why do we use such stupid logic?
Survivors complain when they get tunnelled. They have no issues tunnelling gens though.
I see survivors always complaining about tunnelling but have absolutely no issues with just slamming the gens out and leaving.
Comments
-
14 -
There's no such thing as 'tunnelling gens'. Stop misusing terminology for false equivalence.
And what else are survivors supposed to do but gens?
33 -
I'm seeing the term "tunnelling gens" alot over the past week. Has a content creator released a new video?
35 -
It's a false equivalence. You can't queue up for the role of generator and have someone repair you out of the trial. We're officially out of DbD debate toopics if we're talking about tunneling gens.
31 -
That's not how that works. A lot of people are extremely quick to compare killers and survivors in either their actions or perks, but are even quicker to forget that both roles are different.
There is no such thing as tunneling gens. There is literally nothing else to do yet a killer can tunnel a survivor because they do have other choices. This is the difference in the roles. Survivors fo not have the ability to tunnel.
20 -
"tunneling gens" has to be the funniest thing i ever heard. If all 4 survivors hop on a gen and finishes it in 20 seconds do you really think the generator cares that it was taken out of the match quickly? lmao
22 -
So many reasons.
1: Presumption that survivors don't complain about the uber gen rush builds.
2: Survivors would generally love more to do. Buff boons and chests and survivors would be happy to do them.
3: Rushing gens can still result in a nasty 3 gen which means the killer has a chance. A hard tunnel on the killer side means the survivors have no chance but the game isn't that close to being finished.
4: A hard tunnel usually involves a proxy camp, which results in a guessing game. If the killer proxy camps the first hook and the survivors ignore it, survivors hefty advantage. If they rush in for the rescue thinking the killer left, killer advantage.
5: From day 1 survivors are likely to encounter tunneling killers. Survivors who can uber gen rush are rare and many players might never encounter them.
6: Doing a gen doesn't weaken the killer in any way. I've seen plenty of games where killers (sometimes me as killer, sometimes as survivor) comes back from just 1 gen remaining. It's not even that rare for the killer to turn games around. I can think of very few games where I've seen the survivors manage anything like that after a early tunnel.
7: It's a result of the healing nerf. When the healing nerfs where being discussed many survivors said 'this means I'll just stay injured on gens'. I'm generalizing here, but killers got what they wanted and things are playing out exactly as many people predicted.
8: While the survivors rushing through gens put the killer at a disadvantage, the killer still gets to play the game, just at a disadvantage. A hard tunneled survivor gets little gameplay and very little BP.
9: Unlike survivors, killers do have other strategies. Killers can spread pressure and there are perks to encourage not just going after one survivor. Survivors should do gens, rescue each other, and heal. Pretty much anything else is a waste of time.
10: Picking off the weakest link is annoying gameplay, especially in soloq. In soloq a survivor has no control over their teammates, watching one get downed, hooked, rescued, and immediately downed again means the game is lost, and some of the survivors might never even have engaged with the killer at that point.
11: The counter to tunneling is to gen rush. Killers say they tunnel because of the speed of gens, but if the survivor know the killer is tunneling the strategy is to just leave the survivor on the hook (w/ reassurance if they have it).
12: Survivors strategy is not actually to 'tunnel' gen if you are trying to carry over that term, the most effective strategy is to spread out and do as many gens as possible. 3 survivors tunneling a gen is a really bad idea outside of limited circumstances, which would be comparable to the killer strategy of tunneling a survivor. Even in a situation where there are 3 gens left and 4 survivors, the survivors should split up on either end of the 3 gens.
14 -
3 survivors wait for 1 teammate getting tunneled out first before doing Gen.
1 -
15 -
There’s 4 survivors. So whenever the killer chases 1 survivor guess what? The other 3 do gens. If 2 are on 1 gen guess what? It’s done in less than a 1 minute. Let alone 1 survivor in another gen. That’s 1 and a half gens per chase.
If survivors are competent enough to chase for 30 seconds that’s basically a gen. In the time it takes to pickup, hook, and walk back to the gen. Well over 40 seconds.
5 -
You compare tunneling with gen rushing.
The latter has no meaningful interaction with the killer. The former does.
2 -
@crogers271 nailed it.
However the simplest argument is, by hard tunneling a player out, you basically gave that player almost no chance to win, and you shut that player out from playing the game.
It's not a skill issue, cause Killers are supposed to have an advantage over individual survivors, so the tunneled survivor has a huge dusadvantage, and it is certainly not a fair fight. Even if they do manage to loop you for all 5 gens over their 3 lives, they still are very likely to lose, and the only solace the tunneled player can hope for is they survived long enough for everyone else to get out.
That's what makes it so hated.
7 -
Because generators aren't players. People can say that shouldn't matter for balance or whatever as much as they want but believe me when I say this makes even developers view the two as fundamentally different scenarios.
Post edited by oxygen on1 -
Never understood what "tunneling gens" means. Do you mean doing gens? You can just say that
Sometimes I see people argue that completing a gen before starting a new one is "tunneling" gens, and that's silly. A gen can regress from 99% to 0% but survivors can't kick each other to go back to fresh hook. If generators had "safe states" where it couldn't regress past a certain point (like they used to) then that might make sense (because the survivors objectives would be comparable to killers in that regard)
2 -
well you say thats the survivors objective do gens rush off hook right?
killer objective is to kill/hook. So whats the deal with tunneling a survivor its the killers objective to kill.
Most of the time I play nice dont really care about the win. But You body block gen rush Im going to tunnel.
You get unhooked bodyblock for the once that unhooked then run to the same gen and you expect the killer to just walk away hell no.
survivor mains want killers to play fair BUT what about you survivors play fair.
2 -
yea like when survivors aren't having fun when they getting camped/tunneled they can just let go on hook and go next where killers getting genrushed are stuck in match till survivors are done with all gens and t bagging at the exit gates.
0 -
what agency? watching them leave do I have to hit them to make them leave?
also tho who same they stay to let the killer hit them is bull I had them leave and I end up hitting the gate.
and yes I do expect the match to be over fairly quickly with a de pip from a match I had no control over.
0 -
that why I wish noed was basekit I mean when I play survivor I always check chest and do 2 to 3 totems if I find one and I still win some in solo,survivors need to do other things or have other objectives to win
killers main objective is killing or sacrifice survivors but to get there they need to find a survivor chase survivor hook survivor kick a gen that been worked on and find a new survivor to chase and hook
each survivor needs to be hooked 3 times where survivors only need to fix 5 gens and open 1 of the 2 exit gates
even tho as a solo survivor I don't get out every match and I not meant to just like killers should be getting 4k every match but survivor still the easy kick back role.
1 -
I can chase 1 at a time and after the first hook 3 gens are done so I'm stronger now with less gens but by time I find a new survivor chase and hook them all gens are done and gates are 99 so I end up camping at this point and either trade hook till someone dead or camping fails which happens more offend and they all get out and I don't bother going to the gate.
now that sound like fun?
2 -
What else are killers supposed to do but kill ? Gen rushing takes the killer out faster. Its fine though.
1 -
I mean I said this before but know one care but I do and what make me hate being tunneled/camped or being genrushed and getting 3 hook if I'm lucky is de pipping I can't tell how many time I been 1 pip away from grading up (still happen this season on both role) then I end up getting a lot BS matches I have 0 control over end up losing all pips I had
I mean what the point in grades and pipping to get more BP not an outfit or shards not even auric cells just BP
but I still get mad over losing my pips because it not easy to pip as survivor or killer when BS happens like camping/tunneling and genrusshing
maybe people don't care about pips but if I knew I wasn't going lose a pip when I get camping/tunneling or genrushed I wouldn't care about that lose and wouldn't take it out on the next match trying harder making the game less fun for others.
but that just me....
0 -
i think tunneling is worth complaining about because it’s just…. kinda stupid. and before you pull out a pitchfork, i play both sides 50/50.
as a killer your function is to make sacrifices and prevent gen progress. because gen progress gets the survivors closer to escaping. duhh.
when you’re obsessively tunneling one person just to make two hooks in the time it took the rest of the squad to crank out three gens, you’re just wasting your time and throwing the game lol. i’ve never seen a dedicated tunneler make more than two kills in a match and one of them is usually thanks to noed.
so while yeah, it sucks getting tunneled because as a survivor you can’t get any objectives done, it’s also just a bad way to play the game because you as a killer also aren’t getting your objectives done.
complaining about gen rushing is just complaining about survivors literally doing their objective. your main focus as a survivor is gens, you can’t escape without doing them, unless it becomes a hatch match. there’s no such thing as gen rushing. maybe you’re just bad at patrolling the gens and creating map pressure.
4 -
Survivors are allowed to play in any way they want, killers must only play in ways survivors find fun.
5 -
Isn't that the purpose of the game tho, to do gens and get out? Or did want the survivors to do NOTHING so you can get an easy 4k and complain about nothing.
0 -
Talking about logic. Hahahahaha.
1 -
Survivors have more than gens as objective, we have to safe hook rescue, evade the killer, all while trying to escape. Most of the time survivors play extremely fair and we still get tunneled or camped. I can't speak for other survivors that bully the killer. But bodyblock shouldn't be considered a bad thing if helping a teammate.
0 -
I mean there quite literally is tunneling gens by leaving people to die and ONLY doing gens. Since tunneling comes from "tunnel vision" which that fits EXACTLY with slamming gens.
2 -
Drop a guy on the hook and go for someone else. You don't need to tunnel, but survivors do need to do gens.
That's hardly the killer's problem though, is it? If they never go for unhooks, you are going to have a VERY easy game.
2 -
You have a good 60 seconds that the survivor can sit on the hook per health state (and reassurance can increase this time as well.) Gens before Friends can absolutely be the better move for survivors, especially if the gen they're doing breaks up a 3 gen. The idea is to get to the hook toward the end of the stage, instead of right away. I get your logic, but its not always applicable.
This is also one of the situations where people complain about proxy camping, because the killer goes back to the hook to confirm the hook stage instead of letting them wait until the last minute to make the save. It can be punished as well as rewarded so it's a risky strat (especially in solo queue.)
2 -
Tunneling is actual proof that DBD is survivor sided. I play both sides, and noticed something.
As survivor we have influence over everything, but tunneling. It’s the killer’s choice. Killers can chase anyone for as long as they want, and survivors have no control.
As killer our perks/powers can be heavily countered by survivor perks, and comms. Totems last as long as survivors want. Gens get slammed whenever survivors want.
That’s why survivors hate Ultimate Weapon. Saying Ultimate Weapon is strong like claiming Infectious Fright, or Rancor is strong. Sure, it makes killers like Wesker; However, high mobility killers are always mega powerful. So it’s a moot point. Again, the killer has full control over WHEN to activate Ultimate Weapon. It’s something survivor mains cannot counter, or exploit. a “problem”.
Killers can NEVER have control over all 4 survivors, but the 1 we chase at a given time. In that time all the other survivors do is gens, right?? Which can all be done in less than a minute with 4 survivors alive.
The smartest thing a killer can do is chase 1 survivor at a time as quick as they can until they’re completely dead. Basic killers cannot achieve this without the busted add ons that can shorten a chase for them below 30 seconds…
Post edited by WaveyTrey on3 -
Part 2:
Successfully tunneling someone forces other survivors to stop doing gens... They know that the less of them there are to distract a killer the odds of them all escaping declines. Through tunneling survivors aren’t doing gens, and it is not because the survivors decided! The Killer decides that moment they focus on a single player.
The devs cannot fix tunneling because there is nothing wrong with it. When the survivor learns to runs well enough against a killer tunneling will not work at all. The killer wastes all their time!
As killer you have to learn when/who to tunnel.
As survivor you must learn how to deal with tunneling when it happens to you, or someone else!
I played 14 Knight matches last night. 4 matches I didn’t tunnel. I won 2, and lost 2. When I lost survivors bragged a little.
So I decided to gauge, and deduce who was best at running me at the start of a trial. Chase (Tunnel) their weakest runners out the match. Saving their best runners for last.
Guess what? I won 10 matches in a row! Even with all the survivors coordinating, and abusing their perks. 1 match of which the SWF all quit. As I got them all injured and downed in the process of focusing on their weakest runner!
5 -
Lol TUNNELING GENS I've seen it all now.
3 -
I love getting tunneled just means were getting 3 people out since the killer cant spread pressure im going to comp drop on them till they learn they picked the wrong one.
A good killer has control over multiple survivors at the same time. Hence map control.
1 -
Exactly. If you know how to run the killer tunneling doesn’t matter!
2 -
Because at the end of the day there isn't too much variety to how you play.
Both are tunnelling something and that's how it is unless the devs decide to switch up the gameplay loop.
0 -
That's a bad narrative to paint in saying the player never played the game?As they did play the game the just didn't win.
Every player and trial are different?Whatever happens to that survivor in the trial can still be considered play time as it still counts in the game hours you mass overtime 🫤
0 -
You ever play tag at school and have the person who was "it" only ever chase their crush and nobody else?
2 -
Everything is correct except the devs revert all healing back to original except Boon of Healing. This was done quietly and I think 4 or 5 updates ago.
The only time I am "gen tunneled" is when zlI am concentrated on a daily challenge and lose what I am doing. Mainly the Gunslinger and bird lady. Other than that patrolling is the main thing. I have killers hardcore tunnel and slug at 5 or 4 gens and they blame me for not running gen rushing perks, really though why is it my fault I didn't play the game the way you wanted it to go? I really question the mentality of what's left of the player base at times and a long break is maybe what is needed.
0 -
"There's nothing wrong with tunnelling!"
*Proceeds to brag about getting a 100% winrate when tunnelling*
5 -
Except what usually happens is that a killer will tunnel their way into a higher MMR bracket and suddenly tunnelling doesn't work. They then come here and demand nerfs to survivors/perks so they can better compete at a level they shouldn't even be at. At some point, presumably, that killer should learn to play the game and accept that the better player *should* win. In a perfect world that would be the case. I don't care if I get tunnelled. So be it. But some people's inability to accept an occasional loss seems to increasingly become everyone else's problem since update 6.1.
5 -
Everything is correct except the devs revert all healing back to original except Boon of Healing. This was done quietly and I think 4 or 5 updates ago.Unless I missed something, if we're talking about the healing nerfs that actually went 'live', we haven't had any changes since the nerf went into effect. Those were medkits and circle of healing. They had experimented with slowing down team healing as well in the PTB, but they thankfully walked that back.
Both of those changes are substantial though, especially circle of healing. Survivors, sometimes foolishly, would run across the map for a self-heal. This gave the killer massive slowdown, but from the killer perspective it looked like free heals.
I actually support both changes, medkits were way too powerful and circle of healing broke team interaction, but it had a substantial shift in how survivors play.
1
