Self Presevation - Buffs or total rework?

UndeddJester · December 8

Sometimes its quite easy to come up with ideas for buffing bad perks. You can see what they're trying to do, increase the effects, add additional benefits, etc, etc... However I looked at this perk... and I gotta admit I'm struggling for this one....

A numbers buff probably isn't enough

It's current issue is any killer who really wants to stick on you, will be able to stick on you... I don't think realistically you can ditch the killer most of the time with how the perk currently works unless survivors play it absolutely perfectly... and at that point you have many better options.

Sadly I don't think a numbers buff changes nay of this... the only exception is it may help you get saves with a flashlight... but that's the opposite of the intent of the perk...

So you'd need to have some kind of very strong save yourself reasons to use this... but giving it those reasons is actually very hard...

Hard trigger condition = bad..., strong = SWF perk

Fundamentally if someone takes a protection hit for you, that is out of your control... so the effect would have to be good to even consider using this... Hoeever if it is a strong effect it is definitely more a SWF perk than a solo perk, and that is actually antithetical to the idea of "Self Preservation".

The point of the perk is you don't stick your neck out for others, and while I know balance is more important, the theme is also important to the perks identity too. This makes making this perkn strong hard, because it by design should be better for a solo player than a SWF.

Haste sucks...

The only way I could even remotely think to give this remote value in its current state in SoloQ is make it so you run maybe 10% faster for the duration or something. That achieves the goal, but we get scenarios where its problematic for SWF... such as end game hook scrambles and DS/Unbreakable teams.

I am also a believer that sticking haste on things is a lazy way to make perks betters, and should be avoided whenever possible.

So what do we do?

I can't seem to think of an elegant idea. I can come up with some goomba methods of making it better, but they're all kinda bland...

In all honesty the effect of Low Profile would make sense for Self Preservation, but since that perk exists what could be done to SP to satisfy its idea?

Should it gain an extra effect?

Should it be completely redesigned to something different?

I seems like its intent is to be an anti tunneling perk, should we lean into that?

Since hooking is less popular now, should we consider having an anti-slug element?

Should it perhaps gain benefits for the number of dead survivors, like a lesser version of Sole Survivor?

What ideas do we have?

Langweilg · December 8

Self preservation

Whenever another survivor within 24m (was 16m) of you gets hit by a basic or special attack, self preservation activates.
Your scratch marks, pools of blood, grunts of pain and footstep sounds (new) are hidden for 30s (was 10s)
Whenever you are in a 24m radius of a downed the timer stops ticking down (new)

That’s how I would buff it. It would become more useful for flashlight saves or just to escape group situations with the killer.

UndeddJester · December 9

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852746#Comment_3852746

My one concern there, is it becomes more of a Background Player hang around for saves tool (and that's already obnoxious enough). I know this was your intent, but it doesn't fit the theme of the perk. The footsteps being silent allow the perk to be used much more aggressively, which is the opposite of what the perks is intended for. My reading of this perk is you are trying to save yourself and you don't take risks to save others, you use others sacrifice to save yourself.

I would consider giving it notable buffs, but make it something more conditional... something like:

Self Preservation

While injured, whenever another survivor takes a protection hit within 16m of you, self preservation activates for 20/25/30 seconds. While Self Preservation is active:

Your scratch marks, pools of blood, grunts of pain and aura are hidden.
You gain 5% haste.
Your next rushed action is silent.

This would give you options to realistically use LoS blocking windows/pallets/lockers to try and evade the killer after a teammate takes a protection hit through the trial and really one in huge in end game sprints to the gate.

This set of changed would make it harder (though not impossible) to be used aggressively; the conditions make it much harder to exploit, but it now has a meaningful purpose in helping the rush to the gate it someone takes a hit for you, which is actually on brand for the perk... it makes sense for the perks intent.

Langweilg · December 9

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3853057#Comment_3853057

The footsteps being silent allow the perk to be used much more aggressively, which is the opposite of what the perks is intended for. My reading of this perk is you are trying to save yourself and you don't take risks to save others, you use others sacrifice to save yourself.

I’m not very interested in those lines behavior writes over perks. I wouldn’t torment me to make it fit that description and making perks fit that description in a multiplayer team game is probably also not the best idea 💡.

Regardless it still fits that description, while making it easier to escape and to stay undercover with the neat bonus of making flashlight saves easier.

Back to your idea: If you make it require a protection hit, then it is worse than right now and will almost never activate, which makes nobody ever run it. The other stuff is fine for me, but I think simple number buffs to the current perk are more than enough.

I would probably remove the third part of my idea and just make it number buffs with the neat bonus of silent footsteps.

Self preservation

Whenever another survivor within 24m (was 16m) of you gets hit by a basic or special attack, self preservation activates.
Your scratch marks, pools of blood, grunts of pain and footstep sounds (new) are hidden for 30s (was 10s)
~~Whenever you are in a 24m radius of a downed the timer stops ticking down (new)~~