General Discussions
General Discussions
Does second wind need a buff?
From my testing the perk seems very underwhelming for example decisive strike is a perk survivors do not have to work for but yet it provides a very powerful benefit whereas second wind can be countered easily and survivors have to work for it's negligible effect overall I think the perk should be repurposed or buffed in a unique fun yet fair way. My proposed changes would be to give the user 32 seconds of the endurance status effect when being unhooked or unhooking yourself acting like a personal borrowed time that can be used with deliverance what are your thoughts?
Comments
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Not gonna lie, at first I didn't like the idea, but it does actually seem beneficial. I'd say if you unhook a survivor safely you get it to activate. But, I feel as though 32 seconds seems like a long time for borrowed time. I'd say 20 seconds or 25
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I feel like it should work with Deliverance tbh and that Deliverance shouldn't make you broken
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Deliverance is fine
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Comparing to other survivor perls? Defenitely not. The perk is good in current state. You don't need to bother healing, you can just hop on a gen and don't bother about getting healed,.
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We already have to deal with DS which is really annoying even if you don't tunnel and you want to add another free healt state - second chance perk
How about no?
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Most of the Stranger Things perks could use some buffs. It's a shame we got so many worthless perks in such a cool chapter.
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How is it free? They had to meet conditions to use a one time use perk.
32 seconds is probably too long. 20 would be okay I think.
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I remember when everyone was losing their minds on the Stranger thing's new perk combo saying it was gonna be the second coming of mettle of man lol
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I know you have to heal someone first but OP said "after being unhooked". So it's basically DS
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imho second wind should not have requirements, maybe slightly increasing the time broken status to 50/60 second at tier 3.
this would guarantee two free health state if you can survive enough time for match, nothing special, not a meta perk for sure, but would make a currently useless perk playable and interesting.
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They nerf whatever survivors find annoying, but when it comes to nerf something killers find unfun, it takes years
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The ######### are you talking about? In terms of Survivor perks, that chapter has REALLY solid ones.
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Second Wind is fine, at least on a fundamental level. If anything about it needs to change it would be the Numbers.
But right now, it's a perk that complements altruistic playstyles. If you heal people in your normal gameplay then the perk is extremely useful, even if the Killer tries to tunnel you if you can loop him for 30 seconds you get the health state anyways.
Otherwise it's straight up better than DS or Adrenaline due to the free health state being given twice and isn't temporary.
However if you aren't usually altruistic then the perk isn't as good, since you'd be going out of your way just to proc it thus spending more time than normal.
Since I like to run a medic build anyways I use Second Wind all the time and get a lot of use out of it.
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Which means it's not free. Especially in a no heal meta.
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You want it changed to BT? So it's pointless if the rescuer has BT. Feel like you just made the perk useless.
If you're wanting a BT effect added to it, I think you are balancing it more towards fun than fair.
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The reality is that the majority of survivor perks could be deleted from the game and no one would care.
Because if it's not good enough to be one of the very few useful perks, who will run it?
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I give them credit for that and only
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I didn't use this perk after like the first week because activating it is just annoying
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I mean it got a downside. That's good. Not like DS. Or BT. Or any other extremely strong perk.
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it use to work with ds grabs out of lockers but they fixed that ages ago
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That probably would be a little nutty. Maybe less so now that instaheals aren't quite the same, but it would have been crazy at the time if you were to guaranteed unhook yourself and fully heal right away.
I look at Second Wind as more of an efficiency perk more than anything. You get unhooked, you don't have to waste time healing, you can go straight to a generator. That's anywhere up to 32 charges saved (a little under half a generator)- maybe more if you're Mangled.
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No heal meta is overrated unless you are facing Plague or Legion.
If you are so confident in not going down while injured then why are you injured?
Regardless the better you are at looping until a specific thresh hold (however long you need to loop in order to never get hit) the more valuable healing is. Meaning that as you become more and more skilled the better it is to be healed.
Basically, being healed among other things doubles(ish) your next chase's length at the cost of 32 seconds (or less with perks or a medkit). If you can loop for more than 32 seconds without getting hit then you will always profit on time by healing, perks can lower the time requirement.
In my case I run both Second Wind and Well Make it. That's effectively 2 heals in 16 seconds. Thus even if each of us can loop for only 8 seconds it's worth the time spent healing.
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It's a good change and would provide better synergies with certain perks, however it needs to not provide better anti-camping/tunnelling power than BT. BT can be very powerful in the right hands (normally SWF groups), anything offering more power would be downright OP.
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I like to think of it like a more efficient Solidarity. You run it on a healer build so no one has to worry about healing the healer.
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Btw. How does Solidarity and Second Wind work with skill checks? I've been looking to run Autodidact but I'm worried it has anti-synergy in one way or another.
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I think the activation conditions need a buff rather than the perk's effect.
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As long as it doesn't stack with BT and timer reduced to 20 sec. I can't see any problem with having a perk like that in game.
Right now it is beyond underwhelming. It is basically useless. You have to heal someone full state, which we now could take a while to accomplish, before you get hooked. And don't get down immateriality after your perk activated. It has so many conditions limiting its usage.
In its current state, the only time I run that perk when trying out Adept Steve. Even then I think I never even got to use it in game once.
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I think it's less about Second Wind not being good enough and more that their are other perks that are too good and simply overshadowing it.
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You are right, the condition now is a bit tricky, if your teamate heal 1% second wind dont’ activate, maybe a reduction from heal 1 health state to heal 50% of a health state?
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The only perk with a comparable effect is Solidarity, and Second Wind is a bit more reliable and efficient than Solidarity at the cost of reusability and speed.
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I'm not referring to literal effects of similarity but other perks that are simply better in general.
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I believe that a good buff for the perk could be that as much as the health state you have healed is how much you will be healed getting off the hook so if you get it to like 99 you'll be healed 99
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I prefer to be at full health as well. But so many people think the best play is to always not heal. It can make something like Second Wind hard to get.
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I'd rather run Inner Strength, much easier to find a totem to cleanse than trying to heal another survivor. Plus Inner Strength gives you the option to heal when you want, while Second Wind can only be activated after getting unhooked, if you're lucky to have already healed another survivor that is. Maybe changing the condition for Second Wind to activate by doing a safe unhook or if you do a gen then after being unhooked it activates.
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I always just explain myself in the pregame chat. It's much easier to get heals when they know to let you beforehand
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Unfortunately it's not an option for use console scrubs.
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So what if you have second wind and somebody also has borrowed time?
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Rip. I've always found the pregame chat to be by far the most underrated tool solo Survivors have access too. I always make sure my team knows my build and to let me go for the saves whenever possible (I have Kindred and Well Make It to get my teammate out safely and heal them up afterwards). I do this every single game without exception because even that little bit of communication goes a long way.
Shame you can't do the same, it really is helpful.
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My problems with this perk is that first - it feels more like punishment after you get unhooked that you are broken while u get healed. I dont see why u have to be broken. It is just simple heal that you get ove 30 seconds. If there is a survivor with any healing perks he may do it faster for u and I don't see why that perk should block that ? And second it gets to activate only twice after you heal someone else which may be hard to do very often before you get hooked, I usually get it once while I run something to find injured people. I just dont think it is worth. It is way better to get healed or bring a med.
What I think they should do is make it not broken and make it to heal to full even if u have BT aka if you get tunneled/unsafe unhooked so atleast it does a bit more from time to time
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@Peanits @not_Queen can I please get an answer for this? It's kinda important information.
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They don't fully stack. BT will proc and then second wind treats DW as a separate health state. You will remain injured afterwards.
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Oh I meant with Joshua's proposed buff. Sorry, I'm still new to forums and learning to use and talk on them
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Ah. In that case the answer is not applicable. They apply the effects on different targets, so there is nothing to stack.
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Maybe removing unhooked condition may help. That is one of the biggest limitation. Perk can be activated by healing X amount of survivors and passively heals you when you are injured not just unhooked.
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You have to restore health state, so they work together pretty good.
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Ok but it's not just tracking if I complete a heal, but also the amount of progress I contribute.
If bonus progression from Autodidact doesn't count towards that then it's a bad combo at high stacks due to it skipping over progression from the perk.
If the bonus progression from Autodidact DOES count towards it then it's a bad combo at LOW stacks due to that including the negative bonus from the first 2 procs.
Either way it's positive utility in the other scenario.
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Considering it’s not easy to get one full heal (on average) I think the time to heal should be lowered to like 24/20/16s. Compared to Nancy’s Inner Strength, jumping into a locker whenever you’re injured for 8secs is much better.
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