A solution to our lovely little swf problem
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@TheXenoborg said:
Cool, that just proves survivor games are risk-free which encourages trolling, SWF just makes it a lot efficient for them.
You just proved my point about using Logical Fallacies when you can't argue a point.
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@TheXenoborg said:
@powerbats said:
@TheXenoborg said:
Cool, that just proves survivor games are risk-free which encourages trolling, SWF just makes it a lot efficient for them.
You just proved my point about using Logical Fallacies when you can't argue a point.
You made no point. Just because you experienced some toxic solo survivors ONCE doesn't mean things are perfect and it certainly doesn't mean it's the same for everyone else. One instance vs several anecdotes online + my own personal experience (as an active SWF player and a killer faceing SWF survivors), I know who to believe. yawn.
You again proved my point, I've stated on many occasions I'eve experienced toxicity in solo queue. I didn't say only once that was you using a Straw Man fallacy. You then turn to using a Red Herring thereby proving my point yet again.
Your several anecdotes means nothing and you know it. Since unless you can show evidence from every single players games your argument means nothing. You're claiming all swf groups are toxic yet provide no factual evidence.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens.
So just like your logical fallacies we can dismiss your made up facts on the spot. We can now safely dismiss you as yet another forum troll who doesn't actually care about facts only their own personal opinions.
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@TheXenoborg said:
What nonsense. This isn't some UN debate, get off your high horse, please. And you call me a troll? Lol
Still trying the Straw Man and Red Herrings and still failing and yes you proved my point about being a troll.
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Solution don't play killer if you can't handle swf1
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@TheXenoborg said:
@powerbats said:
@TheXenoborg said:
What nonsense. This isn't some UN debate, get off your high horse, please. And you call me a troll? Lol
Still trying the Straw Man and Red Herrings and still failing and yes you proved my point about being a troll.
I'm not a troll. You're asking for unreasonable "evidence" and you know it. I don't know if you aspire to be a lawyer or something but you are definitely annoying with your baseless arguments. As I said, there are countless accounts of actual players, all different from each other in many ways, saying the exact same thing about SWF. The devs also feared the same regarding this mode before caving to our demands. It's 2018, get searchin'. If you choose to ignore all of that, then that's not really my problem. You really lack logic for someone who says "logical fallacies" every 5 seconds. lol I also do not need to prove you anything since it's already been proven by many others. All you have to do is look around you.
No I'm asking you to back up your claims using the same logic you use to deny me my`claims. if you can't provide evidence to back up your claims other than your own personal bias you can't be believed anymore than you refuse to believe me.
As far as get searching use your own advice and you'll see there's just as many videos not showing toxicity. But you refuse to do that because it'd refute your claims. It's a absolute impossibility that all swf groups are toxic yet you still try and claim that.
Also proven by many others is still making up facts without the evidence to back it up, you can post 100 things I could do same, IT PROVES NOTHING. You're making up facts as you go then claiming them to be backed up without backing it up with actual proof.
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@TheXenoborg said:
@powerbats said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@powerbats said:
@TheXenoborg said:
What nonsense. This isn't some UN debate, get off your high horse, please. And you call me a troll? Lol
Still trying the Straw Man and Red Herrings and still failing and yes you proved my point about being a troll.
I'm not a troll. You're asking for unreasonable "evidence" and you know it. I don't know if you aspire to be a lawyer or something but you are definitely annoying with your baseless arguments. As I said, there are countless accounts of actual players, all different from each other in many ways, saying the exact same thing about SWF. The devs also feared the same regarding this mode before caving to our demands. It's 2018, get searchin'. If you choose to ignore all of that, then that's not really my problem. You really lack logic for someone who says "logical fallacies" every 5 seconds. lol I also do not need to prove you anything since it's already been proven by many others. All you have to do is look around you.
No I'm asking you to back up your claims using the same logic you use to deny me my`claims. if you can't provide evidence to back up your claims other than your own personal bias you can't be believed anymore than you refuse to believe me.
As far as get searching use your own advice and you'll see there's just as many videos not showing toxicity. But you refuse to do that because it'd refute your claims. It's a absolute impossibility that all swf groups are toxic yet you still try and claim that.
Okay, bootleg Sheldon, quote me where I said all SWF are toxic. Your arguments are baseless. I play SWF regularly, so that means I'm calling myself toxic. What nonsense. In the end, you are not an authority figure to me to demand evidence from me in such a manner. Your education is not my responsibility. I have expressed no personal bias in my comments. That's what you've projected about me throughout the comments.
Wait what, you've expressed no personal bias? Are you really claiming that after all that you've posted. This discussion has obviously reached it's end point if that's how you'll continue to respond. Make claims eyt refuse to back them up with actual empirical evidence and then turn around and misrepresent what someone that didn't agree with you stated.
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@TheXenoborg said:
Where’s the part where I said all SWF are toxic? While you’re at it, highlight comments which you feel show I have a personal bias against the mode. Come on, Shelly!
To end this quickly since' Id rather concentrate on more positive discussion the bias is displayed where you say based upon your games and the stuff you've seen. You claim that proves you`right while dismissing what anyone else says.You probably don't even realize that's what you're doing but if you look at it objectively you'll see.
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@TheXenoborg said:
Where’s the part where I said all SWF are toxic? While you’re at it, highlight comments which you feel show I have a personal bias against the mode. Come on, Shelly!FYI insulting someone in a debate makes it pretty obvious that you're trapped in a corner & don't know how to get out without admitting that your argument is shaky at best.
Back to the thread:
All of the suggestions in this thread are pretty bad, and they'd probably kill the game, as no one would have fun playing with their friends anymore--which is the biggest appeal of the game for most of the playerbase. Not sure what a good solution would look like, though, as I haven't seen one yet.
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If your referring to my post about giving a small 10% penalty to heal repair and altruism speed when in swf. It was shown to add like a few seconds to actions. Math may not be your strong suit. But I laid it all out. At least my idea was presented in a non biased non cry baby way. So take a shot at me if you want. But people can read my suggestion themselves.Visionmaker said:@RSB said:
@MumboJumbo said:
@deadwolfwalking
How about this:
1 survivor- Permanent Ruin, 50% regression for a great skill check.
2 Survivors - 300% survivor action penalty.
3 Survivors - 100 Gens.
4 Suvivors - Insta down, 300% speed, teleportation, insta-mori, no terror radius, see all survivors auras, if survivors move and they get the mangled status effect. Also 1000% more blood points for killer, 1000% less blood points for survivors, and they get set back to rank 20, killers get to rank 1.HAHAHA, YOU GOT IT? HE WROTE IT LIKE THAT, BECAUSE KILLERS ARE SO OP PLZ NERF, BUT THEY WANT BUFFS, HAHA!!1! IT WAS SARCASM HAHAH!11!1 GOT IT? got it?/?
Not even funny. SWF needs to be fixed and we both know that.
Don't know why you're lashing out at him of all people, considering salty killers in the thread... in every thread... are the ones unironically giving out brain dead suggestions that kill the game.
Hurhur guys, 0 perks for SWF, 40% repair speed reduction, default moris for 4 stacks, SWF indicators so SWF can be dodged, etc. etc. Literally all suggestions posted within the last week.
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@mintchapstick said:
@TheXenoborg said:
Where’s the part where I said all SWF are toxic? While you’re at it, highlight comments which you feel show I have a personal bias against the mode. Come on, Shelly!FYI insulting someone in a debate makes it pretty obvious that you're trapped in a corner & don't know how to get out without admitting that your argument is shaky at best.
See, this is why I weave insults into my arguments. It continues the discussion and adds a little spice.
@lucvus said:
If your referring to my post about giving a small 10% penalty to heal repair and altruism speed when in swf. It was shown to add like a few seconds to actions. Math may not be your strong suit. But I laid it all out. At least my idea was presented in a non biased non cry baby way. So take a shot at me if you want. But people can read my suggestion themselves.40% repair speed reduction ON FULLY CO-OP'D GENERATORS. Happy? Besides, you never responded to my criticism anyway, so why should I care?
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@SenzuDuck said:
Or you could practice more with your killer.SWF isn't unbeatable, you don't have to get 4K every game, focus on one until dead if you're really that bad and can't cope with a 4 man.
But ALL SWF's are flashlight wielding bully's that just want to make the killers life miserable!
Flashlights can't be outplayed!!
SWF's isn't ensuring the game has a player base!!!
I don't want to learn to get better or admit I make mistakes, I want to win no matter how I play!!!!2 -
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@switch said:
No. just easier
x2 swf players = x2 perks disable (random)
x3 swf players = x3 perks disable (random)
x4 swf players = x4 perks disableSWF players can still dominate without perks.
Yes but it would be a start at least
It would be more like a "1 step forward and 4 steps back" kind of a thing.
Explain the 4 steps back?
Without perks, survivors still have access to vital info like totem placements, killer perks, killer's position, their own positions, info regarding status of gates, location of hatch, location of items and chests and so on. The killer's advantage is the element of mystery that the survivors are surrounded by. The killer suffers when they're no mystery and the fear of the unknown is lost. More than 4 steps, I guess.
All these things you named are already a thing NOW in a SWF. Removing perks of SWF players would get the whole thing closer to some actual "balance", do you agree here?
Better remove the perks instead of ignoring the problem like they have done, and still doing I guess0 -
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@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@switch said:
No. just easier
x2 swf players = x2 perks disable (random)
x3 swf players = x3 perks disable (random)
x4 swf players = x4 perks disableSWF players can still dominate without perks.
Yes but it would be a start at least
It would be more like a "1 step forward and 4 steps back" kind of a thing.
Explain the 4 steps back?
Without perks, survivors still have access to vital info like totem placements, killer perks, killer's position, their own positions, info regarding status of gates, location of hatch, location of items and chests and so on. The killer's advantage is the element of mystery that the survivors are surrounded by. The killer suffers when they're no mystery and the fear of the unknown is lost. More than 4 steps, I guess.
All these things you named are already a thing NOW in a SWF. Removing perks of SWF players would get the whole thing closer to some actual "balance", do you agree here?
Better remove the perks instead of ignoring the problem like they have done, and still doing I guessYes, as I said, it's a step in the right direction but not enough. Although I still think removing perks for SWF survivors might not be the best idea. Instead of losing all perks, the system can have a hierarchy system. For every survivor in the SWF team, the entire team loses one TIER of all their perks. So if it's just two SWF members, their TIER III perks will become TIER II and so on. If it's 4 SWF members, each member loses 2 perks and the remaining become TIER I. This system should remove perks at random.
But removing all perks for ALL forms of SWF teams might not be a good idea since it would punish smaller SWF teams and also solo survivors since they'd be the only ones with perks. We shouldn't be discouraging people from using the mode at all, but instead just make it a bit harder for them and give the killer a chance to catch up.
The suggestion was to remove a perk for every person in the SWF, i.e. smaller teams are not as hard punished as 4 mans. But well, its a bad idea overall trying to balance the game like this but they need to do ANYTHING about SWF now
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@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@Master said:
@TheXenoborg said:
@switch said:
No. just easier
x2 swf players = x2 perks disable (random)
x3 swf players = x3 perks disable (random)
x4 swf players = x4 perks disableSWF players can still dominate without perks.
Yes but it would be a start at least
It would be more like a "1 step forward and 4 steps back" kind of a thing.
Explain the 4 steps back?
Without perks, survivors still have access to vital info like totem placements, killer perks, killer's position, their own positions, info regarding status of gates, location of hatch, location of items and chests and so on. The killer's advantage is the element of mystery that the survivors are surrounded by. The killer suffers when they're no mystery and the fear of the unknown is lost. More than 4 steps, I guess.
All these things you named are already a thing NOW in a SWF. Removing perks of SWF players would get the whole thing closer to some actual "balance", do you agree here?
Better remove the perks instead of ignoring the problem like they have done, and still doing I guessYes, as I said, it's a step in the right direction but not enough. Although I still think removing perks for SWF survivors might not be the best idea. Instead of losing all perks, the system can have a hierarchy system. For every survivor in the SWF team, the entire team loses one TIER of all their perks. So if it's just two SWF members, their TIER III perks will become TIER II and so on. If it's 4 SWF members, each member loses 2 perks and the remaining become TIER I. This system should remove perks at random.
But removing all perks for ALL forms of SWF teams might not be a good idea since it would punish smaller SWF teams and also solo survivors since they'd be the only ones with perks. We shouldn't be discouraging people from using the mode at all, but instead just make it a bit harder for them and give the killer a chance to catch up.
The suggestion was to remove a perk for every person in the SWF, i.e. smaller teams are not as hard punished as 4 mans. But well, its a bad idea overall trying to balance the game like this but they need to do ANYTHING about SWF now
It's still better than the devs idea of buffing solo survivors to the level of SWF survivors lol I mean I don't even know who comes up with such horrid game design decisions hope it's not stefan because he's so cute
In my opinion the only logical way to balance SWF is indeed by buffing solo survivors by giving them ingame voicecomms and nerfing the whole survivor kit, everythign else is just trying to ignore the core problem
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