I came back to the game after a break of 7 months and my first game was againts a 4 man swf

How do you know it was a 4-man SWF? I rarely see 4-mans usually 2-3 leaning more towards 2. If you want to play as killer and guarantee you do well you need to run certain perks and killers. Running someone like trapper or legion will probably not go great if the survivors are bringing their A game.

One issue is, you can't really know if they are a coordinated SWF until it's too late usually. If you play nice under the assumption that you are against 4 solos, then suddenly you get flashlight saved at a clutch moment and everyone is taking hit for each other at 1 gen.

This is a more general problem in DBD where you never know how sweaty your opponents are until they pop that clutch syptic in your face and now it's too late you're already screwed. Because of that, you tend to assume everyone is sweaty by default, and so the game effectively becomes sweatier.

I'm not in favor of SWF-specific nerfs but at least it would be fair for the killer to be able to know who is in SWF with whom, since it has such a huge impact on gameplay. Not even talking about the winrate, but there are perks like Rancor that lose 90% of their value if the obsession is in SWF, and you would play very differently with this perk if you coul know you are facing a SWF.

I meant stick to stronger Killers as their main and just not play weaker ones. It sucks, but if you don’t want to take any chances, it’s all you can do.

An ugly truth about DBD is that it's punishing as hell on low MMR survivors and punishing as hell on killers with a higher MMR. As a newer survivor, you get matched with potatoes who blow skill checks, don't touch gens, creep around the map into a corner, etc. As a killer, these trials are awesome. But the catch is that the more you win, the better survivors you go up against. Until finally you are consistently matched with the most elite, seal team 6 teams sweatlords imaginable. Gone is the shy Claudette self caring in the corner. Replaced by the Sable running adrenaline, DS, dead hard, sprintburst. With three other Sables. All with flashlights. And a map offering.

I also think it's comical how enraged some DBD players get whenever a killer mentions going up against a swf. Like you could have a four Steve squad, with matching cosmetics and gamer tags, all running the same build with the same offerings, and some rando in the replies will go, "How dare you say they were a swf! How do you know?!"

The truth is that any experienced killer knows that a swf plays completely differently than a solo q team. It's a completely different beast facing people who are all on coms, telling each other where you are on the map, what pallets have been dropped, coordinating saves, etc. Hey, I mean if people get upset by the mention of "swf", I'd say, PLAY SWFY, GET CALLED SWFY.

They shot themselves in the foot with SWF and they can't do much... just saying

There's a lot of issues that compound into it...

They aren't that common, best thing you can do is just take a deep breath and move on. Also, during the game, don't let them get to you. Just get whatever you can out of the match, then move on to another match.

I never understand something, people complain about swf, yet swfs may at least play out a match fully not saying some don't baby rage quit but it's far less common then solo que rage quitting but then yall complain about solo que quitting.

Also as some said not because you got the rarely good 4 survivor team means it's a swf. It's rare but a 4 man good solo team can happen at times and I as a streamer has experienced this when playing as both sides and actually laugh and appreciate it vs when it does cause happen cause then it makes me learn from mistake I did as either side and consider how can I not let that mistake happen again.

Just play survivor

doubtful

It is rare to get a 4 man SWF but they are coming around more. I get a lot of 3's and they are annoying AF.

You still haven't answered my question. What is it that makes a SWF unfun to play against outside of very specific situations?

You just said that it wasn't about losing and now you complain about things that affect balance...

Also more than half the killers sounds wrong. Let's go over this:

Killers that are "nerfed" by SWFs:

• Trapper. SWFs can communicate his trap placements.
• Myers because SWFs can communicate how much he stalks to warn their teammates about a potential Tombstone / Tombstone Piece.
• Hag. Similar to Trapper.
• Maybe Pig because of her stealth and the fact that her traps can become very lethal if the survivors play a sloppy 4v1.
• Maybe Plague as well because it's easier to communicate whether or not you want to cleanse.
• Ghostface for obvious reasons. Although this happens in solo queue as well.
• Maybe Twins because solo survivors usually don't want to be around their teammates.
• Pinhead because SWFs have an easier time playing around the box.
• Singularity because your teammates can use an EMP to help you in chase.

That's 9/37 killers and that's already a bit of a stretch.

Most killer perks are unaffected by people playing in a SWF. Combinations like Pain Res + DMS are countered to a degree but they still work. Just not in quite the same way they would in solo queue. Nowhere To Hide, Lethal, BBQ, Pop, Grim Embrace, Corrupt Intervention and Surge work in exactly the same way no matter if the survivors play in a SWF or not.

Overall playing against SWFs is not much different from playing agaunst decent solo queue survivors. It's just that SWFs have a bad reputation and confirmation bias does the rest. You expect that playing against a SWF will be horrible, so it feels horrible.

In my experience every 4 person SWF just bullies as in not doing gens and seeks out the killer to head on and other BS tactics. Granted I know not all are like that it is just seeing this I get the slugging and tunneling more. I don't play killer often maybe once or twice a day but in the end it is just the constant sliding over pallets, the flashlight spam, the head on (I really avoid lockers anymore when carrying or chasing). The thing though that really irritates me is that all three remaining players can crouch and really dictate where the killer goes. Now I'm on console and you can tell a PC player because the struggle with a mouse is strong and I really feel there is a huge disadvantage here. The thing is if I am not tunneling or doing anything toxic, why be crappy players? Maybe I don't find it funny and I don't that as a survivor. I don't tbag or stay at the gate to taunt because that's just bad. I have gotten 3 swfs that do the same thing but they are pretty tame. I just feel that this game is going in a toxic crapper because of all the players wanting to torment and it shouldn't be that way.

DBD definitely has some players with a crappy attitude just like any other only game. What makes it a bit special in DBD is that it feels more personal because it's a 1v4.

I have played against plenty of bully squads and I know from experience how awful it feels, if you can't seem to do anything against that. However, there is a reason why most bully squad videos end up with the survivors dying.

You can flip the tables as long as you remain calm because these kinds of survivors put themselves in dangerous situations. There is only one scenario on Dead Dawg Saloon that I would refuse to play because they will always succeed in making the match miserable.

With that said, I have found that there aren't that many bully squads out there anymore. Most SWFs are just like any solo group you play against but slightly more coordinated.

Usually you will want to use at least one info perk so that you aren't at the mercy of the survivors to find anyone. Nowhere To Hide is probably the best to counter this specific issue but one more won't hurt. Lightborn is also a very nice perk if you see 2+ flashlights in a lobby. Most of the time it's not very impactful but whenever you end up against a bully squad with flashlights, Lightborn is your best friend.

I think DBD has more of a problem with sore winners than anything else and it's weird because I don't understand the mindset behind it. If someone wins, then why do they feel the need to diminish their win by being a jerk?

Overall though I think that the amount of toxic players isn't as high as it seems. Humans are just wired to remember the bad way more than the good, so you will be under the impression that this happens more often and once you start looking for it, confirmation bias does the rest. You expect people to be toxic so you will find toxicity where there is none.

The best advice I can give you is to run Lightborn and just play for fun for a while. That can help with your attitude towards the game and other players a lot.

Anyway, I hope you'll have some more fun matches soon. Good luck and see you in the fog.

Statistically 4 man SWF only escapes ~ 3% more than solo queue, except in high MMR where there is only a ~ 9 % difference.

source : https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/405382/new-stats-feb-15th-2024/p1

SWF is a boogeyman, a fugazi.

and nurse its one of the lowest killrate killers,so nurse needs a buff?

This is a bit disingenuous. Nurse has a low kill rate because she's hard for new and intermediate players.

I am gonna tell you that for information to be data it needs interpretation, and this information is useless because mmr its not strict enough.

The data speaks for itself. SWF statistically doesn't mean the killer is guaranteed to lose. I'd be more afraid of Four solo queue survivors who were EXCELLENT at the game, able to execute individual gameplans with precision than a SWF who, at regular MMR, only escape at a 3% higher rate.

If you read closely, you'd have noticed this wasn't about balance at all but about SWFs that are more akin to bully squads.

Also, you said, that you didn't care about losing. So why are we having a balance discussion? That makes no sense to me.

Anyway, the game will not pare you with a bunch of players that are good on their own but now suddenly play in a SWF and also have the experience to communicate effectively. So their MMR is going to plateau with the all the advantages of a SWF accounted for. Meaning you still have a chance to win and your match isn't going to be much harder just because these people play in a SWF.

This also explains why SWFs only have a marginally higher escape rate than solo survivors as @Darcalus said, which only differs in high MMR. And before you start, it is very unlikely you are actually at highest MMR. The devs confirmed that the MMR distribution for players looks close to a bell shape (few people at the bottom, most of us around the middle and few people high up). Meaning, you will not notice much of a difference even when you do play against a full SWF.

DBD's balance is so specific that it's not as simple as 2+2=4 at all. It's closer to x^x=0. We don't use 50% kill rates as a balance metric but 60%. That already tilts everything drastically and if you bring in statistics, you'll find that SWF escape rates are within 1 standard deviation.

the mmr doesnt count for swf as date the only thing that matters for mmr its scapes-deaths-time in the game-teammates that made it alieve

You're missing the point. You don't play against 4 people that that all got their MMR on that level in solo queue matches and then just happen to play in a SWF. If you would, then the match would be quite similar to a solo queue game because they'd lack the experience to communicate properly.

before my break i was playing with tournaments blights and nurse daily and one of my teammates that i play with a lot of times, was a comp player that was part of multiple tournaments

Good for you. But this claim isn't exactly new. We've had so many people claim they play in tournaments / with tournament players that I put 0 trust in this.

Either way, your kill rate should still exceed 50%. Even against those SWFs. So one could make the argument that the balance still tilted towards killers.