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Shoulder the Burden has a super bad design.

The new perk Shoulder the Burden has a bad design, this perk was theoretically supposed to "punish" killers who are tunneling, but it's exactly the opposite, it only punishes the killer who is playing nice. The only counter to this perk is camping the hook, which encourages the killers to play aggressively in matches. One idea for change is, instead of letting the survivor exposed, make him have a 50% repair penalty for a certain time, like one minute, for example.

Comments

  • DeBecker
    DeBecker Member Posts: 325

    How does it punish a killer that plays nice?

  • Daniel_Silva04
    Daniel_Silva04 Member Posts: 52
    edited November 30

    I thought I made it clear in the post, but I'll explain. If the killer is not camping the hook, the survivors will be able to use the perk freely without any punishment, until you arrive on the hook, the exposed survivor will be long gone, that's what happened to me. So you basically lose a kill from a survivor who would be on the last hook because you were not camping and there's nothing you can do about it. So this just forces the killer to camp the hook instead of going out and chasing other survivors.

  • Devil_hit11
    Devil_hit11 Member Posts: 9,084
    edited November 30

    it is designed to make killer spread hooks. So if a killer hook player 1 and 2 and they're both on death hook, you can trade a hook trade with player 3/4 to make everyone have equal hook states.

    it is not specifically tailor towards hard-tunneling. the perk end up working as anti-tunnel perk if 1 person is focused down but it also works if two player are focused down. The killer now has to hook entire team to win.

    Luckily, there is a perk that saves the day. Devour hope. with devour hope, you can ignore this tunneling problem and focus on getting 5 hooks than you mori anyone.

  • DeBecker
    DeBecker Member Posts: 325

    I dont know if you understand what it means to play nice or how this perk acutally works. Hook states dont vanish into nothingness.

  • RpTheHotrod
    RpTheHotrod Member Posts: 1,979
    edited December 2

    Big problem is that for a lot of killers, spreading hooks is pretty much going to be a loss (mostly m1 killers, especially ones without map traversal such as pig\ghostie\myers). They need to get a kill out early due to how weak they are. This perk alone pretty much screws over the weakest killers. Some of them were already dropping to a 50% kill rate (ie only 2Ks on average once at 50%) - now it's going to go even lower.

  • NarkoTri1er
    NarkoTri1er Member Posts: 658

    this. Literally this.

    On top of it, this perk further encourages two playstyles that are already unhealthy, camping and slugging, not to mention that it gives you multiple uses of Deli/Wicked per survivor.

    In the world where hooking and spreading hooks is heavily discouraged by various changes to mechanics and additions of survivor perks that work based on hooks, StB is a cherry on top of making hooking close to a pointless aspect of the game for killer.

  • NarkoTri1er
    NarkoTri1er Member Posts: 658

    a survivor that is very good in chases doesn't care about additional hook state, this perk can also literally carry your soloQ matches.

  • Devil_hit11
    Devil_hit11 Member Posts: 9,084

    that is why i said the perk is strong. The perk is stronger vs strong killers because stronger killer are better at tunneling than weaker killers and stronger killer often cannot use exposed drawback negative because they tend to be M2 focused. Every killer's win-rate will drop lower if survivor adopt this perk because killer objective will be longer as they will not be able to shorten the objective.

  • Alen_Starkly
    Alen_Starkly Member Posts: 1,189

    I think the devs came up with Shoulder the Burden, as a counter to hardcore tunnelling (1 person hooked 3 times before anyone else is hooked). But it's a bandaid fix. If you have a soloQ lobby with hardcore tunneling and no-one running StB, then there's no help to survivors. If someone is running StB in soloQ, but another teammate (without StB) gets to the hook before you, then your StB was wasted.

    I really want the devs to stop already with bandaid fixes, and properly start fixing things. Considering tunneling and camping as valid strategies and giving them green light is a really bad attitude for the devs to have. Survivors - they need basekit protection against hardcore tunneling, like make a survivor invulnerable (but without collision with killer) if hooked twice without anyone else hooked, until 1 other person is hooked. Killers - do something like basekit Corrupt Intervention, so you are not constantly threatened by losing a gen or 2 before you can hook someone (or even find someone!). 1 poison should not exist to counter another one, if both can be toned down or removed.

    Shattered Hope was also introduced to counter Boons, just because the devs would not properly rework CoH for ages. It was very situational, it required a perk slot, and also nowadays it's pretty useless, because good luck going against a survivor with Boon perks.

  • NarkoTri1er
    NarkoTri1er Member Posts: 658

    i don't really think there should be any basekit changes to counter tunneling, but instead an actual incentive to spread hooks. For now, Grim Embrace is basically the only decent incentive for spreading hooks. All in all, game needs some urgent improvements to hooking aspect on the killer side

  • Alen_Starkly
    Alen_Starkly Member Posts: 1,189

    I have seen and witnessed killers with Pain Res hard-tunnel someone out of the game. They don't care.

    A possible good solution for tunneling is once a survivor is dead, all killer's slowdown perks get permanently disabled. So, if a survivor gives up early in the game, the other 3 have a decent chance of surviving. If the killer hardcore tunnels someone out, they can say goodbye to pain res and other slowdowns. If the killer plays like a chad, and survivors also play like chads, the killer keeps their slowdowns throught basically the entire match, until someone dies.

  • NarkoTri1er
    NarkoTri1er Member Posts: 658

    this seems like a very decent idea, and i would also love to see Ruin buffed back to 200%, with the first survivor dying/totem cleansing as a deactivation condition ofc.

  • RpTheHotrod
    RpTheHotrod Member Posts: 1,979
    edited December 2

    Fixing tunneling is easy. I suggested it several times. As long as the exit gates are not powered, once a survivor is unhooked, for 10 seconds, the unhooked survivor is shrouded and becomes invisible, makes no noise, loses all player collision, gives off no scratch marks, makes no pools of blood, and cannot interact with anything. This gives them plenty of time to vacate the area. The killer has NO idea where the survivor went. This gives the survivor plenty of time to get to safety and get a reset. It also prevents healing under hook which usually screws over survivors anyway.

    Now, after the reset, if the survivors is spotted again, sure the killer could go after them, but the survivor had plenty of opportunity to get out of danger and reset before hand.

  • SidneysBane1996
    SidneysBane1996 Member Posts: 878

    StB is maybe a little strong and could use a timer, maybe longer Exposed. I don't like this trend of punishing hooks by turning them into an advantage for Survivors to abuse and use as they want.

    At the least show Killers hookstages if you're going to mess with hookstages like this.

  • Rokku_Rorru
    Rokku_Rorru Member Posts: 1,325

    This is why answering peoples core game problems with perks isn't the answer, we should be looking at ways to improve the base game and make the new player experience more friendly.