Why people claim Killer got suddenly hard to play?

Kind of feel like arguing whether killer is the easiest it has ever been, or the second easiest it has ever been, or off chance on the third easiest, is missing the forest for the trees.

Yeah… that's what happens when you lose. Your MMR goes down.

Idk the three gen meta was pretty rough as a survivor.

• I think killers main are really starting to overdo their complaining. The "killer anxiety" video is trending on YouTube right now, as if playing killer is a nightmare or a truly unpleasant experience. In reality, killer queues are among the worst I've seen in recent years (except for 2vs8). Another day, I spent LITERALLY an hour for 3 games... half of it spent in the lobby waiting for a match. If the experience is so bad, why are there so many people who want to play killer? Maybe masochism?🤣 Same thing for "botany"... yes, this perk has improved, but not by much; in fact, I see it rarely used (nothing has changed in the frequency of encountering it), yet it seems to have become the "new" Mikaela's boon according to killers.🤣

??? pop is the weakest it's ever been wym? ever since 6.0 it's been garbage since rhey changed total to current it's never been worth running also outside of corrupt and dms they all have a hard limit at 8 kicks (4 for eruption) and corrupt should've been basekit back in 6.0 since that's the patch where it goes away when you down someone

So there's a lot to unpack here, but I'll try to speak to as much as I can.

Kill rate is genuinely irrelevant, couldn't be a more worthless stat in this game. The kill rate during prime DH, IW, UB and CoH meta was 48% in a swf

I feel like this is the core problem with why we disagree here, because this meta was before 6.1. your also cherry picking SWF, but actually that doesn't matter anymore.

These are the most recent escape rates, so overall that number has gone up a lot. SWF in particular is now at about a 60% kill rate overall. So yes, balance has changed, and absolutely in the killers favor.

And I doubt you'd be saying "kill rates don't matter" if it was flipped and kill rates were around 40% instead of escape rates.

Killer peaked in 6.1.0 strength wise.

Saying killer get buffed every patch is hilarious, 0 of the best killer perks are at their peak strength right now. Clown just got gutted.

If you're only looking at perks, which you seem to be focused on, then yes... The gen kick and 3 gen metas were the strongest we've ever seen in the game. And it was so wildly overpowered that people could hold the game hostage for an hour and win by attrition that way. It was also one of the most completely broken things they've ever had in the game and is a travesty that it took a year for them to address.

I say killer has been buffed every patch, since it's basically true. In the 3 years since 6.1.0, there has been one, maybe 2 patches total that didn't include some form of buff for killers in general, or specific killers, or even just base kit mechanics.

There are people like you that hard focus on just the meta perks, and basically unless they're hard buffing regression then it doesn't matter to you.

But the buffs they've been handing out are specifically and intentionally to increase the kill rates over the years, and it's demonstrably worked. (This is also, I suspect, related to why you don't think kill rates should count, since it hard counters this idea that killer role generally is eating just fine right now). Changes to maps, tiles, weakening pallets, increasing dead zones, and map RNG happen relatively often even though it doesn't reach the patch notes usually unless there's a specific map rework. Base kit hooks respawn, instant regression on kick (twice), and nearly every major patch has had 2-4 killers specifically listed with buffs ranging from QOL improvements to entire IRI add-ons made base kit.

Nurse gets add-ons nerfed, skull merchant killed, blight add-ons are way worse and hug tech removed. Base kit BT is insane, Skull merchant deleted, ghoul is removed from high tier less than a month after release although he is terrible to play against.

Yes, there have been some balance changes, and personally I don't like how they handled SM either. But complaining about them nerfing nurse, who is still S tier, top 2 killers in the game is a weird focus. They announced like 4 years ago that hug tech was a bug, and it took them over two years to fix. That wasn't a surprise at all. Ghoul is still a high tier killer as well, so I'm not sure what you're upset about with this one.

Looking at the three of the top, I'm guessing 5, killers in the entire game and clutching pearls because they had minor changes or even bug fixes that still leave them in the top 5 isn't really making your case for you here.

It might seem like I am a killer main, survivor hater in the way I worded this but that's not the case. I despise how killers play like bots just like how I despised how survivors played like bots up until 6.1.0.

It does because you're so hard focused on regression for killers (and this weird "kill rates don't matter stance"… dying a lot more often certainly matters if you play survivor for any reasonable amount of time and you don't just dismiss that fact.) It's also because, despite you starting in 2021, you're complaining about base kit BT… and you should know exactly why that was a necessary and good change to the game. Especially since 6.1 also brought about the change to endurance where hitting BT off hook literally disables a host of anti-tunnel perks for the killer.

Because IMO, killers played more like bots right after 6.1. Specifically the gen kick and 3 gen metas were PvE gen kick simulator, where killers dropped chase, kicked a gen, hit me, ran away. There was a song about that exact phrase because killers would spend the entire match kicking gens instead of interacting with the survivors (you know, the PvP).

And that "strategy" won games. It won a lot of games, and had the added "bonus" to a lot of killers that it was so broken and non-interactive that it was exceedingly frustrating for survivors. I personally stopped playing survivor for at least a year and a half after a few months of that meta.

Killers have been getting stuff but not what they wanted

Killers have largely gotten what they asked for, but not what they wanted. Generally speaking, killers want to go back to the 6.1 days where they could play like a bot, and win a largely PvE game experience. But pretending like most survivor changes haven't been catered to exactly the killer's demands here is laughable.

prime DH, IW, UB and CoH meta

You pick it out yourself, and choose a meta where perks were largely nerfed by killer request (except UB). DH (twice), DS, IW, CoH, medkits, toolboxes, BNP, MfT, Haddonfield, basically every corn map (not just cowshed), Eyrie, GoJ, even hatch, and I'm certain I'm missing some because it's been 3 years now. Oh, and the recent "just push it live" punish them all "Go Next" system that was grossly overtuned. All by killer demand.

What killers apparently want, however, is gen kick meta back. That's all that matters is regression. Oh, absolutely keep all the buffs to everything else, including core game elements in the meantime, but give back infinite time to win the game by default after an hour. That's a must, apparently.

Blight isn't freddy

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. What exactly are you trying to say here? Freddy is the most deadly killer in the game currently after the most recent rework. And, I'm sorry, but the "it's a skill issue" argument doesn't hold water, since he's #1 across the board with overall and high MMR.

Pick trapper, pick clown. There are killers who could use some help.

And regarding clown, I'm sorry but this is part 2 of the MfT fallout. Killers complained for 6 months about 3% haste "lOsInG tHeM gAMeS" and the devs nerfed it for them. And now, because that group also convinced the devs that haste was a problem, they're addressing haste overall. Clown is collateral damage to that.

Strangely, now, things like haste stacking and clown bottles (more than 3%) are suddenly "necessary' and reasonable… now that MfT is dead. Which, I forgot to add, that while MfT was nerfed by demand, in the same breath the haste stacking changes were pulled back also by killer demand. Again, this is killers getting what they ask for but not what they wanted (which, in this case, is haste and haste stacking for the killer, but not for survivors).

The game often feels hopeless bc people have a bad mindset. There is occasionaly the unwinnable game bc the slugging nurse got a great map, but most of the time they just thinks it hopeless and lose bc of it.

And if someone gives up, it really is pointless. Not even suiciding, doing dull totems/chests instead of gens is enough.

Now we could say thats a subjective opinion and i cant 100% prove it. But with the anti-go-next-update my escape rate jumped from 40% to 56%. No new builds, i always play solo and i didnt get suddenly extremely better after playing for 7 years.

So for an always solo player like me the go-next-prevention was great.

Nailed it. Although I will say that Clown being nerfed because of haste doesn't entirely fit BHVR's MO. They make lots of bad changes because of their faulty "consistency" logic, but it rarely applies to both sides. Aura reveals need to be limited on Survivor, not Killer; endgame perks/mechanics need to be limited on Survivor, not Killer; etc. Unless they've shifted their approach, Clown either caught a stray or he was nerfed as a part of them buffing Survivor haste recently.

Also with go next, a surprising amount of Survivors were begging for it too. It was really tone deaf to me that they couldn't understand why players were fatigued or why they deemed a trial unwinnable, while they themselves were playing Survivor. My only guess is that they weren't as invested in the role overall so they didn't really see it.