Players who DC: what will you do now?
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What is the problem that causes people to DC though? Let’s be realistic, no claims of “real life stuff,” because that happens rarely.
What in game things make people want to DC? A killer they think is OP, a killer using a mori, not getting a map they want, getting seen at the start and downed first? None of those are legitimate reasons to DC, if you (and by you I don’t mean you, I mean people who DC) think they are you shouldn’t be playing an online PVP game with random factors.
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'Oh boy, oh dear, oh boy'.
Truly, you have a dazzling insight.
Survivor queues are shorter than killer queues. FULLSTOP. And the metrics showed it too, before it went to dedicated servers. But i doubt you have anything beyond anecdotal evidence to support yours.
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It's a nuanced conversation and in terms of ranking you've picked the most superficial. There's been a few posts in this thread addressing it, I even quoted one.
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Oh sweet summer child, what part of “on console” wasn’t clear :)?
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Yes, I’ve read your posts and I haven’t seen anything legitimate just a bunch of excuses that “they weren’t playing fair,” “they didn’t let me pick the rules,” and other things I would hear from young children. You’re clearly set in your stance, I hope the DC punishments are harsh enough and stack up quickly enough that you take your ball and go home. Will it affect queue times, for me not really because I play both sides so if killer times get too long I’ll swap to survivor and actually play the game out.
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lol
Like I said.....
Still, you managed to expand your vocabulary. 😉
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well, now you are just blatantly trolling.
...I will DC!
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Depends on region and time of day. Right now in US I can get near instant survivor queue but have to wait 10+ minutes for killer. In the evening killer queues are instant and survivor games take 10+ minutes so it flip flops.
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Are you really comparing being kicked in the back of your knee and having your leg stomped on, to being face camped and slugged in a video game? LOL. For one those types of plays are against the rules in football, slugging and facecamping are not. while both of these suck to be the one receiving the slug or facecamp, you have to realize as well that the killer is the one putting themselves at fault for slugging and facecamping because both of these have counter play. Killer slugging? Run the killer and have somebody else get the slugged survivor up. Facecamping? that sucks but you can rush gens to make sure the killer will only get one hook and de-pip. there is counter play to these "problems". unlike having your legs kicked in football.
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Gosh, you missed my point.
You asked me something and I answered, you are the one who asked about sport.
The point is not if a bust leg is the same as a slugging in game. Of course they are not for God sake. The point was that both leave you unable to play the game in which you joined.
You can't play the current match you joined in dbd if the killer camps you. Yes technically you are in the match but all you are doing is watching from the side lines because you are hooked. Same with a bust leg in football you can stay and watch but no way can you continue to play the match.
Also I did not say I wanted to tell my opponent which tactic they can or cannot use. Likewise my opponent can not decide which tactic I will put up with. In any game real or video. I have said I will not be a part of toxic matches. I never once said I start telling the toxic player what they should or should not do.
And yes football or any sport you take part in, in real life is real life. Nothing in a video game is real. If you can't tell the two apart, I can't help you there.
:)
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I was asked about sport from another poster so I went on from there to give the example I did.
No of course I don't think I bust leg in real is the same as being slugged in a video game.
The point I made was that camping and tunneling off the hook leave you unable to play in the match. The same way a bust leg would leave you unable to play football.
Yes I know you can counter camping as a team but not the person on the hook, they die an de-pip.
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It's not me not getting your point, it's you making one that, again no offence, makes no sense:
an injury in a real life sport, if that's what you're talking about, is equivalent to your connection or PC being broken - you're not able anymore to play, you have to leave the match or just be a hindrance for your team. That's fair.
Being slugged is like being the goalkeeper in a very unfair match where your team is so strong you never touch the ball. You can't just say but I'm not playing! I'll leave the field FFS.
And as for the example real life is real life, videogames are not, that's not the point - a game played in real life or a game played virtually are just the same: a game.
If you don't want to obey the game rules, find another game ^^
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Camping does have counter play as a team though, even in basement hook, one person gets hit by the killer forcing them to wipe off their weapon which is more than enough time for the unhooked survivor to run free, esp if they have BT. but if you don't have BT then another thing is to get multiple survivors to go for the unhook. One takes a hit, one unhooks, and another bodyblocks for all of them as you run from the hook. and if you do SWF you can do what I just mentioned and have the 4th person run the killer while the others heal. it takes coordination but there is def counterplay to camping and getting the person being camped off the hook.
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You are missing the point I made. You are unable to play in the current match if you are camped and tunneled. Same way you would be in football over a bust leg.
If you think the example I gave was not a good one, that's fine but the point remains the same. You cannot play in the match if you are hooked and unable to get off said hook or are tunneled when you do.
Also I never said anything about the rules. It's actually not against dbd rules to leave a match as long as you don't do it loads. As far as I know anyway. The timeout is to discourage dcing but nowhere have I seen it stated that the rules around dcing have changed? Maybe they are changing? But that's not information I have found as of yet.
In fact that would be something that should be known, we know a timeout is being added but are the rules changing? Has the threshold been lowed before a ban comes into play?
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Yay killers get to keep their pips when they tunnel or camp because DCing is bad game play.
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If the killer tunnels you, you are screwed. Yes your team can throw theirselves at the killer and hope he loses sight of you but that's not always the case. It's a chance move and most times fails.
Also let's not talk SWF, that's a whole different ballgame. I was only referring to solo. :)
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The person on the hook CAN help the team though, but waiting out the full two minutes and letting them get gens done.
Just a few days ago someone go basement camped by insidious Bubba and waited it out letting the others power gens and three escaped that was a GREAT TEAMMATE!!! Had you been that person you would have let yourself die and bubba would have been after the reat of us.
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No. What if your actually screwed and need to atempt in order to live
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Great comparison. A broken ankle keeps you from playing, like not having internet. A camper keeps you from playing the way you want to, like if you were a wide receiver on a run heavy American football team. Those people in real sports are also picked on often called prima donnas and selfish people.
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If the killer is camping / tunneling you, you are playing, it's just that you are not having fun and you are somehow passive - but still not inactive, and that's why if you can't accept that maybe DbD is just not the game for you (or at least, not survivor). I'll try to be more clear:
Dodgeball - you get hit and are removed from the play field but not from the game. You are now a passive player, meaning you can't do anything until you get rescued. If you leave the game altogether, you are just messing up your team.
Now back to DbD - if you are getting camped / tunneled and you DC, you are damaging your team, because they won't be able to punish the killer by gen rushing him.
As for DC not being against the rules: it is. It was already a bannable offence, just read the game rules here in the forum if you don't trust me. The oncoming time out is not just to discourage, it's a penalty - only not a permanent ban.
The threshold for the penalties will be lowered according to patch notes, but we don't know what the threshold is nor how long will the penalties last.
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I never said you could not help your team, I said it makes the player on the hook unable to play in the match.
As a matter of fact I have held out myself when I have been camped, in fact I think every player would have done so at some point.
However I don't all the time, I will stay until I get to the struggle then just die. I'm not going to stay there in every match I get camped.
Camping is allowed but that does not mean people have to play along with it if they don't wish to. Again as I said in my first post the only reason people want their team mate to stay in a match they don't want to stay in is for their own selfish reasons. To get points or to be a distraction to the killer. Meanwhile that player is wasting their own time and will get a punishment of a de-pip.
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But to to that player, they don't feel like they are playing because they are doing nothing. People don't play dbd to sit on a hook for their time in one match. If you can't understand that, that's fine. We will agree to disagree.
I don't feel like I am playing if I'm camped then die on the hook. If you do feel like you're playing in those circumstances that's great. :)
Well if it's against the rules to leave even once then how very stupid. Lord help anyone with a power cut, guess they can expect a ban.
I always thought it was not against the rules if below the threshold? Or have I got that wrong? Never known anyone get a ban for leaving a few matches tbh, have you?
:)
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That was because they didn’t know if the player left or it was a legit DC... dedicated severs are fixing that. Your power going down will be a temp ban, which won’t affect you since your power is out for a bit anyways right?
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The the only way to sort this issue out is to let players leave a match without any punishment and back fill from the players waiting to que in solo. In other PVP games I play thats what happens. I am in an 8 x 8 and three people leave (maybe they dont like the map) and immediately they are replaced from solos in the que seeking a match. I have even joined a match seconds before it was over, although that is rare. But.. the big difference is the PVP game has ranked and unranked matches, and no player can play ranked till they reach a certain level of expertise.
If Steam crashes and everyone is disconnected, surely everyone would have the five minute wait penalty? I made a cup of tea, find something else to do, like posting here.
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But to to that player, they don't feel like they are playing because they are doing nothing. People don't play dbd to sit on a hook for their time in one match. If you can't understand that, that's fine. We will agree to disagree.
Again, I'm not telling you that you should be having fun even in those situations. I'm telling you that those situations are part of the game - evidently you don't like the game as it is, you want to play something that do not exists right now (e.g. a game where you can't tunnel / camp / slug).
The only solution is to play a Kill Your Friends game with your custom rules, but if you play a ranked match, you have to accept the game as a whole, if you don't you will be very frustrated and/or get banned depending on your behaviour.
Well if it's against the rules to leave even once then how very stupid. Lord help anyone with a power cut, guess they can expect a ban.
I always thought it was not against the rules if below the threshold? Or have I got that wrong? Never known anyone get a ban for leaving a few matches tbh, have you?
I really don't understand your point.
DC was against the rules, even if you were not getting banned? Yes.
Will anything change, penalty wise, for DCers, lowering the threshold? Yes.
A power outage is a one time thing, you'll never get banned for that.
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People joining mid game wouldn’t work for DBD, for a variety of reasons. That would be crazy for a survivor to use a toolbox with BNP then DC and their replacement had BNP too. Or you would into a Freddy game with ruin still up and three stacks of Thana, six stacks of dying light...the list goes on and it’s not good for either side
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Imagine downing someone for their third hook, and they DC in your arms, and someone fills in who has to be hooked 3 times all over again.
I'd rage so hard. 😂
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You make good points. I wonder if the fact a team mate disconnects would allow the game to say "ok thats bad that happened, but we want you to have fun without worrying about depipping due to the selfish act of another player. In the same way a killer disconnecting at any time in the trial will end the match but survivors do not depip.
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I honestly think habitual DCers (people who DC over a threshold) should be put in a DC-only queue with other habitual DCers. They are not told they are in this queue (or they would promptly play properly only to get back into normal queue).
They only get out of the queue by completing a number of matches to get over a threshold again. Until they play like normal people, they have to play with people who DC just like they do.
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Is this a known fact or just guessing? I'm sure if someone clicks the leave match button, they know it was not a power cut.
As it happens you are right this won't affect me. We don't get power cuts that often here. However if the game crashed and I got a temp ban, I would just laugh anyway. But that being said let's not pretend the time out is a ban now lol. It's a time out from match making not the game as a whole as far as I know? Or have I got that wrong?
:)
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it's a temporary ban, which will escalate the further you DC, eventually to a permanent one.
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It’s in the patch notes, and peanits has address it his posts repeatedly over the past few months.
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I've suggest this before too, if you are so adamant that DCing is okay for certain situations then you won't mind being put in a queue so you only get paired with other people who DC right? @Thrun I'm curious what you think about this, not trying to attacking you but you're stating if you don't feel like you're getting to "play the game," then it's okay to leave. Would you mind being paired with other people who DC as well, I'm guessing not because everyone in the DC lobbies would feel their reasons were justified but the reasons that their teammates DC on them are not valid.
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I disagree with you that it's how the game is meant to be played. They did not make this game for one player to sit on the hook from the start of the match until they die and de-pip. However if you believe that is how infact it's meant to be then what can I do? I'm not going to try and sell you something you don't want to buy now am I.
I have never said I don't like dbd, in fact I said I liked the game very much. I said I won't be a part of toxic gameplay. And I never will be a part of it, this time out timer will change nothing on that front and not just for me.
Getting camped, slugged, tunneled is fine as long as it's part of good gameplay. If it's used in a toxic way, I will not be a part of that. I have never once said I dc from a match everytime I come up against those things. If I did I would have been banned years ago. However I do dc at times. I have never got even a warning because it's something I don't do a lot but that does not change the fact, I have and will continue todo so under circumstances I deed fit. I'm not asking for you to agree with me on anything.
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Fair enough, I did not think it was a ban from the game as a whole. I only thought it affected match making but clearly I must have gotten that wrong. :)
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The thing is you’re going based on what you “feel is right,” whereas people who camp/tunnel are playing by real rules the devs have stated.
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If you DC only against very toxic killers you will probably never face real consequences, since they are really not that common, hence I don't really see what are we arguing for :).
I suspect, but I can be 100% wrong on this, that you think even things like proxy camping is toxic, slugging to wait for DS, or maybe downing two times the same survivor even if the killer can't find another one and/or you are obviously the easiest to chase. In this case you will probably DC too much and get banned (probably not permanently though).
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It will be interesting to see if more killers stick it out when they're missing hit after hit like I do, or feel like they're getting gen rushed. That's about all this does because even though I still see survivors killing themselves because they got downed, I still see plenty of survivors that try to get themselves off the hook and then kill themselves on first hook.
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John I completely agree with this as it happens. I think Dwight is right in that you should be put with others who are likewise. I don't feel I dc enough but then again maybe I do? I don't know the threshold tbh. I don't know if that information is out there?
I would not mind being put in matches with people who dc, tbh I would say 4 out of 10 matches I play people DC anyway. I have addressed this before.
The thing is it's hard to talk about this too much due to rules here. However what I will say is this game needs more transparency for both sides. Survivors should be able to know which killer it is before the match starts. Killers should be able to know if it's a swf and how many are together.
Both these problems lead to dcs happening. Not seeing the killer does not make anyone play against a killer they don't want and this new timer won't change that. Same with swf, it does not take the killer long to work out it's a swf and dc. Now of course there are more reasons but I will leave it there.
But yes I would be more then happy to be put in a "dc" lobby. :)
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I never DC as killer, I was once stuck in a pallet and I didn't even DC just let the survivors finish their gens and leave. A few even let me have free hits by coming over to me and apologize for the bug post game. If they gen rush you then you open the door and the game is over in 2 more minutes, and you'll at least get some points for chases.
I feel like most people's definition of tunneling and camping is very broad based on how many people claim the killer camps and tunnels 99% of the games their in.
If the whole team suicide bombs the hook to save the person I hooked two seconds ago that's not camping. I literally have no reason to move when I know where all 4 survivors are at.
If you get unhooked, plop on to the nearest gen, and don't even attempt to run when I come back that is not tunneling. If you give even the slightest hint of trying to escape I will let you go, but I am not giving you a free pass to work on the gen just because you're the last person I hooked.
If I chase a survivor and they run right to you, unhook you midchase, and I down them I will probably down you immediately as well unless they have BT. I won't hook you, but I will leave you there so the team has to waste time unhooking one person and healing another.
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The problem is that so many people will DC on first hook, or DC when downed, and then say 'Well, the Killer was being TOXIC!'
I once had a person DC as the 4th Survivor downed. Like, the precise second I downed him, he DC'd. He then claimed 'Campers don't get 4Ks' in end game chat.
..I was playing Hag. I'd place ONE trap near hooked Survivors, and then I'd go look for Survivors and kick gens.
But in his mind; I was toxic because I used my power & all 4 were too stupid to crouch when nearing hooked Survivors after it happened the 10th time.
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John, what can I say to that other then I have never said or tried to say it's against any rule to camp or tunnel.
Likewise leave a match is still a option an will continue to be one, yes with a time out now but still a option. If a player is abusing that option then that's for the devs or whomever to deal with.
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Side note, I would like to thank you for such a good conversion... no name calling, etc I think you make a lot of strong points and I am not ever sure I am “right,” I only give my view on things.
youre right though we don’t have enough info to be sure of anything, the SWF issue looms for me on Both sides too because I feel it’s hard on killers and solo survivor gives up a lot compared to SWF
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I'm pumped for these changes.
It'll be hilarious to watch the forums after the trash starts taking itself out.
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True on this, just because I don't feel like I DC I can't say I'll never have a game where I feel it is the correct thing to do. I try not to because I feel it could hurt my team, but there may be a time when my mental state requires I quit a game.
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To the original question: I will let myself die on hook when able. If I'm stuck in the environment or am slugged and left on the ground until the killer feels like he's gotten his value out of me then I guess I just have to sit there and be miserable (thanks devs). If I have griefing teammates then I will grief them back since I can't just remove myself anymore (thanks devs).
I don't feel that the devs thoughtfully considered the issue of why survivors DC and whether it's reasonable and fair to punish them for it. Here's why people DC:
- Game Glitches (no skill check meters, stuck in environment, etc)
- Internet/Steam/PSN issues
- Terrible teammates (farm, potato, grief, etc)
- Toxic killer (slugs, tunnels, camps, OP addons [Iri Head, Cox Clapper, Scratched Mirror, etc])
- RL Issues make you leave
Reasonable people should agree that the 1st 3 reasons are outside of the players control and forcing someone to play through them is unreasonable and honestly somewhat cruel. "Sorry your teammate is working with the killer and farming you, just wait. It'll be over eventually". "Sorry the 3 man swf you joined with feels like playing hide and seek and not doing anything, just wait. It'll be over eventually." "Sorry we can't code very well and you're stuck on a tree or can't see any skill checks. Just wait, the killer will find you eventually."
But the 4th reason frankly aggravates me the most since it will forever go unaddressed by the devs. Killers have WAY too much leeway in this game to make it a miserable gaming experience for survivors. I don't mean tough games, I mean mean-spirited toxic games. I would guess appx 20% of my games involve slugging the 3rd to find the 4th. And often this turns into a drama of getting healed just as the killer returns to slug you again. It's the most annoying, frustrating thing in the game. But don't dare DC in this situation and ruin the experience for the killer...
And if he wants to camp/tunnel you for his own reasons and make sure you get minimal points, just endure it for the good of the team. Be the martyr. Don't dare ruin that killer's right to have unsportsmanlike fun at your expense.
And OP Addons... I've long railed against these basically free slaughterfests for the killer at the survivors' expense. Mediocre players running them is often counterable. But a very good killer using them is just getting a free game and you have no options but to be a hapless pawn while they slaughter you one by one, usually in combo with an ebony mori. "Hey c'mon! Don't quit! Can't you have fun letting the killer have his special game at your expense?"
So is it REALLY unreasonable to DC in these situations? No. Is it unreasonable to expect your teammates to understand that it's one of these situations? No. I stopped caring when someone on my team DCs long ago. Why? Empathy. And I can choose to continue to earn BPs and play a tougher game or I can DC myself. It's a non-issue.
I think the devs are addressing the wrong problem and making the problems they SHOULD be addressing even worse because they're forcing players who used to just exit from the situation to endure the situation instead.
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This, or they'll get on another account and do it all over again.
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That's great, but I've had lots of killer DCs. It happens. But glad you're not one of them.
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