the option to turn this on or off.
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It's supposed to be pushed as a team oriented game tho. Lobby dodging already happens with prestige (stupidly), items and even characters, so... At least now for real people will see who looks like a team oriented person and who wants to just be hiding and doing nothing at all. People don't want to play solo because it's too handicaped, this feature at least will allow you to see who is intending to play the game with your similar gameplay style and not force yourself to stay in a game with people you don't match at all. It will maybe push people to play more team oriented, which is supposed to be the idea of any game that has a team on it.
If you want to run self-care, spinechill, sole survivor and left behind props to you, but the price of that would be waiting for team mates that will want to endure you playing like that and not force others to play with you and waste their time. Add an amount of times you can dodge lobbies in 24 hours, or add the option to hide your perks, and that'd be sweet. It sucks that it almost feels like you're punished for being a team oriented person in solo Q now, because my team can not have a clue of my perks and see how they will help us as a whole.
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because it creates different issues.
You can't think only about how to fix current issues, when your solution creates other issues instead.
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It would eliminate any increasing in lobby shopping/dodging, which we all know is a serious problem we shouldn't increase. Or we could test out not having lobbies and see how that goes.
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The problem of syncronization opposed to SWF would still be there, and the possibility of even countering your team mate's perks with your own. I think that that should never be the case, and chances of this will probably increase more and more as the game goes further and more perks come out/get reworked.
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The positives far outweigh the negatives imo. More perk viability means more variety, more interaction between perks, more teamplay, helps bridge the gap between solo queue and SWF, etc.
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Exactly. Every team oriented game has tools to let to play around your team mates. It’s like in Overwatch or League you’d go blindly into the game without having the chance to pick a character (perks in the case of DbD) to play well around your team. If I see somebody running boons, let me have that info to change my build if I had cleansing totem perks selected. If they add this feature, any similar problem with future implemented mechanics will be solved to allow soloQers to have better synergy.
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I genuinely don't think it would be that much of an issue, the only build we'd see people dodge would be no one left behind + sole survivor and honestly, good ! Those perks should be reworked and the people using them usually deserve to be dodged.
(Also this wouldn't be a concern if we had a dodge penalty but I don't want to stray from the subject)
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Exactly. Those people don't plan on playing as a team anyway, so their team mates don't deserve to have a handicap on their team that willingly will do nothing to support the team. Makes sense I guess, no? They can wait until somebody with their same playstyle meets them.
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At that point, just split the survivor queue. Queue for Team or Last Man Standing. Just remove survivors' ability to see other survivors' auras or it will be a grief-fest.
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This issue could be solved by making the feature optional.
Another solution is making it so people who lobby dodge too much in a short spam of time can no longer see perks from their team mates in the lobby. Make this punishment ramp up in duration just like the dc penalty.
But to be perfectly honest its hard to feel sympathy for people running selfish or troll builds. This is a team game and most solo queue players are already struggling even without these kinds of builds on the team.
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Exactly. Or as simple as adding a penalty in queue times for dodging more than 3 lobbies in X minutes time, like a low priority queue time kind of thing I mean.
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Good for you if you don't care and you want to play around yourself, some others would very much like to play around their team mates since you're playing a team game and want others to know what perks you have and want to know theirs for the sake of coordination and synergy. They clearly don't mind the problem of dodging lobbies, since the test of hiding prestige has been removed from the tests even though it's well known it's the main reason why people dodge lobbies currently for either being too low or too high. A penalty for dodging too many lobbies in X time should be implemented for sure, but not adding a feature to improve team oriented gameplay just so people don't dodge those who want to just hide in a corner doesn't sound very smart.
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Resurrecting this thread rather than making a new thread. Had a conversation with @Archol123 the other day about survivor information, and as part of that conversation I got thinking about Survivor loadouts being visible in lobbies.
With regards to behaviours statement regarding how soloQ and SWFs can be brought in line, this was Mike's response
A: We always monitor the difference between survivor groups (SWF and solo) and our current stance is that lack of information is not the crux of the problem, but rather that friends work together by nature and solo survivors don't (as much). -Mike"
This got me thinking about this suggestion, and the main reason soloQ struggle to work together is they don't know what each other have.
Archol123 pointed out you can just ask in lobby, which is true if you're all on PC, but if you're cross platform, or on console, you can't... so given cross platform communication isn't really possible, this change strikes me as more important.
If I know what my team is taking, I can adapt accordingly to their play. I
- If I see a lack of information perks in the team, I can take Deliverance and Kindred, maybe even Open Handed to help my team out with info.
- If I see a player with Decisive Strike that I saved off hook run in behind me, I know to let them take a protection hit for me, instead of being confused and trying to take one for them. I can even be ready to run to blind with a flashlight to blind them while stunned so they don't get tunneled.
- If I see a team full of chase perks, I can take perks with strong healing like WMI or Botany Knowledge and maybe some gen based perks to focus on a different part of the game.
- If I see someone going for David adept, I know to try and get that person out at all costs. May take Sabotage and Breakout or something to prevent him being focused.
SoloQ can't work together well because we don't know what is in play to be able to work together.
To address some of the points in this thread about lobby shopping, 1 addition I feel would help is a low priority queue. If you dodge, you get placed in a low priority queue where other players regular go ahead of you to resolve matchmaking. Have a little message on the lobby search saying "low priority queue" to get the message across.
Not to mention the fact, that if you play with players who dodge, they're likely the type to pitch a fit and suicide on hook anyway.
So I feel the opposite of most here, I feel the benefits far outweigh the negatives.
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Seems about right, I would like to add two things though. First it would be good qol if you could also see the perks ingame, so you don't need to remember them, maybe when pressing escape or even always in the HUD?
And the second point is I find their statement really weird... Because how would they know? Lack of information is the main issue as you already pointed out, because the lack of information makes it harder to work together... I find it ridiculous that they just state this in this way... Because it just sounds like an assumption based on nothing... Because how would they know whether or not solos work together less effectively than swf, how would they know it is not the lack of information that makes them less efficient? To me this just sounds like a random statement that is supposed to blame the players for less success in the sense of if soloq players just played together more than there would be no gap, instead of taking accountability for the gap in information and being honest here: Sorry guys we know the information that can be available in swf is a huge benefit however our game code does not allow voice chat without major rewriting which would be way too time consuming, so the gap just has to stay we re sorry... (At least that is my assumption)
They could just be honest with us, because this statement without any reasoning for why they believe this seems ridiculous...
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