Returning back to No Kick / No Gen Regression meta.
Seriously, 8 regression events. It must be a joke, right?
So now perks like Surge or any other gen regression perk that can eat up these regression events without you wanting to means you may end up with generators that suddenly can't be regressed at all because survivors were either to reckless and ''drained'' those events by getting downed ( what Surge will do ) or perks like Pain Ress hitting the same gen over and and over so gen with relatively low progression will get events spent regardless.
Gen kick perks other than Pop are now bad and gen kicking is bad in general because you spend one of those 8 events for 5% regression which is reverted by survivor in 4 seconds once you leave the said gen. Before people say something like - I rarely get a game where I need to kick a gen 8 times or something, - guess what, now you will wish you had these kind of games more often because killers will now concentrate on tunneling one player out asap since gen regression gets limited.
All BHVR had to do is introduce this system when there are only 3 gens left on the map. Instead they now say - if you want to make a gen regress - make sure it does regress massively or don't touch it at all. Guess what is the best regression method in the game already? That's right - tunnel a player out. Once there are less players, this limitation suddenly doesn't feel so restricting anymore.
Mark my words - we will return to a meta where gen regression is either not effective or not possible at all. Games will be all about chase and people will simply tunnel the first target they down asap. You wanted one problem fixed - you ended up introduced few new ones.
Comments
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8 regression events per gen.
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Those 8 regression events are easy to spend if you use certain perks or there is a hot gen that needs defending. 5% regression per kick means nothing and once survivors figure out they can't just mindlessly one tap gens, you won't be able able to defend such gens at all.
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its not as bad as your brain is making it out to be.
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Sure thing mate. Keep saying everything is fine and shiny.
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Okay if we are going with perks. We wont even kick the gen, just perks. You get surge 8 times. That is 64% progress you broke on the gen plus whatever you got from the regression. that is literally 64% of pain res's full effect on one gen and the perk still can be used on the other ones. In addition you had 8 downs with basic attacks. If you dont win that game I am shocked. Eruption is kinda rough because you get 2 hits per trigger, one from the hit and one from the down but you still have 60%. The only other regression perks that effect this are Pain Res, which increases the amount anyway, and Pop which doesnt take up more than just a hit. You are not going to hit this event almost ever even with a bunch of regression perks because the game will be over one way or another before this happens.
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Gen tapping won't work anymore. They'd need to spend at least 4.5 seconds repairing the gen to make it stop regressing.
We'll see how it goes once the PTB is there but I don't think 8 regression events will be too bad. That's more than enough in most cases. I mean, how do you get 8 regression events on a single gen full, if not in a 3 gen? Without winning anyway that is.
Tunneling is already an issue. This will hardly have any impact on the whole situation. The only thing I can kind of agree on with you is that Nowhere To Hide and Trail of Torment as well as other (weak) gen kick perks get passive nerfs thanks to this, which is not necessary but not a big problem either because once again, you hardly ever damage the same gen 8 times.
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You can't mindlessly tap gens as a survivor, you need to commit for 5 seconds, so no more mid-chase tapping.
That means you won't need to kick gens as much.
Also 8 procs per gen is huge. You don't kick gens 8 times, and 8 procs of Surge is 80% of the gen. It's also been confirmed that only regression events of more than 2.5% count, so if you have a gen at 10% progress and it gens hit with back to back Surges, only one regression event will count against it.
You also shouldn't be running Surge with any other gen kick perks, they don't synergise.
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The change will impact games where you as a killer actually Need To Defend Gens by any means, which can happen if survivors were smart and did play efficiently, which in result means you will have a situation where you have 2 or more gens in close proximity being above 50%. You will now find yourself hitting those gens or just let them go, especially if you decide to play without very strong gen regression perks ( pop will now become a solid meta once again ) because survivors will simply know that they can keep those gens constantly at high progression rate and force you drain those events, thus eventually getting a free gen that can't be regressed at all.
The biggest problem I already see here is that devs now reward survivors for fixing absolutely ANY gen they can get asap. There's no need to worry that you've repaired gens at far corners of the map, in fact, survivors will now prioritize such gens instead knowing that gens that are closer and in the middle of the map will simply have these ''events'' burnt up eventually and killer will have no choice but resort to tunneling survivor out because the 3 gen that survivor created can't be defended at all.
This change is wrongly introduced and will only lead to promoting less healthy playstyles for both sides.
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News flash for you- killers already tunnel like their lives depend on it.
You gotta do better than that.
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people will simply tunnel the first target they down asap.
But this is already happening. It won't change because of regression events.
Only DS can fix this situation.
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Regression events can happen super fast. Prime example.
https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/s/kOOkEYxO5X
In about 30 seconds, nearly half of my charges would be eaten up AND if I was using any kick perks such as Nowhere To Hide, I have that many times less that I could use them.
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It's only the matter of time before survivors realize they can't gen tap. Once they do, they will simply ''counter'' the regression properly by repairing the said gen when killer is away and it's safe. 5% regression won't do much on it's own. As killer now you must either do a massive regression or end up doing the miniscule 5% and end up with a gen that is immune to regression entirely.
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Even with a bunch of gen perks you should very rarely get past 7 events per gen.
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Yes they do. Now we officially can give them a valid excuse to do so on top of that. Well done!
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Survivors are going to counter regression by... repairing generators sensibly...
Oh the horror.
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If you are managing to kick a single gen 8 times, that's on you.
Stop holding 3-gens from the start lol
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You do realize that the entire 3 gen situation was caused by either bad survivor play or bad gen spawn that devs didn't manage to fix? What does this solution do? Right - punish killers. Think a bit next time before you post.
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Yet that's what they will be doing when they get 3 genned again. Oh the irony.
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tell me youre joking on this one. My dude. You used up 3 hits on the middle gen sure. no explosions elsewhere. but you got three downs and you think you would be concerned that that middle gen only has 5 more hits. Like that game is essentially over AND you got 24% regression on the gen. and dont say this is just an example because this is the only example sans eruption+ Pain Res+ surge that you would get 3 events this quickly. Its means multiple downs making the need for that defense much less and you will still have plenty
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My effectiveness in the match has absolutely nothing to do with the point. The point is that 8 charges can get eaten up incredibly fast.
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Charges halfway used up in seconds.
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No it does because yes you lost 3/8 of the gen kicks available by getting 3 downs. The only gen regression event perks either require a down or a hook. So getting 3 back to back to back mean that you have either downed several people or are running multiple perks and just took like 50% off a gen, without which the gen would most likely have been completed. This type of event will not happen enough times to the same gen in a single match because of the nature of the events.
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And I am here thinking 8 is too much
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Killers have been tunneling people out at 5 gens for awhile now. This isn’t going to “cause” people to do stuff they’ve already been doing. 😆
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Leave Eruption out and you should be fine. Pair Eruption with Surge and these 8 events could fast vanish.
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But perks like eruption are more heavily nerfed, because eruption triggers an event twice. Once for the kick, and once again for the explosion. So now eruption can be at most used 4 times per gen. Which is starting to get very limiting.
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with 3 people down, why even caring for regression? youre just hurting yourself with those "arguments".
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Some people still don't understand that once those 8 events used, they get a generator that can't be regressed AT ALL. That's right - a free gen that can't be defended by the killer.
They think that killers won't be kicking the same gen 8 times and while that could be a case sometimes, gen regression perks will pretty much do that for the killer one way or another.
The entire mechanic can be exploited by survivors in numerous ways. Give it a time and you will see that.
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As it should.
Stop holding 3-gens from the start of the match. That's the ONLY way you're damaging a single gen EIGHT separate times bud.
You do realize that it's not a sign of skill to run 4 gen regression perks and sit in a 3-gen.
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Little bit deserved for Eruption, but I agree, it needs a new effect entirely.
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Similar to Surge, if you're getting four invidual downs while defending one single generator, you probably don't need to worry about gen defence. For one, you've already defended it well enough if you've kicked it 4 times and scored 4 downs, and regressed it by 60%, in the time the survivors have been trying to repair that one generator. But additionally you've probably scored 4 hooks and possibly eliminated someone already, and if not, you have 4 more gens to go.
I'm not a big fan of Eruption, but when I was using it, I was lucky to get 2 successful procs of it off per gen.
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Why you are so fixated by the idea that killer is holding a 3 gen from the start?
You do realize that this mechanic triggers from start and doesn't take consideration of all other scenarios that cause 3 gen. It just makes sure that 3 gen can't happen at all at the cost of killer's gen defense potential and does reward survivors for doing gens asap.
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Okay so for you to lose all the stacks of eruption you would need 4 events which means that you took 60% from that one gen still have it on all the other ones possibly have survivors scream and show auras for 48 seconds AND got 4 downs. Which again generally means youre either winning or some shenanigans are going on.
Surge with Eruption I can almost guarantee will only count as one event, because they happen simultaneously, and a good example is you only see one explosion only hear one scream. But even if they dont that is still 61% you have taken from the one gen not counting anything else done by those perks or regression. A good way too see how strong that is is realizing that its out performing 2 pain res hooks on 3 any person downs before you hook them. Again it shouldnt effect your gameplay if that happens, unless you were focused on the 3 gen from the start.
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Sure, lets punish killer more for using a perk and getting any benefit from it more and more.
Again, if I decide to get a benefit from Surge by putting pressure on weak link and getting it downed more often I end up punished for it. Very smart and productive change.
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How are you punished when you've regressed a gen 80% and basically won the game already with your 8 hooks?
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yeah, 4 downs if you are hard tunneling or camping, sure then the game is over. But if you try to play slightly nice, what happens. Again this continues to force killers to play in the scummiest ways possible because the gens simply go too fast when you don't play that way.
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Less regression is a good thing. The actual regression meta is the worst thing that happened in years. But if you look closely at the changes, you got even more value out of regression, which is the exactly wrong way.
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What makes you think that regression is applied on the same gen when it's like at 99% of total progression rate? A gen can be at 10% or so and still get continuously regressed, thus getting events used without not being really regressed much? The fact that you can get a gen that can't be regressed at all means you as survivor don't need to worry that much of gen being regressed so much because at some point you will simply get a freebie.
Simply speaking your choice of generator repairing as survivor is no longer relevant. You will get that particular gen either done or enter the ''no-regression penalty'' state regardless which is still a win-win for you. There's literally no downside.
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If a gen is at less than 2.5%, then it won't cost regression events.
You can down survivors 50 times, but unless a gen has more than 2.5% progress, Surge won't have spent a single one of your eight regression events on them.
Simply speaking your choice of generator repairing as survivor is no longer relevant. You will get that particular gen either done or enter the ''no-regression penalty'' state regardless which is still a win-win for you. There's literally no downside.
Or you'll be dead. That downside still exists, and if it's taking you 5 minutes to repair a single gen that's fairly likely.
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Less regression means less ways of defending gen. You push one side to what is more reliable now - tunneling someone out. If this game is about having fun, then devs are effectively keep killing.
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Its not even that its you took away 60% or 54 seconds of time from the survivors on a single gen and achieved 4 downs. This is in a vacuum, I am assuming youre playing the game meaning you are most likely kicking other gens or chasing survivors or survivors are not focused on other gens because at bare minimum 2 survivors have been working on this one for at least 4.5 seconds in between hooks to stop the regression so you can kick it again. I am thinking about the game as a whole and in the proposed scenario where this would end up happening you are either winning/doing very well or you have been hard focused on a singular gen the entire game which is what they are trying to get rid of. In addition I am trying to show that you got insane value out of the perk on just that one gen. Like if youre wanting to think of it as a nerf, sure whatever, but I would be hard pressed to find a game where eruption went off 5 times on a single gen.
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Gens will be at 10 - 20% progression on average if you are playing against slightly competent survivors or those who don't waste time. Be sure that uncontrollable regression caused by certain perks will now punish killers while survivors are no longer punished by regression at all since now they are progressing to a non-regression-able gen state.
Simply speaking - all gens now have 2 progression states. First progression is standard and involves gen being repaired from 0% to 100%. The new progression state is 8 regression event tokens. Now if you can't repair a gen for any reason, you will simply make it become unregress-able which means killer won't be able to defend it all, thus it can be repaired once killer leaves the area.
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If a gen has 10-20% progress each time you down someone with Surge, then you've regressed it by 80%, and probably eliminated a survivor, and the survivors attempting to repair it have probably ragequit in protest.
We can keep going around and around this...
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"It needs a new effect entirely"
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You should not be able to hold a 3-gen indefinitely.
You should need to advance the game. Simply continuing to kick 3 gens isn't progressing the game.
Eight events is a LOT. If you can't manage a single down in that time, that's on you.
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I wonder why this rule isn’t made so that it kicks in when there’s one generator left? It’s odd that it’s being implemented from the start of the match.
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Not because it's current effect was bad, but because in new meta it will be even worse.
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Cool, promote a game progression. Just so you know, tunneling someone asap is also a game progression. In this upcoming meta, it will be even more important and more beneficial. Now ask yourself who will be suffering the most from it.
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It's not a superb effect to begin with but yes, that's how meta shifts work. Things become worse.
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It's still the same 10 - 20% regress on a same gen like before, but now at the cost of event tokens. It's nowhere 80% regress as you speak about because now survivor got a progress towards event token.
Games where you slaughter people at 5 gens are still the same. Doesn't matter how you change stuff there. This change impacts close or even games instead.
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