General Discussions
General Discussions
Uh oh 😥 bots are in 2v8 lobbies now
Finally, the devs are adding two Survivor bots to every lobby in an effort to reduce potential Killer queue times.
Comments
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Lol, two bots? As a default? Not even 'this is our last resort if our other improvements don't help' type of thing.
I suspect it will actually work, at least in the short term. Long term, it kind of makes the game and the mode look like a joke. The idea of having bots in the game as a default (and not an emergency replacement) really brings down the idea of a multiplayer game. Then we have the balance issues with how strong the bots are.
An unfortunate development.
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Well, I don't really think it's that bad. 2v8 is chaotic, most of the times you get teammates who are equally or less skilled than bots, and tbh, next 2v8 looks like the most unbalanced mode ever in favor of survivors, so I don't really think it's nothing to write home about. I'm already trying to make my mind to the fact that I'll be losing most of the trials as a killer and that it's supposed to be about just trying to go wild. I'm pretty sure I'll still be annoyed and frustrated and will stop playing after getting the tome rewards, but what can you do?
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2v6
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I really wish they would've gone a different route.. like making survivor more interesting? Ultimates were a good start. However, of course killer is going to get more attention, when they get 3 new killers to play with each iteration, while survivor still only has 4 classes. It's like they need to cater to survivors to get more people to play 2v8 survivor, but still only focus on killers.
Not saying it's an easy job, because I don't know how to make survivor 2v8 more interesting for survivor.. but giving survivors more classes would be a start.
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Could be worse… I was expecting the potential for full bot lobbies. Still super lame though maybe just fix matchmaking instead?
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Who knows. 2v8 and RE are the two most popular things BHVR has ever done, so combining them is probably going to make for a successful event no matter what, sadly. People who actually care enough to check forums or news are a small minority of the player base.
That said, it would be hilarious if enough survivors hate the idea of playing with bots so much that it actually makes queue times worse. It'd take one out of four survivors deciding they won't play with bots for queue times to be just as bad. Any more than that and queues would be worse.
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So they want to artificially increase survivor queues by 33% but what happens if 30-50% of survivor players don't want to play with bot teammates?
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So Nemesis is donating his Zombies to the good of Queue times?
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I'll just play killer to finish the challenges, thereby making the queues worse 😉
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It's a bad long term decision IMO. Bots in their current state are utterly useless. They break down the second a terror radius shows up and refuse to do anything. I can't imagine how they're going to Behave with two killers running around. Every game will effectively be a 2v6. The last part you mentioned might actually be the case when people realize how bad the match quality is going to be on the survivor side.
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Well that's it. I was never a big fan of 2v8 to begin with but this is the straw that broke the camels back. Absolutely will not be playing this.
Instead of trying to, you know, make the gamemode actually fun for both sides they've just went ahead and replaced 2/8 survivors with robots. It would be comical if it weren't so sad how much they've clearly given up on solo surivors.
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Don't miss out on the event rewards! Play killer 😉
Post edited by Rizzo on2 -
I certainly won't be queuing up for this garbage.
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I think you are generally correct in that it won't impact most players desire to join up for the game, but I do think there's a longer term risk. Survivor will feel worse, but is it going to be enjoyable to play killer if its a mixed single player / multiplayer game?
2v8 is the only one they've talked about making a permanent game mode given its reception. I think it will definitely feel worse for survivors for having bots, and while shorter queue times probably will feel good in the short run, long term I suspect killers will lose interest as well.
I do agree, it would be hilarious if it backfired so hard that queue times worsened.
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I'll see. If they're worthwhile then sure. If it's just a charm or something then I don't care.
Post edited by Rizzo on4 -
It seems like they are actually trying to ensure that no one plays Survivor in 2v8. I have no desire to play alongside bots, they barely even function in their current state. All this will do is create an extremely frustrating experience for players.
Honestly, I don't even see the appeal for playing against bots. There's nothing skilful or fun about getting free downs and easy matches because the bots just don't work.
Post edited by Rizzo on11 -
I have a different opinion. I think this is actually a really good call. It will help with queue times quite a bit if this goes right and bots can be a menace.
Post edited by Rizzo on3 -
This will backfire. 2 bots + mending simulator with legion.
Post edited by Rizzo on25 -
bots can be a menace
Yeah they were half decent when they first came out.
But either they nerfed them or broke them because every time I see them these days they're getting stuck on everything or running into the corners of the map and just getting two tapped. It's disastrous.
Post edited by Rizzo on11 -
Oh please I forgot they were adding Legion. This couldn't be a worse combination.
Post edited by Rizzo on7 -
I hope we can opt out of this.
I'd rather just have the longer queue times.
Post edited by Rizzo on18 -
I'll take bots over longer queues any day.
Post edited by Rizzo on8 -
What is your suggestion how the devs can make the survivor role more fun?
I feel like it is really difficult to make the survivor role more fun without overwhelming the players with complex things. I'm not a fan of adding bots to 2v8 since sometimes they work really poorly and both sides can suffer from it but, on the other hand, 10 - 20 minutes qtimes feels awful.
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
I don't know if that many people will care enough about it in the end.
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Objectively this is a good change. It doesnt really matter about bots anyway survivors dc a lot, quite often you are playing against/with one in normal matches anyway. I want to play killer but i don't want to wait 30-45 minutes also there is constant action as killer you wont even have time to notice if its a bot or not. As survivor this probably adds more consistency than your teammates goofing around or throwing to get their tome challenge done. The only thing that would be upsetting is if you cant prefill your lobby to 8 survivors
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What is your suggestion how the devs can make the survivor role more fun?
Don't know and I'm not going to spend my time solving a problem that I didn't create. I've warned for years that 2v8 was a horrible idea because the game isn't built for survivors to be chased by 2 killers simultaneously (which is why Knight is so hated) and the splitting of the queues would lead to unpleasant wait times.
But 2v8 truthers kept asking for it anyways and it was so disastrous for queue times that they're now having to replace players with bots. And I'm fairly certain it still won't be enough to avoid long queues in both the base game and the event so idek what to say. As far as I'm concerned, this mode was always doomed to fail and they should've just said "No" instead of entertaining it.
Post edited by Rizzo on10 -
I assume this is for solo Q correct? If 8 friends still want a full survivor swf this won’t affect that?
Personally I’m not a fan. I don’t queue up to play with bots right from the start. If someone DCs okay but that doesn’t happen for the majority of my matches so going into a solo match with bots from the start is not how I want to play.
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The two times we've had 2v8 so far, it has got boring for me with too little variety in the gameplay to keep it interesting for more than a day.
Legion is one of the most boring killers for me and chuck in bots as well, it looks like a train wreck waiting to happen, a complete disaster in the making.
Bots from the start of games is the way to kill this mode stone dead.
Post edited by Rizzo on10 -
@OnryosTapeRentals is correct that 2v8 is fundamentally flawed in many ways. But I'll give it a go on how they can make it more fun.
1: A few more classes, and more variety within the class. As an example, let the escapist choose from different exhaustion perks for their personal use (though keep sprint burst as the aura perk).
2: Ultimates that actually make the game interesting. Scout has a good one. A player has to think about where to rebuild a pallet, do you waste time going for the best location or just use it nearby, do you get off a gen to do it, etc? The medic and gen guy have ults that can be powerful, but don't make the game more interesting, and the escapists is just kind of garbage.
3: While balance has been improved substantially, there is still the core issue that the best killer strategy is to tunnel someone out right away. The catch up mechanic needs to be designed more around this than the hook states (and/or they need to consider other base kit measures).
4: Killers should be encouraged to be apart, not together. From a balance perspective, killers teaming up isn't an issue, from a fun perspective it is. It's a boring game to be surrounded by two killers (and boring for the other 7 survivors doing gens).
5: Killer classes should be tossed entirely and replaced with something akin to current addons to allow customization by killer (okay, not a pure survivor issue, but I think it would make the mode a lot better).
6: Make chests more interesting and/or powerful. This could be done by either reducing randomization so survivors that want a particular item can try and find it, or increasing the power of items to justify the randomness.
7: Unless they add a boon class, give some reason beyond BPs for totems.
8: Allow those who play survivor to get priority in the killer queue (again, not a fun issue, but would balance queues out a lot better than just putting in bots).
Post edited by Rizzo on12 -
I thought they'd just be back up, not a definite. So it's 6v2 basically because bots run at the hint of a terror radius. I'm doing the Tome and not touching it afterwards.
Post edited by Rizzo on15 -
Sounds like this also means on the off chance you can scrounge together enough friends, you can't even avoid it with a full swf of 8 players. I'll be playing killer instead to get the rewards and then avoiding entirely. No way would I touch survivor with this mess.
Post edited by Rizzo on6 -
This is a really good list actually.
Would love to see them work on some of these and maybe I could be convinced to like 2v8.
Post edited by Rizzo on4 -
I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't mind the bots. I'd rather have quicker queues then the usual 10+ minute ones every time, especially with all the rage quiting that's been going on. I very much expect to see people still give up over any little thing.
It also doesn't matter how fun they make survivor; people will still flock to killer for the novelty. It's a hard problem to solve unless they made the mode permanent. Then it'd even out after a while.
Post edited by Rizzo on4 -
is this a reliable source to confirm that bots will be in 2v8 mode. I’ll wait for confirmation before posting my angry comments :)
Post edited by Rizzo on1 -
You have some good ideas I would also prefer add ons so bp would be useful. Also would want items to be added for survivors so bp useful for both sides and make the game more fun. I still would give survivor buff who is chased by 2 killers at same time to give them bit of fighting chance.
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
I was just talking about this with a friend actually but how on earth are bots going to cope with 2 terror radii roaming the map? In 1v4 they abandon objectives at the slightest hint of a terror radius.
I really hope they've adjusted the bots' sensitivty to the TR otherwise it's just not going to work whatsoever.
Post edited by Rizzo on8 -
My opinion even if you all might dislike it. I'll accept having 2 bots max in 2v8. I just don't have the patience to ever play killer having to wait 10-20min ques. Oh but the bots might be stupid, useless, never touching gens, etc. I already see a lot of real survivor players already running around like headless chickens in 2v8 don't think anyone gonna notice what the bots would be doing all game.
Post edited by Rizzo on3 -
And then they are waaaaay different compared to custom bots too.
They need to program them to do more behaviors. Like they already listen when you point and do the come here emote, so that's good.
However, they play very passive and will not do anything if they're in the killer's terror radius. When they're one of the last alive, they just open the gate and leave - very selfish type of playstyle. It's funny because I played against bots in customs and I had a Cheryl bot hooked all the way opposite of the door they opened when I was testing Freddy.
Do you want to know what they did? Opened the gate and all of them ran like a pack to go unhook the Cheryl. Why they have MORE brains in customs but play absolutely absymally in regular gameplay is beyond me.
Post edited by Rizzo on2 -
I have 0 interest in having bot fill lobbies, especially as a survivor. I'm not going to bother with 2v8, or rather 2v6 since the bots are useless and killers will ignore them to focus on the real players. It's a bummer because I really enjoyed the first two iterations, played them daily for hours as a survivor while they were around.
Post edited by Rizzo on10 -
I didn't even think about swfs. I'm thinking they probably will be exempt, as I know lots of streamers (inc Fog Whisperers) do 2v8 with their viewers.
Post edited by Rizzo on5 -
What else do you want them to do? they gave new ults better abilities and a surv sided comeback mechanic and still Survs weren't interested so it's understandable devs gave up on them and just added bots.
I can see some more buffs to Survs after this but that's its
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
I can see them now just running in circles on the spot with nowhere to go
Post edited by Rizzo on8 -
Just gonna provide better context since the wording is poor on the post
2 bots is not definite it will try to fill to 8 survs but if a certain amount of time passes it will add at max 2 bots
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
I say give us the bots, I’m not mad about it if it helps alleviate the Q times. I’ve met a good bot here or there. Gave my life for one once bc it was the best bot around.
Post edited by Rizzo on1 -
What else do you want them to do? they gave new ults better abilities and a surv sided comeback mechanic and still Survs weren't interested
Because most of the stuff they offered survivors was nothing new. The only ability they gave survivors that they can't get in 1v4 is the ability to rebuild pallets.
Other than that, most of the abilities were just rehashed versions of things survivors can already do. Heal faster, do generators faster, read auras, etc. It's not exactly novel, hence why no one was interested.
It wasn't that people wanted survivors to be buffed, it's that we wanted something new on offer. Which they didn't provide.
Post edited by Rizzo on11 -
bm33 said pretty much everything i wanted to say but I'm slightly more optimistic.
2v8 the most fun i ever had in this game so I'll give it a chance. The average survivor in this mode run edge map and constantly miss gen skill checks (they make the one v four terrible survivors look good). The Bots will obviously be worse than a player but 2v8 lean heavy in the survivor favor already. Which players are bots should not be shown to the killer. Otherwise real players will be strategically more focus because they know how unproductive the bots can be. The bots are going to be completely useless on multi-level indoor map because of the constant terror radius
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
So you clearly stated they did add something new rebuilding pallets your just never satisfied about what they add they added ults, which is new, a comeback mechanic which is new
You still didn't state what you wanted I guarantee if they even added something "New" I know y'all will just continue whine about it not being enough.
Even if devs drastically changed the surv gameplay you would just feel stale about it in a week and complain about it again and should reevaluate yourself
Post edited by Rizzo on1 -
Lobbies will still try to fill to 8 survs it will add 2 bots after a period of time
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I have a list up above if you want to see suggestions.
But I presume you spend 2v8 just doing nothing but playing survivor because you are thrilled with it?
Post edited by Rizzo on6 -
1: Items - I thought about this in comparison to improving chests. It's definitely an option.
2: Addons (edit: I meant offerings) - While I would welcome the BP, I think BHVR's theory is that long term this would destabilize the overall game. 10 cakes in a match would be quite a thing.
More broadly, I think the idea of 2v8 is to reduce some of the sweaty elements in pre-game selection. And I welcome that part, though I understand opinions differ, but they definitely need to think to think of something about offerings or it will always be a weird missing point of the game.
Post edited by crogers271 on1
