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Killer's retirement

For quite some time Steam stats show that game's player base (or at least frequent players) is just not growing. On the other hand, BHVR some time ago showed that there are 1 million players or customers for the game (now could be more), meaning - they are not staying. I think among few things that is causing it is complexity of the game. There are nearly 40 killers, hundreds of perks, addons etc., so starting new needs a lot of determination to learn how to play them and how to go against. My idea was that BHVR could retire killers that currently are not at their best performance or otherwise could have a rest. I am not advocating for specific killers but just the sheer volume of. Also, this could help make new interesting perks or buff existing ones ( less need to adjust them for strong or weaker killers) and overall move on from projects that didn't deliver (i.e., Skull Merchant).

Comments

  • It's pretty well known that number of active players at any one time tends to fluctuate. I wouldn't worry about this too much friend, it's normal for some ups and downs or even periods of no playerbase growth.

  • camping_site
    camping_site Member Posts: 141

    It don’t think it would have enough impact on attracting nee players. Choice and variety are, in my opinion, what makes this game unique, but has become also a major threshold for new players. 1k hours is the bare minimum to understand dbd mechanics.

  • Halloulle
    Halloulle Member Posts: 1,357

    There's a limit to how much a playerbase can grow. And I think dbd has the max playerbase it can have atm. - At this point it is about getting the most out of people showing a (short lived) interest in a game. Long time players bring in relatively little money, at least when it's OG stuff; everyone has more than enough shards to buy a new surv or cosmetic, the seasonal cosmetics will be there the next year and if you're a veteran you'll probably be around then as well and can just wait (or spend the occasional ten bucks if there's something you really like). It's the new players that buy a lot of DLCs and and stuff simply to be able to fully play the game. I bet the most DLCs are bought by players that have between 50 and 500 hours in the game.

    If that's a good thing, I don't know. It's a business model - and since dbd is carrying Bhvr to the point where they can experiment with a number of games that by the looks of it absolutely tank, it seems to be a quite successful business model. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,662

    The game is 8 years old. You can't really expect that it would keep growing at this point. The fact that it keeps a stable playerbase is already impressive.

  • Spare_Them_Mori_Me
    Spare_Them_Mori_Me Member Posts: 1,805

    Enter Dead by Daylight II. Its… just time.

  • JPLongstreet
    JPLongstreet Member Posts: 6,081

    We can ever only know Steam player numbers so it's a guess for the consoles, which are by far the majority of the playerbase. And as others have pointed out, DBD is eight years old now.

    I think making a DBD 2 would be supremely difficult due to the licenses being a nightmare to make new contracts for across all the platforms.

    I also seem to remember them saying they don't have plans for a DBD 2 either. Too bad, as is would allow them to drastically clean up the coding, maybe add in cool stuff like a match replay system, scoreboards, etc.

  • Smoe
    Smoe Member Posts: 3,018
    edited December 2024

    No it isn't, never will be.

    There's no guarantee a sequel would be a success, not to mention the potential risk if the game ends up being worse one way or another, especially if the gameplay isn't the same or better than the existing dbd.

    There's also the fact that people who already play DBD would have no reason to migrate over to the sequel since all the content is on the existing game and there is no guarantee that it'll transfer over to the sequel, same with people's progress.

    Post edited by Smoe on
  • Spare_Them_Mori_Me
    Spare_Them_Mori_Me Member Posts: 1,805

    It could be. Nothing is impossible ;)

    Of course there's no guarantee of success. In fact, everything you mention here is somewhat a given. So I agree?

    There's plenty reason to migrate over, are you serious? Not everyone cares about rewards earned or even time invested. If the experience is better, I believe plenty of people would move over. My issue would be the player base split. (Not an us vs them jibe lol)

  • Smoe
    Smoe Member Posts: 3,018
    edited December 2024

    If the experience is better, I believe plenty of people would move over.

    I very, very much doubt so. It's no different from moving onto a new asym game altogether and the same reasons why majority of people in DBD haven't migrated onto any other existing asym games also applies to any potential sequels for DBD as well. (Despite how other people have claimed other games would kill dbd and have waves of DBD player move over.)

    Not everyone cares about rewards earned or even time invested.

    No, but alot, and i mean ALOT of people do.

    Between Sunk-Cost-Fallacy, gameplay being different and potentially worse than what we have now, people having to give up on their progress for a new game and so much more. There's plenty of reasons why people wouldn't make the switch.

    DBD was not only one of a kind back in the day when the asym market was much smaller, but it had the right momentum back then to get to where it is now. If you create what is essentially a new asym game with DBD in the current asym space, it's way more likely to end up like so many other asym games that had their 15 minutes of fame before the playercount dwindled significantly or just died out entirely. (especially since both games would be competiting with each other.)

    Realistically, DBD 2 would more likely join DeathGarden in the grave.

    Post edited by Smoe on
  • Functionally the only way a DBD II should happen is if the 2v8 mode BECOMES DBD II. Like, they're fundamentally different gaming experiences. Just do it if we're gonna have a DBD II.

  • The game is nearly a decade old. There's other Assym games now. Yet they are still adding content and still making money.

    What game do you know of that CONTINUES to grow its playerbase after almost a decade of being live? I know of precisely zero except maybe Overwatch and WoW.

    And yet.. we still get chapters, licensed and new, and the game still makes money. So obviously playerbase growth isn't a problem. At least not yet. It would be a problem if a bunch of people stopped playing and I mean A LOT of people. This is because as games age, playerbase growth tends to slow down. It grows exponentially for years, then starts to plateau. It's been 8 years, everyone knows what DBD is and what its about. They're not gonna bring in any more super new blood rapidly like they used to anymore… and that's normal and fine, and healthy, as long as they are not LOSING more players than they bring in.

  • Falcao
    Falcao Member Posts: 39

    Imagine that someone (probably many) started playing before patch 6.1.0 and for a long time saw only nerfs of survivors. Of course, at some point they got tired of it and now we see that the waiting time in the queue for killers is quite long, and in events, tasks can only be completed as a survivor. This is what we have come to, not boring killers.

  • VibranToucan
    VibranToucan Member Posts: 139

    Thats the nature of modern life service games. They add and add and add and at some point its not sustainable anymore and the game dies. We aren't near this point yet, but thats just the nature of games like these

  • Langweilg
    Langweilg Member Posts: 1,544
  • GonnaBlameTheMovies
    GonnaBlameTheMovies Member Posts: 776
    edited December 2024

    Minecraft is also not really the same caliber of game as Dead by Daylight. It's more of a collaborative and/or sandbox game. Good catch though!

  • That's true, not everyone started in 2016. I started in 2022 and even from then til now, the game has massively changed. It was a bit more Survivor-sided (but not overly so) in 2022, now it's balanced to more Killer-sided. I am under the impression BHVR always wanted to make it slightly Killer-sided, but for many reasons things happened and the game ended up Survivor-sided until fairly recently, as in about the last two to three years.

  • camping_site
    camping_site Member Posts: 141

    2-3 years back daily average players on Steam were around 60k, now it is half of that. So an arbitrary max hasn't been reached.

  • camping_site
    camping_site Member Posts: 141

    Maybe reading the post a couple more times might help to get a grasp of it. About lawsuits- people rarely realize that they don't own digital content.

  • Halloulle
    Halloulle Member Posts: 1,357

    in July 2021 the daily average peak went beyond 60k on Steam. Which was shortly after the first Resident Evil Chapter was released and also coincided with the anniversary event. That one 60k is the outlier.

    If we look at the year-to-year trend by month (as the playerbase fluctuates and has different averages depending on the time of year, with the highest daily avrg being around the anniversary event and the lowest daily avrg of a given year being at some time during the first quarter of that year) we see that there aren't really any surprises. The daily avrg hovers between 30k-ish and 40k-ish for the most part.

    Overall, we can see that until mid 2020 dbd didn't get to the 30k at all; you remember what was going on in the world in 2020? You hazard a guess as to how that might have contributed to a sharp player increase around the anniversary event that year?

    Since then the average player count has rarely dropped below 30k - and has rarely risen past 40k (especially if taking the lingering effect of the first RE chapter into account). So I suppose for Steam that is the somewhat stable (albeit fluctuating depending on the month) average daily player count and since it has remained like this for several years now, I do think it's reasonable to conclude this is also the max average player count that can be expected in the future - at least when it comes to Steam.

    What could lead to another sharp increase that is not just temporary (e.g. phenomenal event, outstanding chapter etc.)? If dbd can get a whole new region hooked, a playerbase that has previously been unable to play (idk we have xbox and ps, switch I hear is a pain but maybe if the switch experience was a lot better we would see more switch-players?), a license that sparks an interest in people who have never heard of dbd before or getting former players back (I'd say the number of inactive accounts with 1k hrs+ far exceeds the number of all active accounts) somehow (how? idk. Different game mode, maybe?). Do I think any of that is likely? No. (Hence my earlier comment that at the end of the day the game is meant to make money and you get the most money out of new players - and they don't actually need to stick around for too long to bring in a lot of money, ergo the devs/the company doesn't even need to have a vested interest in making many players years long supporters).

  • ChainsLogic
    ChainsLogic Member Posts: 141

    I've read it, and my conclusion is the same. Did you read your post before posting it? Because retiring a killer so they wouldn't be a balance concern, either because they are strong/weak means you wouldn't be able to play them. And that's definitely not the way to go.

    No, we don't own our digital games, but in a sense of not owning the ip, or the ability to sell our digitally owned games to others. However, the license to play that game is usually available forever. Mostly multiplayer games are at the risk of you losing access to majority/all of it's content, since they usually close down when the server costs outweigh the money they're earning from that game.

  • scoser
    scoser Member Posts: 512

    I don't think "making people lose access to things they paid for" is the winning argument you think it is.

  • Vuk
    Vuk Member Posts: 50

    Im one of those who quit, they kept killing the chars i liked to play, killed Myers, wich wasnt even near strong, killed Adriana solely because survs kept crying even after many nerfs she suffered, she's unplayable rn; changed the way knight was played, wich i didnt enjoyed, and now killed chucky, hes zero fun now… Not mentiong the new killer went live so weak it was a pain to play with, and now she cant play in the event…
    Im logging on just to collect the daily rewards but i played only 3 matches on this event, wich is terrible btw, including the rewards…

  • MissClove
    MissClove Member Posts: 74

    You need a lot more survivors than killers in this game. What good is the game if you have no one to kill? The game is killer sided. As i stated in another post. I used to play with about 15 people who were survivors. There is only 3 of us now. And I’m not playing as often anymore.

  • I don't have any issue finding Survivors, randoms, or filling my lobbies on either side…

  • MissClove
    MissClove Member Posts: 74

    for now. But there is a reason there is usually a bonus for survivors most of the time.

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,662

    The survivor bonus doesn't mean much given the game needs 4 times the number of survivors then killers. The bonus should generally be on the survivor side as the game should always need more survivors to queue up when both sides are in a good spot.

  • MissClove
    MissClove Member Posts: 74

    uh huh.

  • kit_mason
    kit_mason Member Posts: 314

    the game is fine. steam shows a tiny snippet of the playerbase given theres what… four or five platforms other than steam? on top of that, retiring killers? really? which would you like to axe?

    because all of those killers have dedicated playerbases, paid cosmetics, and plenty of other things that would make doing that feel awful and be a terrible look for the devs.

  • Na1ts1rhc
    Na1ts1rhc Member Posts: 106

    Problem with this is - people spent money on these killers and even if ANY owners of the potential "retired" dlc agree with this idea. Where does that money go? Are we compensated fairly? Does BHVR say "suck it nerds" and take the killers out and proceed to not focus on fixing their spaghetti bowl game just to pump out new potentially retire-able characters? I get where you're coming from but it's just not feasible. Even if this was reality- do you really think it would attract more players? I think making the game not bug tf out - removing security vulnerabilities - and introducing ACTUALLY new and interesting mechanics instead of "dog" and "drones" would attract more players. Give the survivors something new like guns or something, ANYTHING. Friday the 13th (R.I.P) had weapons like that and well… I guess that didn't work out. lol