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Something needs to be done about the "Go next" epidemic
Comments
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I disagree that survivors have zero comeback factors(though it is much harder for survivors to comeback than killers, by design,) nor are they as necessary as in mobas. Survivors start at a position of advantage vs the killer, which gets equalized and then reversed as resources and hook states get used up. That said, the progress of generators is not always visible, and while there might be 4 gens left, they can also have multiple ranges of progress. Its very easy to misjudge progress, which leads to either side thinking things are weighted in either direction when not having that information.
That said, survivors can come back from bad matches, all it takes is an efficiency redistribution. One bad chase can do a lot of damage depending on how many resources remain, and can lead to 4 gens remaining to drop to 1-2 gens remaining in a short period of time due to a single good play. The situation then resets to macro play comparison, with the killer needing to reassess switching targets and restoring their pressure or doubling down on a sunk cost scenario. Either way, stopping snowball pressure is very possible in the game, regardless of how probable it is in any given game where the survivors are currently losing. In games like LoL you have a lot more access to a lot more information on these things, while in DBD you need to both deduce and memorize all of it based on HUD status bars and knowing which gens they apply to.
I argue that the majority of survivors who claim their matches are lost do not put in nearly that amount of deduction or effort and instead just preemptively make that decision for the rest of their team out of whatever frustration they are feeling at the time. And in a game where you're not even required to have as much patience as most other online games, its often both extremely premature, and one persons resignation dooms their entire team. If the game had pop in/out it would be a different story, but this one is not designed for it.
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I wasn't trying to imply survivors have lost as soon as they are at the mildest disadvantage. Though a mild disadvantage against one killer is a massive one against another. Also some killers are much better at accumulating advantages than others. This is the point where we would have to look at details.
I argue that the majority of survivors who claim their matches are lost do not put in nearly that amount of deduction or effort
Agreed. I think I've described that twice. Though if your game gets called by a hard-tilting dude you'd be likely not getting back in anyway.
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All reasonable points. The only thing I'd add is that unfortunately its not so much about whether the quitter would have carried the game, but more that they are basically making that decision for their 3 other teammates. That weight is why its so important, since one person thinking the game is lost removes what chance is left for the others. And since hatch still exists the way it does, this then leads to both sides playing around it: slugging for the 4k, survivors trying to out hide each other (and even delaying to server shutdown) and other related issues. The faster survivors lose a chance at realistically powering the exit gates, the sooner the game devolves to that state. Thats why I put so much emphasis on the match lengths, because the consequences of quitting are so far reaching compared to how little time investment is actually expected of a given match. With changes like the kick limit and everything else done to address 3 gen scenarios with certain killers, stall tactics are considerably less effective than they used to be on the killer side, so even slow losses aren't much compared to a lot of other online games. Even many times in DBD's own past.
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I agree solo Q needs some love but as a 1.9 K hours survivor main I think you exagerate.
The number of early impulsive self-kills on hook is a bit too high IMO, it just shouldn't be a thing.
You don't mention that when you unhook these survivors, most of the time they keep playing the game, because they change their mind.
Also yes a team can fall behind fast because of one survivor mistake, but the team can come back with one good chase.
The game snowballs hard both ways…
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I meant the quitter being uncarriable. I'm not getting into these issues. I've done enough of that recently. Also those are not on any quitter. Game should become free to leave instead of replacing with bots in my opinion.
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Unfortunately this is sort of a problem the playerbase made itself. Everyone wanted to sit in the "win at all costs" bed so much, now we all have to lie in it.
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So the second one person leaves, everyone else should be able to jump ship? What does that do concerning consumables that were spent on the match by either side? How would you address things like that without still punishing those players while also not making it something where people could quit matches early to prevent others from having theirs spent, like a quarter on a string for offerings or addons? Killers especially would be able to tunnel one person out asap to try to force a DC, then get unlimited addons for doing so, or survivors would be able to burn through killer addons every time someone gives up on games where they wouldn't even be able to recoup the bloodweb cost of the addon, let alone the nodes to reach it. Either way you've already created another problem by taking the easy way out instead of actually addressing the underlying problem. Changes like that are why so many issues have cascaded into new issues over the years.
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You don't mention that when you unhook these survivors, most of the time they keep playing the game, because they change their mind.
I don't mention that because that doesn't happen. When someone decides they want out of a match, they mean it, and they will make your life a living hell if you deny them that. Each time I've unhooked someone who was trying to throw, I ended up regretting it.
"But refusing to participate is bannable." Sure, but 1) they're not going to bother banning that many people for it, and 2) they will find ways out of a match even without griefing. For example, by sitting on a gen/totem/chest and letting the Killer snatch them from it.
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DBD: The only game where players will defend throwing.
Boo hoo. you queued up to play, you should have to play. if the games in such a bad state then quit, stop ruining everyone elses matches.1 -
Fun fact: People throw because the match is already ruined. Staying won't change the outcome.
And not once did I say that I'm the one who throws every match. I'm not going to say I've never done it, because let's face it, it's happened to all of us at some point. So quit with your accusations, and quit complaining about other people ruining your matches. There's always the next one.
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