Visit the Kill Switch Master List for more information on this and other current known issues: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/299-kill-switch-master-list
How can we be more diverse in dbd after the LGBTQIA2S+ character
Comments
-
You don’t have to read the lore, which is already FULL of real life stuff others might try to escape from. And maybe there are people that want to escape from the reality of explicit exclusion and discrimination.
and no, you are not supposed to feel represented in a video game. But others would like to.
if you really think a video game can’t be fun when there are LGBTQ+ characters included… well.. i don’t know what to say..
1 -
It did actually...people actually complained because killers would avoid killing people with the LGBTQIA+ flag on their characters because they would threaten people in comments on steam and in game chat to report them.....which is exactly what we thought was going to happen....
Post edited by Rizzo on2 -
I feel that way when game studios make black characters with saggy pants, a basketball, an afro pic, and use handguns as their main weapon....back in the day you'd get dumpster for putting out those stereotypes....but apparently this generation likes being stereotyped. I mean hell, they still think my people are too poor/illiterate/uneducated/downtrodden to use our ID's to vote....so....I been here a while I've seen closet racism in the form of "helping" constantly, especially racism against white people which is the popular thing to do these days in America.....people in the LGBT community are gonna have to deal with the same stuff....all I can say is buckle up and stand for being normal...not an obsession, and don't let people sell you, your group, or who you are as an individual out for profit....cause honestly thats all these companies care about at the end of the day anyway....
2 -
Ever heard of false flagging? Chances are some of those people just wanted to throw shade against the the pride flag.
also, it happened before. Because of playernames including anything LGBTQ+ related or with another ‚reason‘ (characters that are people of color for example)
2 -
So are you in favor of having black characters represented as thugs or naw? Or would you prefer every caucasian character represented as some form of southerner with a cowboy hat? Or a hispanic character with a sombrero and miraccas more your style?
I'm curious cause none of those stereotypes represent real people I see everyday who are in those groups.....so which one is more realistic?
2 -
1) LGBTQIA+. The plus is there for the exact reason as you put LGBTQIAwhateverelse, to acknowledge the rest, except it actually remains respectful while doing so, hence why most of my comments use lgbt+. Thought it'd be helpful to know.
2) Vocal minority being heard over silent majority. As is usually the case in this community. How many creators or regular players do you see that say "WOW HOMOPHOBIC YOU KILLED ME WITH THE CHARM"? Compare that to the amount who do. You probably can't create an accurate number because you just don't notice it, since they're usually the silent majority.
2 -
Then bad news considering video games are an artform, and Art represents a distorted version of reality 99% of the time. All you need is to squint at the deeper meanings and the true meaning of the game becomes clear. Games like Celeste, for example, do this wonderfully.
2 -
How do you do it? Subtly, in the backstories of characters, like they did with Claudette's tome.
2 -
Could even be blunt about it. I could see an Autistic survivor having a perk related to aural sensitivity, making them hear footsteps or killer noises more clearly.
2 -
I'm not looking for deeper meanings in video games. I'm looking for reckless fun, cool characters and shiny loot to have my reckless fun with.
5 -
I don't see how the inclusion of a gay character takes away from any of that. You can still find those in the game.
This is for those who are into lore, are into character development things that are just as part of a video game as those things you've listed.
6 -
Then don't squint at the lore and continue to have fun it won't change anything. Doesn't change the fact all the games you've enjoyed have had at least some form of social commentary to them
5 -
I'd be for the perk idea but the design of teachable perks means that other survivors would be able to as well which would be a bit weirder.
I'm not autistic so if you think that it being blunt could work then 100% advocate for it!
1 -
Literally never said that so don't put words in my mouth. Video games are fun if they are fun. I have tons of fun playing video games that have lgbtq+ characters in them and even play as them in some of them. Why? Because they're fun to play and I couldn't care less what a fictional character is into. Game devs should make what they want to make and not feel pressured into doing anything.
3 -
Never... said... they... did... If a game is fun or any particular character is fun I'll play them. I'm also into lore and character development. I just want that to happen naturally without game devs feeling like someone is screaming at them to do it all the time.
2 -
Good news then: nobody has screamed at the devs for anything, they're the ones who said they'd do it.
5 -
No, and I already said I agreed with that person, but they were misrepresenting themselves and the other person they were arguing with.
(I can't be bothered to look up names right now.)
1 -
Why are we still saying that including LGBTQ+ characters is political? A person’s sexual/romantic attraction has absolutely nothing to do with politics, people can’t be political based on characteristics they don’t control. Is it political for Nurse to have a husband?
5 -
I apologize then.
so, great news: the devs already confirmed they want to be inclusive and add LGBTQ+ chars on their own will. Not because they were pressured. And as survivors are just skins, the chars will be as fun to play as everyone else!
edit: just to be clear, the following paraphrase was actually not meant for KateMain86, I got confused with usernames being similar.
Your problem with GaymerX I don’t understand. But I didn’t look up their work. It just seemed like you had a problem with including LGBTQ+ chars in DbD but maybe you just didn’t know the devs did say they wanted to do it.
3 -
I was talking about gaming in general. Everything should come naturally without fear or obligation.
3 -
You said you aren't looking for deeper meanings in video games. Unless I am mistaken, I took that as you aren't into lore/stories/character development, because those are the aspects where people who are looking for more than just a 3D character model seek to explore.
IMO Devs haven't given any indication that they are going to rush into creating something just for the sake of creating it. So at this point I stay positive that they will bring a great gay character with awesome cosmetics and an awesome storyline.
1 -
Who is GaymerX and did I ever mention them? If a character looks cool I'll play them. I play video games to have fun and spend time with my friends. Thats all that matters to me in the virtual world of entertainment.
1 -
I have confused you with kate_best_girl. So I apologize again. Just went back and saw that. I only ever read the first part of both your names.
0 -
Its fine. After reading back I figured there probably was some sort of confusion there.
1 -
Funny you should mention that. The only things developers add that they didn't want to come as a result of orders from management. However, you'll rarely see anyone accept that LGBT stuff can be added "naturally without fear or obligation". Really makes you think, doesn't it?
EDIT: Just for the record, you know how we get patches, bug fixes, and so on? Those are a direct result of fear of bad press, because no developer is actually obligated to do that. Back when there were no patches, the game was shipped as-is. If you encountered a game-breaking bug, well, tough #########. You had to use a workaround (if one existed), or be left with an unplayable game.
1 -
Thanks, and -since you asked even though out of the confusion- GaymerX are the consultants that help BHVR to avoid adding bad representation or harmful stereotypes. They talked about it in the anniversary stream i think.
1 -
I like the idea that the characters have no real sexuality, so we can project whatever we like onto them. Besides that, the characters are rarely all that consistent so anything political about them like that would just sound shallow anyway. No thanks.
1 -
I like the idea that the characters have no real sexuality, so we can project whatever we like onto them.
They do, though.
Besides that, the characters are rarely all that consistent so anything political about them like that would just sound shallow anyway. No thanks.
We're talking about sexual orientation, not politics. I think you clicked on the wrong thread.
4 -
Political like what? Nothing in OP was referring to something political. And have you read the lore of Jane, Yui or Zarina?
and there are several characters with confirmed heterosexual relationships. Sure they could be bi or pan or maybe even asexual. But being homosexual is kinda out of question for them. And let’s be real, everyone assumes they are heterosexual.
2 -
I know it can be. I look at the world though and wonder sometimes how much really does influence people's creative decisions.
0 -
I did some research this morning on the train. GaymerX are a non-profit LGBT+ organisation formed in 2012. They hold gaming conventions to promote queer work, or work featuring queer characters and subject matters. They work with smaller devs to allow them to attend other large-scale conventions too, and get in contact with bigger devs, as well as help those bigger devs gain a more diverse cast. Most importantly, they work with as many devs as possible to help educate them on the best ways to go about representing lgbt+ characters in their works. The non-profit was formed by lgbt+ people and employs many lgbt+ and non-lgbt+ people.
Edit: if people wanna read themselves here's the "About Us" page on their website.
2 -
It's a holdover from our rights being tied up in legal systems overseen by elected representatives who use our existence to sway votes one way or another. Just one of those things that the quagmire of democracy, bureaucracy and miscommunication has created.
3 -
Some of Van Gogh's paintings were influenced by his stay at an asylum. They're still beautiful.
Einstein's theory on the photoelectric effect was influenced by a mathematician who reached a result he couldn't understand. The theory is still valid in physics.
The Doom franchise was influenced by one of the developers' "stint" making Commander Keen games. Doom is still fun to play.
Marie Curie was influenced by sexism. She is still one of the greatest scientists of all time who made an enormous contribution to science.
Everything you've ever enjoyed, seen, or heard about was influenced by something else, because things don't exist in a vacuum.
2 -
Well its a tough job I'm sure. It feels like the world adds something new every 5 seconds to the list of harmful stereotypes, alongside with coming up with things to be offended by because reasons.
1 -
I know what you mean. Right now, the main thing to be offended by seems to be LGBT and/or non-white people being present in video games. I started playing Vampyr, which features an LGBT couple, an interracial couple, and non-white people in general who don't fit their respective stereotypes, and you can't imagine the Steam threads.
1 -
Not interested in those characters, but I don't recall anything in particular other than Jane getting embarrassed on TV and driving off a cliff.
It's up to interpretation. Maybe you assume they're all heterosexual, but that doesn't mean everyone does. Characters like Ash are undeniably hetero based on Evil Dead, but there's nothing I've seen from other characters I like that would suggest their sexuality one way or the other. Honestly it's a lot more fun with them as semi-blank canvases than anything set in stone.
1 -
If you're going to pull the "but they might be bisexual" card, then keep in mind that's not an argument against having explicitly LGBT relationships, the same way there are explicitly non-LGBT relationships.
Furthermore, you should also keep in mind that we're not debating whether LGBT characters should be added or not, because they are coming, no matter what. At this point, arguing about that is like arguing with a meteorologist that it's not actually going to rain while the first droplets are already hitting the ground.
4 -
if you are so uninvited in the current lore, you should not have a problem with LGBTQ+ inclusion - which will solely affecting the lore and nothing more.
and again, this thread was not about politics at all, so i wondered why you would bring politics up at all?
3 -
I think you're assuming a lot.
0 -
Can you be specific? The devs have already said an LGBT character is coming, so that's a given. What am I assuming, exactly?
4 -
So... Yui's Story of female empowerment and rejection traditional gender roles wasn't political? Zarina's Story of coming to terms with her true identity and accepting herself instead of hiding behind a fake persona to fit in with the crowd, with the entire identity issue being race-based, wasn't political either?
You either care about the lore or you don't, pick one
3 -
That I was gonna say everyone is bi, which I wasn't, and that I'm in denial that they'd ever introduce a character that's LGBT lol I just prefer things being neutral and characters being open to interpretation. Just like that one dude thinks everyone is hetero, some other person might think they're all gay. That's the fun of keeping things ambiguous.
0 -
Apart from the fact that straight relationships have been confirmed in lore with a couple characters so your argument falls flat.
3 -
I said "if", because it wasn't clear what you meant.
I already told you they're not ambiguous, though. Several characters are (or were) in explicitly heterosexual relationships.
Finally, like @GoodBoyKaru said, you either care about the lore or you don't. Pick a lane.
4 -
Which would have been fine, if not for the fact that the Devs added heterosexual relationships, apologised for the oversight, and promised to add LBGT+ inclusion as well.
Also, what politics?
4 -
I feel like you guys are too eager to tear any opinion apart so later lol
1 -
No, we're having a conversation. I dunno what you expected would happen, but discussions don't happen with people all agreeing with each other.
Anyway, I hope you learned that there are explicitly heterosexual relationships in the lore and that, if you don't care about the lore, it won't make a difference to you when they add LGBT relationships.
Later.
4 -
For better or for worse though is what I meant. A lot of things in the world lately are being influenced by activism and other things. Is the world more peaceful today because of it? Lately it seems like hatred is more popular than peace simply because people disagree with each other.
0 -
Well, that would certainly make for a fascinating discussion where I would point out historical patterns, false-flag attacks, bad faith actors, and so on, but it's not for this thread.
2
