Solo queue won't get better until busted matchmaking is fixed
Solo queue survivor and killer player here. I am constantly getting matched with brand new survivors in my solo queue matches. I'm talking people with less than 100 hours on a regular basis. I have over 2,000 hours in the game. Why TF am I getting matched with brand new players?
I know that one reason is the "backfill" where if someone leaves a lobby, the matchmaking system will grab someone waiting regardless of their MMR score. That is incredibly unfair to the person getting thrown into a match with people way outside their skills level and it makes the game miserable for experienced players.
I don't think this is ever going to get fixed and I have lost all hope that solo queue is going to improve. When experienced solo queue players of relatively equal skill are matched together, they have a very good chance to win - at least that is my experience. But that almost never happens because of the busted matchmaking system.
The only fix for solo queue is fixing the matchmaking, and the only fix for matchmaking is for BHVR to modify the system to ensure that if you are an experienced player you cannot be matched with new players. I don't believe the devs are willing to do that, and because of that, solo queue will remain in its miserable state for eternity.
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The only thing I don't like about the mmr - is when I have in my team: 2 completely new players, and 1 6k hours "sweat lord" mixed with "average" skill killer. The matches like that are always a… Circus…
Mandy said it's happening when players dodging lobbies.
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So, if @Grigerbest is right about what Mandy has said, one easy solution is to make it harder to dodge lobbies. Not necessarily "punish" them with time bans, but maybe either a) once someone enters a lobby, they then have to stay in that lobby, or b) exiting a lobby sends you to the main screen. Personally, I'd prefer the former.
Frustratingly too, people who kill themselves in-game also end up messing up the mmr. It's very tricky, given so many ways somebody can effectively opt out, so to fix an mmr system by making the mmr tighter ended up creating longer wait times, which people also didn't like! Really, it's hard for them to win!!
I'm not sure there is one true way. The problem is partially with BHVR because - as you rightly point out - there should be someway of putting less-experienced players together, away from the very experienced ones (such as maybe a trial lobby, where -when you start - you can only play with players of a certain experience in hours). However, it's also the playerbase which needs to own their part too.
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Tonight: 4 games where a single out of place teammate completely threw against sweaty killers, 1 actual good game, and 3 games where the killer d/c'd. Why do I play this game?
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Until matchmaking gets fixed, the only way I have to avoid getting matched with brand new survivors is dodging lobbies. So it's kind of a vicious cycle - someone leaves a lobby, I get thrown into it with brand new players, so I have to leave the lobby, and the cycle continues. The only way to stop it is to make it impossible for experienced players to be matched with newer players. Or at least give people the option to choose longer queue times to avoid being matched with people way outside your MMR range.
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A big problem is lobby dodging on both sides and how the algorithm is fill the open player spots.
Usually i get matched with players (killers and survivor) around 3.000 hours and they fit my personal skill level.
But when someone dodge a lobby, players down to 500 hours will take the open spot and they are way out of the skill level of the rest.i can only imagine how extreme of a meat grinder it is in the range of 500 - 1500 hours for soloQ that get put into that matches.
there should be an option to increase lobby search time to find better suited teammates / killer, or faster lobby search times for a less accurate matchmaking.
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Not gonna happen. Blight main streamers gotta tear thru baby survivors to keep the audience happy.
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As you say, all that does is feed into the cycle. Dodging lobbies just because of worries your survivors may not be as experienced doesn't mean that they won't be any good. I have had many trials with P100s who have been absolutely terrible, and who had hundreds to thousands of hours in-game. Likewise, I've been with less experienced players who play really well.
Preconceived opinions are not helping. Sticking to the lobbies you're in and allowing those results to dictate who you play with will get you there in the end. I don't dodge and more of my trials are favourable than not. Can't just be coincidence.
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Yes, "less experineced" players can be better than P100's, but survivors with less than 100 hours in the game are universally not good based on my own experience. There's a big difference between someone who is "less experienced" with maybe 500-1000 hours in the game and someone with less than 100 hours which is basically a brand new player.
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Here's the problem:
Each and every time this community gets asked whether they want faster queues or quality matchmaking, the resounding answer is always for faster queues.
Something like two years back they messed around with much stricter matchmaking, and the result was longer queues plus complaints from burnout from sweats going up constantly against sweats from the vets and content creators.
So we face the dilemma of not wanting to wait, but not wanting to get everlasting sweaty trials either.
Imo the best way to reinforce & strengthen the matchmaking is to allow it to fully function. We'd have to limit or eliminate dodging for that to happen. Something like locked lobbies or no lobbies at all might do it, but that's quite extreme.
There is no easy answer here.
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I agree that that test didn't work out, but that doesn't mean you need to go the other way entirely. You can just make it stricter than now without being perfectly strict like before. I think more people would be happy with a solution like that.
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I still believe the moment any change like that happens and queue times increase the outcry will force them to roll it back. The complaints about queues during the 2v8 were loud and likely to lead to some kind of change there.
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People on your team are never gonna do the stuff you want them to. No amount of matchmaking can make others play the way you want them to.
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well, there is a difference between playing how you would like them to and playing in a manner that's detrimental to the objective and team - to put it nicely
I had a game this morning on eeryie. I loop for almost 3 gens before going down, nice, go team (seriously, go team). Somehow, it was still a 4k. After those 3 gens popped initially, not one of the 3 randoms touched a gen until I had the last gen 90d (meaning I did the 4th and most of the 5th gen alone), at which point 1 of the 2 remaining randoms hopped on with me, only to immediately hop off because killer was carrying the other guy to hook. We finish that gen if they stayed and can salvage at least a 2 out because the killer was not great imo. Like at one point I was looking for a gen to do and saw all 3 of them in chase, literally all 3 running together, not to bodyblock, just running as a pack, against BUBBA. He didn't snowball that which goes to show that he was not that great anyway and the game was winnable had my team's effort not fizzled out.
so yes, I agree you can't expect people to play how you want but surely it is not much to ask for them to not be completely inept.
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it should support maximum matchmaking speed. Sometimes a newer player should go up against pros. Sometimes a pro should clobber new players. If anything, queuing is too long now, the lobby should be 20 - 30 seconds max.
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I'm not even sure how people think that matchmaking is busted when we can't even see our MMR. It probably seems that way because people are either dodging lobbies, or people are backfilling into lobbies that others have dodged without even knowing it. Therefore, I'd be in favor of removing lobby dodging entirely, or just remove the lobby itself altogether. Don't even show the offerings played before loading into a match. This way no one can develop any preconceptions about other players based on their hours played or offerings played or items held, etc. I'm pretty sure the complaints about "busted matchmaking" are actually preconceptions about other players in the lobby more than anything.
And if I get into a lobby with 100- hour players, then most likely it's because I die a lot, and my MMR score dips low enough to be at the same level with those players.
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I guess I kinda think 2 things about this:
1. If people are complaining about matchmaking now, would there be less complaints overall if queues were longer, or the same?
2. Maybe there is some ratio of wait times + matchmaking balance that can be more satisfying than current. I personally would wait longer for better matches now that I've experienced current matchmaking, but some people just prefer faster speeds. Maybe there is some slight/moderate tweaking to be done to make it average for everyone instead of just really good one way.1 -
Yeah naturally, MMR system doesn't work bc players.
More seriously, if this system can be break so easily, maybe this system should be changed again into a 'reliable' system. If devs forget such simple feature like the 'cancel' button, I think they have to go back to the basics…1 -
Yes, this. And players with minimal hours are much more likely to be completely inept, which is why getting matched with new players constantly is so frustrating and demoralizing.
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I would rather play 2 good matches in an hour than 4 soul-crushing matches in an hour. I personally don't care if my queue times are longer. There should at least be an option in the game for players to prioritize matchmaking accuracy over queue time.
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I would rather play 2 good matches in an hour than 4 soul-crushing matches in an hour. I personally don't care if my queue times are longer. There should at least be an option in the game for players to prioritize matchmaking accuracy over queue time.
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To you they're inept. To them they're playing the best they can and making the best decisions they know how.
MMR in every game works the same. You'll always have weak links because the players with higher MMR are supposed to buoy them up and give them a fighting chance. If it were all players of the same skill people wouldn't climb because every low MMR player would drag each other down.
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