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Hillbilly C tier according to otz new vid !
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In public queue it doesn't really mean much. Scott Jund had a 50 win streak with speed limiter old Bubba. If I play during certain hours then 9 out of 10 teams I can just 4k on autopilot, because that's just the nature of matchmaking. But during other hours when there are few red rank killers online, then I get survivors with thousands of hours each and I'd take Billy over Plague any day of the week.
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you can look by yourself on these forums or watch former billy main vids. look the post above me thats says he switched to bubba due to the big billy nerfs,you will see many posts like this here. Ask yourself why billies are something rarer than mewtwo
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Punishing how exactly? You should rarely be running into it with most add-on combinations.
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It really goes to show how little people play and understand Billy's power when you have those saying his new update is because he was balanced for old DBD. Ok, now Billy doesnt have to deal with infinites and pallet vacuum lets destroy his power and all addons because we forgot to add "Does not stack" to his addons.
Against GOOD survivors Billy is C tier. Being able to get around the map quick so you can M1lly everyone doesn't mean anything. The amount of time and skill required to be able to curve anything consistently is the highest in the game, more than nurse or spirit. And all that practice and time gets thrown out the window because you hit a single invisible pixel on a collision box, and the survivor gets a 5 second head start. Even if you manage to down them, you can't down any of their friends nearby because you will overheat unless you wait 15-30 seconds, allowing the downed survivor to recover 9 times out of 10.
Billy was balanced, you could escape him if he messed up, and you could mindgame him as well and sidestep. His cooldown alone was long enough for survivors to make it to another loop. Now you get punished for mistakes twice, with cooldown and overheat. Survivors prefer autoaim m1 killers because you can be braindead and still win against them.
I'm tired of these M1lly mains thinking they have a say in how powerful his power should be when they can't even curve autohaven cars. And for those who think the overheat is the problem, It wouldn't be if his hitboxes worked like they used to. Now you literally SLIDE off survivors you would have snapped to and instadowned. Backrevving M1llys won't notice a difference.
For those who don't know Billy was nerfed twice, the 4.1 update and the 3.7 update. Both absolutely gutting what made Billy fun to play. Let's nerf huntress basekit because Iri head exists, and then remove iri head. Let's nerf Myers basekit because tombstone exists, and then remove tombstone. I wish half of the people thinking they know what is best for Billy would go and play him pre patch 3.7.
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On it’s own a win streak means little, I agree. But he tried win streaks using all the killers so I assume he’s using his experience of each one to inform where he placed them.
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Blight is plenty jank with the collision hitboxes. It's just that his fun factor is more than his jank factor which him makes him bearable.
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You described EVERYTHING PERFECTLY. I truly hope a dev will look your post and make a change.
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Totally agree about Billy. I'd be happy with low A or high B, but C tier?! No no no.
I trust Otz and I agree with most of the placements here, but Plague A tier with Freddy B and Billy C just feels off to me. I do feel Demo is underrated by the community, but Freddy and Demo in the same tier feels crazy.
I'd probably go with Freddy A, Wraith B, Demo C, Plague C. Legion above five killers with only common add-ons just seems wrong to me too, but I'm not sure I'd want to move anyone else to C. Mayyyyyybe Clown or Pig? I'd probably just stick with a six-killer D tier.
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The overheat mechanic does nothing but HURT good Billys who didn't sit at hook with their chainsaw 99ed. Newer players will not play him at all when you can play a killer that aims his M1 for you. If you are half decent you will be using your chainsaw 90% of the time, 10% they are vaulting a window or pallet and you can sneak a m1 in.
All the "skilled Billys" quit. They didn't adapt to a dumpster fire of a killer, they switched to Nurse/Spirit/Freddy in public games. Those who did "adapt" did so purely for the nostalgia and the sheer amount of time they invested into this killer. He has a higher skill cap for less reward.
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You guys should seriously stop going against trash survivors who don't really know how to play against him and then come here saying Billy is A tier.
His antiloop is not great lmao. Not having any charge add-ons to compensate for the penality of the Engravings can be a big deal against good loopers and the roar makes it easier for survivors to react to you coming around corners. It just takes people who actually know how to play against him to show that.
Bubba, Oni and Blight are better killers with much better add-ons.
Billy has been outclassed by his similars and other killers that are way easier to play while still being very good.
People just don't understand how much not having any charge time and cooldown add-ons at all hurt him.
He went from having too much to absolutely nothing.
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Imagine if Spirit roared when she started phasing...
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I dont think this tier list is perfect, but i can understand why Billy is in C-tier. The data for this tierlist is from custom matches. 4 survivor with over 3000 hour against a killer main with similar hours. For Billy it was a player from a tournament team. So this tierlist is not so important for matches against average red ranks.
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There's also Deathslinger with instant ADS and shoot, but all of that is more balanced and fair in the eyes of the devs because it's not an insta down ability :)
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When you start playing dbd and pick billy,you give up because he is very frustrating and hard to play. Usually newbie billies bump into everything and are almost exclusively m1s. So we have high ranks that knows how to dance with billy unfortunately.
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I never had a problem with billy at the start. Rank 20-11 were so bad, i could chainsaw them easily. Billy was the first killer i reached red rank with.
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Yeah, she is.
- Zero mobility
- Mediocre chase
- Unreliable debuffs
If she gets lucky as hell, and survivors are dumb enough to let her get 1-2 downs before a gen gets down, she's might be able to go as high as C tier, but you can't rely on that.
If she's unlucky, or survivors know how to loop an M1 killer for more than 60 seconds, she's dogshit.
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I was there too, before his nerf I never used add ons anyways so the only thing I cared about was the overheat mechanic and at first I was okay with it the overheat dissipated pretty quick and its build up was manageable then they made it worse cause people were having too much fun or something idk.
After they renerfed him I continued to play him and it was just awful even running his better overheat addons the brown and yellow, only made it feel okay, but then I couldn't play him without those addons and that felt bad on top of my annoyance with the overheat mechanic.
Then the final nail in the coffin and why I just cant play Billy anymore is the new sounds associated with his nerf, the chainsaw getting more high pitched the higher the overheat was just another mild annoyance, then his stupid roar every time you start a sprint was funny at first and now is just another stacking annoyance.
It all culminated in Billy going from by far my favorite killer to the point of basically only playing him to now me honestly hating playing him.
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if survivors are running in a straight line without looking behind i can understand you didn’t had a problem,but that applies to nurse and every other killers that needs skills as well. Billy is very rare in red ranks so i cant imagine in rank 20-11 he is picked. The only few times i played against a billy 9/10 times they couldn’t control his chainsaw and were mediocre m1 billy players.
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I have no idea who this person is but I'm assuming that he's a streamer, and if anyone's an expert on objective, non-sensationalized analysis, it's streamers.
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True, Blight can def be janky especially on maps like swamp, as you say though I just enjoy him that much I can live with it.
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In terms of addons? C-Tier, maybe D-Tier.
Basekit? Definitely B-A Tier.
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He was already pretty easy to deal with around small loops prior to his nerfs so it's not surprising that he has him at below-average.I am surprised how low he put Ghostface and Myers though, I know that they struggle to apply pressure early game but they both have great snowballing. Myers is a killer I pip most of my games with.
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I love this idea because it takes longer to rev a cold chainsaw compared to a hot one
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I used to main billy most loops are either too long to get your saw reved in time to flick a hit or too low down to have any mindgamen at that point he is a m1 killer with occasional one hits and decent mobility
Also I'm ok with the overheat because i used to get mad that i would dodge like 10 chainsaw hits but go down to the 11th one but few of the addons changes were good engravings make you take like 40% heat to go faster for possible 5s because a tree is in the way
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Exactly even just spark plug was enough to get a Flick hit at a jungle gym event then it wasn't guaranteed if they didn't take the window
Now I need to eat. Stun and use it within 30s
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I'll put this into perspective
( demo is better than Billy)
he can tp to any portal in 5s Billy has. 4s charge time and them x time to get there any objects will add another 4s
Then demo will move at 96% base while holding shred as of the update that takes .5s and he can hold it like deathslinger to zone they vault that's a pounce they fake you cancel that's a m1 if they make it to pallet somehow its gone in 1.5s
Billy can rev and flick that may be a down if they go for the window if not you have a 3s slow down so they get distance on you again you miss to many time 30s cooldown where you are a m1 killer m1 you just spent 25s for an insta down to end up with a m1 compared to demo where he got a injure in half that time
you need mediocre survivors to do good with billy now compared the king that could compete with nurse
Post edited by onemind on2 -
Ghostface is very map dependent. Get Hawkins and his power really excels due to all the LoS blockers. Get Blood Lodge and good luck every catching anyone off guard let alone get any stalks for quick downs. Because he's really map dependent it's really hard to rate him above C, because his performance varies too much.
Myer's kit is just a bit outdated and struggles to keep up. Myers starts 105, has to build up stalk to become a normal killer, and then has to stalk more to get access to his super mode which is just a 60 second expose, longer lunge, and faster vault. It's not bad, but it's kind of weak given how much he has to build his power. Compared to Oni who starts off at 115, has an easier time building up his power as he just needs to M1 one person to start getting blood, and doesn't even have a limit to how many times he can fury unlike Myers.
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Dude, just bc a random in the internet said this it don't has to be like that.
Beside that, C Tier means 'barely gets a 1K against a efficient team"
And I'm sorry, that's not true. A good Billy can be very oppressive and stressful in a chase and will punish you for muss playing. Unlike Bubba, Billy is able to catch you before you make it to the pallet/window. Great mobility too.
We can discuss about A or B tier. But it's more likely A. A good Billy will chainsaw through the casuals and can absolutely manage a 2K against an efficient team.
Just bc most of the people can't play him doesn't makes him bad. Same like Nurse. Just bc most players can't play her does not mean she's weak.
I agree that some add-ons could get changed. And I don't mean that cool down add-ons or charge time add-ons should be a thing.
I also agree that his animations should receive a massive update. They're awkward.
The overheat pretends spam and punishes you for holding it like 10 minutes. That's makes it more difficult being good as Billy but not impossible.
So whatever Otz or who cares who, says. He's is still like you and like me a random from the internet. And just bc he said this doesn't mean it be like that.
Why? Bc He can't be a Main of every killer. He plays them a few times and then anylizes things. And he watches other Killer Specific Mains to get an answer and it seems like he couldn't found one.
If he starts playing Billy consistently, trying to use everything a Billy can do and what so ever, I wouldn't be surprised if he changes his mind.
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It's fine to like someone but stop acting like they are the end all be all of , in this case this game.
And apart from that what does it matter? It's like discrimination, there will always be a difference in potential.
Heck.im pretty sure it even mentioned this, that if you are the worst of for example gods, you are still a god....
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He has a very strong basekit but his add ons are ass.
Compared to some of A tier killers he is also harder to master so in terms of enjoyment and power, I think C tier is fine for him, maybe lower B tier even
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And that's his personal opinion based on his own playing experiences. Besides nurse and spirit on top, nothing there on his list is definitive facts - it's where he personally believes the killers place in accordance with one another. I agree with very little of his thinking here, but that's usually how opinions work.
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they won't. you know what else is high on Otz tier-list? Freddy, He's B-tier. He will be joining Billy in C-tier. He might be so bad to the point that he joins D-tier or even F-tier but people won't realize this until .... 1 year later after the change. Billy has been low-tier for.... a long time, just community is slow to adjust. Too many bad survivors in solo-queue.
I mean they could give back Billy's instantsaw add-on by removing their drawback and freddy changes... but they won't because survivors asked for these changes and killers have to live with consequences with them. Its just how cookie crumbles.
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If people listended to intro he said C-Tier is still above average. Billy isn't bad. It's just others got better. Same with Myers.
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Maybe you all should watch his videos and listen to what he says instead of just read the headlines "ooh he said what, billy c-tier???".
He literally said a lot of things that people wrote here in this thread - Billys cooldown is no real issue, his add ons are absolutely laughable, he is hard to learn and to play against good survivors, he punishes your own mistakes very hard, but is still oppressive when played flawlessly due to instadown + mobility ...
Don't get hung up so much on the tier thing, i also wouldn't put him in C tier but as he said in another video, killers right now are much more balanced than 1-2 years ago and even the weaker ones can be played successfully in higher levels. There are some outliers like Trickster but that's it.
Imo she is, but that doesn't mean she is unplayably bad. The difference between the different tiers is pretty small right now. Other killers around her got buffed (Clown and Wraith) and most of her abilities are very mediocre at best. Her chasing tool is maybe the weakest in the game, her stealth is situational and mediocre, she has no mobility, the only really good thing about her are the stalling bear traps (when combined with good add ons). She is a noob stomper but struggles against good survivors.
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He compared him to bubba also and said you need much more effort with him to have the same pressure bubba can apply. Billy was nerfed 1 year ago but the game is exactly the same. Maps have become extremely difficult to curve,and against new rework maps its almost a guaranteed loss(crotus penn,autoheaven etc). The players have become better and the maps have become harder for him,so this huge nerf isnt justified.
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I know many people complain about his PoV and animations. I am still confused what they mean, I don't really recognize anything, or do you mean the limping?
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Look pre nerf billy videos on youtube and see the differences
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I did not see any footage (it would be nice to see the current state with the state when his animations were fine). And some point they redone the animations for Billy and Wraith (e.g. give Billy his limping when carrying a Survivor) and during the same Patch, his first person animations were janky as hell. Like, really horrible.
They fixed a lot of that, but he still feels quite odd. As I said, I cannot really put my finger on it, it is really hard to describe.
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Ya know it's got credibility when Otz has like 50 Win Streaks on each of them?
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He talk about Freddy after the nerf, and demo after the buff have some really good add on
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Notice the position of the hammer and the movement of the camera and his arms after a chainsaw sprint.
For some reason, they bugged all of this to where the hammer stays very low and the camera shakes all over the place after a chainsaw sprint.
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Very nicely explained. Most people who say billy change was fine cannot play billy any skillful way. Previously before his nerf you would see Billy in tournament level, but no tournament billys don't exist
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Freddy isn't going to be d tier after his nerfs. People really got to stop overreacting considering the worst nerf Freddy got wasn't even a direct one, it was the bt change.
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Look, i love Otz and he does try not to jump to conclusions, but he still does have a tendency to overreact despite that fact and this is an example of it. He was never much of a Billy player before the overheat mechanic which only nerfs really bad backreving Billy players, and not the skillful ones
Don't get me wrong, I don't think it was necessary, but it didn't just suddenly nerf the fun out of him. And even so, fun isn't what puts killers into different tiers - potential for good players that main said killer does.
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Read that post :
GargledFire Posts: 21 April 29
It really goes to show how little people play and understand Billy's power when you have those saying his new update is because he was balanced for old DBD. Ok, now Billy doesnt have to deal with infinites and pallet vacuum lets destroy his power and all addons because we forgot to add "Does not stack" to his addons.
Against GOOD survivors Billy is C tier. Being able to get around the map quick so you can M1lly everyone doesn't mean anything. The amount of time and skill required to be able to curve anything consistently is the highest in the game, more than nurse or spirit. And all that practice and time gets thrown out the window because you hit a single invisible pixel on a collision box, and the survivor gets a 5 second head start. Even if you manage to down them, you can't down any of their friends nearby because you will overheat unless you wait 15-30 seconds, allowing the downed survivor to recover 9 times out of 10.
Billy was balanced, you could escape him if he messed up, and you could mindgame him as well and sidestep. His cooldown alone was long enough for survivors to make it to another loop. Now you get punished for mistakes twice, with cooldown and overheat. Survivors prefer autoaim m1 killers because you can be braindead and still win against them.
I'm tired of these M1lly mains thinking they have a say in how powerful his power should be when they can't even curve autohaven cars. And for those who think the overheat is the problem, It wouldn't be if his hitboxes worked like they used to. Now you literally SLIDE off survivors you would have snapped to and instadowned. Backrevving M1llys won't notice a difference.
For those who don't know Billy was nerfed twice, the 4.1 update and the 3.7 update. Both absolutely gutting what made Billy fun to play. Let's nerf huntress basekit because Iri head exists, and then remove iri head. Let's nerf Myers basekit because tombstone exists, and then remove tombstone. I wish half of the people thinking they know what is best for Billy would go and play him pre patch 3.7.
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I think BT change is least of Freddy concerns. I think he's going be C-tier because they forgot to nerf his teleport at generators. maybe they should double cooldown so it becomes more apparent.
Dream world for post-nerf Freddy has no effect. he gets slowdown when holding a fully charged snare and slowdown for about 0.75-1 second after placing a snare which entirely counter-acts the hinder effect for walking over a snare and they removed swing chains and jump rope which were only add-on that punished you for being in dream world and if that wasn't bad enough. Clocks gives 30 second immunity to dream world while also extending the automatic sleep timer by 30 seconds for total of 90 seconds, so passively, Freddy will have less survivors in the dream world even if his other powers weren't touched.
People will figure out his C-tier status after a year. its same as billy. It just takes a while.
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Ah okay, it does feel a bit better if he's taking those nerfs and buffs into account. I'll have to play them before I know how I feel about B tier, but it makes sense that nerfs to Freddy and buffs to Demo would drag them both towards the middle.
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I just compared him to demo so now I'll compair him to bubba
Same as last time billy can flick around a corner with a 4s charge time to possible down asumeing they go straight for a window if. Not you have a 3s stun now where they run to a pallet and repeate this process until you overheat or get them
Billy has a better mobility without doubt but mobility can only take a killer so far
With addons well theres only one good one
Bubba has a 4s charge time without addons his saw lasts 9s 12 with chillie while moving faster than normal
He also has full control over his power allowing red stain mind games while insta downing if he Fails to hit he has a 5s slow down where they can run 3s for a token back 9a for all 3 he can also deny any hook bombing and is almost never a m1 killer except at t n l
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The good Billies were good enough that they never had to worry about hitting overheat. They regulated when they could use their chainsaw, and those who could hit chainsaws accurately saw no change. Plus, we don't have actual stats on the number and kill rates of Billy pre and post rework, which was also affected by the add-ons changes so it's even harder to tell.
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Looking on the forums and counting games is not a consistent indication of anything. I play rank 5 when I do play survivor and the distribution of killers ebbs and flows every day. That's basic statistics 101.
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