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[No Mither Rework] You judge.
Original: You are affected by the Broken Status Effect for the duration of the Trial. Your thick blood coagulates practically instantly.
- You don't leave pools of Blood.
- Grunts of pain caused by injuries are reduced by 0/25/50 % at any time.
- Grants the ability to fully recover from the Dying State.
Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button when recovered to 25%. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trial.
Comments
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This is a nerf to the perk. No Mither is fine as it is.
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To be honest this is a much better buff not a nerf. Barley anyone uses No Mither because it doesn't give you much benefits. If a killer sees you running No Mither, their not going to leave you on the ground. Plus your one hit all the time. So if you mess up, your dead. The only benefit to No mither is the no bleeding effect. Which this buff/rework would be focusing on. The instantly recover effect is a little...weird. Does this effect Unbreakable?
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@TheEdgeGamer said:
To be honest this is a much better buff not a nerf. Barley anyone uses No Mither because it doesn't give you much benefits. If a killer sees you running No Mither, their not going to leave you on the ground. Plus your one hit all the time. So if you mess up, your dead. The only benefit to No mither is the no bleeding effect. Which this buff/rework would be focusing on. The instantly recover effect is a little...weird. Does this effect Unbreakable?I have to agree. This would be much better than what No Mither is now.
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@TheEdgeGamer said:
The instantly recover effect is a little...weird. Does this effect Unbreakable?No, it wouldn't. Unbreakable only works when you fully recover using the recover button. This one would work only when you press the action button. You could still run both of them without making the other useless.
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@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
No, it wouldn't. Unbreakable only works when you fully recover using the recover button. This one would work only when you press the action button. You could still run both of them without making the other useless.Ok. That was my major concern. Good idea, BTW.
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@TheEdgeGamer said:
Ok. That was my major concern. Good idea, BTW.Thanks.
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As I was typing up two paragraphs to respond as to why I think it's a nerf, I realized that I read the post wrong. You only get the broken effect after recovering instantly. Now it makes sense. I think the rework is good, but I would be sad to see the meme sabo squads go
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@perotx said:
As I was typing up two paragraphs to respond as to why I think it's a nerf, I realized that I read the post wrong. You only get the broken effect after recovering instantly. Now it makes sense. I think the rework is good, but I would be sad to see the meme sabo squads goThat's true. But maybe they'd make another meme sabo squad with the next survivor. You never know.
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But it does give you the effect after so you could still do a meme squad.
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@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
Original: You are affected by the Broken Status Effect for the duration of the Trial. Your thick blood coagulates practically instantly.- You don't leave pools of Blood.
- Grunts of pain caused by injuries are reduced by 0/25/50 % at any time.
- Grants the ability to fully recover from the Dying State.
Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button while in the dying state. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trial.This idea could be interesting.
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@fluffybunny said:
This idea could be interesting.Yeah I hope they do any idea similar to this for No Mither. Or something that makes No Mither not just a meme perk.
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No Mither is fine as it currently is. It's simply hard mode, no need for adjustments.
The only thing the devs could add was that this perk grants you bonus bloodpoints.
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@NoShinyPony said:
No Mither is fine as it currently is. It's simply hard mode, no need for adjustments.The only thing the devs could add was that this perk grants you bonus bloodpoints.
Yeah, but that's the thing about No Mither. A perk is not suppose to make the game harder. A perk is suppose to help you win. This would be a WAY better concept.
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@Jim_Halpert said:
@NoShinyPony said:
No Mither is fine as it currently is. It's simply hard mode, no need for adjustments.The only thing the devs could add was that this perk grants you bonus bloodpoints.
Yeah, but that's the thing about No Mither. A perk is not suppose to make the game harder. A perk is suppose to help you win. This would be a WAY better concept.
I have to agree. Perks are suppose to be benefits not handicaps. I could understand more bloodpoints for being broken but the no bleeding and recovery part are the most important parts about this perk.
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@Jim_Halpert said:
@NoShinyPony said:
No Mither is fine as it currently is. It's simply hard mode, no need for adjustments.The only thing the devs could add was that this perk grants you bonus bloodpoints.
Yeah, but that's the thing about No Mither. A perk is not suppose to make the game harder. A perk is suppose to help you win. This would be a WAY better concept.
But No Mither is different. This perk was designed to be hard mode. It's not supposed to help you win.
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@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
@Jim_Halpert said:
@NoShinyPony said:
No Mither is fine as it currently is. It's simply hard mode, no need for adjustments.The only thing the devs could add was that this perk grants you bonus bloodpoints.
Yeah, but that's the thing about No Mither. A perk is not suppose to make the game harder. A perk is suppose to help you win. This would be a WAY better concept.
I have to agree. Perks are suppose to be benefits not handicaps. I could understand more bloodpoints for being broken but the no bleeding and recovery part are the most important parts about this perk.
No Mither was designed to be hard mode, not to help you win. If you ask for buffing No Mither it's like asking to make a game's hard mode easier.
If you don't like hard mode, don't play it. Don't make hard mode easier.
The only thing that would make sense was giving additional bloodpoints as a reward.
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@NoShinyPony said:
But No Mither is different. This perk was designed to be hard mode. It's not supposed to help you win.
Perks that make it harder are at least suppose to give you benefits. No Mither is just a meme. Plus I like this idea more because it falls in line with Iron Will and Calm Spirit.
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To be honest I like it as it is as surviving gets easy/boring sometimes. If anything have it give a BP or gen repair buff.
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No mither is good in swf against nurse combined with perk to be able to recover in dying state + resilence + prove thyself + toolboxes + offerings to remove hooks. Basically allows you to rush gens early and gives you extra stealth. I had game like that once i took range addons and ebony mori killed 3 of them and still depiped because they denied me gens emblem0
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@Navydivea said:
To be honest I like it as it is as surviving gets easy/boring sometimes.Exactly. No need for a buff.
@Navydivea said:
If anything have it give a BP or gen repair buff.Gen repair buff would be too strong but I agree on the BP bonus. It's not gameplay-relevant but it rewards the survivor for playing hard mode.
@TheEdgeGamer said:
@NoShinyPony said:
But No Mither is different. This perk was designed to be hard mode. It's not supposed to help you win.
Perks that make it harder are at least suppose to give you benefits.
The benefit for hard mode should be bonus bloodpoints.
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Except for the last thing about instantly getting up i think this would be an ok change, i always run Iron Will so not leaving blood would be kinda nice.CL4P_TRAP_ER said:Original: You are affected by the Broken Status Effect for the duration of the Trial. Your thick blood coagulates practically instantly.
- You don't leave pools of Blood.
- Grunts of pain caused by injuries are reduced by 0/25/50 % at any time.
- Grants the ability to fully recover from the Dying State.
Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button while in the dying state. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trial.0 -
@NoShinyPony Alright fine, I'd be ok with No Mither giving extra bloodpoints for running it but I like the no bleeding part of the perk. They should make a separate perk like this one. And it doesn't have to have the stand back up effect.
@Broosmeister said:
Except for the last thing about instantly getting up i think this would be an ok change, i always run Iron Will so not leaving blood would be kinda nice.
That's the reason I like this idea. It would be nice to run an anti-bleeding and no painful sounds build. But with the Broken effect No Mither gives, we can't enjoy the no bleeding when injured because we're already broken.
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@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
@NoShinyPony Alright fine, I'd be ok with No Mither giving extra bloodpoints for running it but I like the no bleeding part of the perk. They should make a separate perk like this one.Okay, I can totally understand that you like the effect. Agreed, that should be a separate perk only for the bleeding, like you have Iron Will for the sounds when injured.
But it should probably be closer to the functionality of Lightweight.
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I feel like maybe they should leave No Mither as it is for people that want to run Hard Mode builds or Sabo Builds but they should add a new perk on the next survivor that removes blood trails cause its really upsetting when you try to play stealth but cant counter your own bleeding without ######### yourself over with No Mither.
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This would make it OP. So many times you stun the killer with a pallet and get downed, and with this you can just continue the chase after? No. No instant ups from Dying State.
If a perk is going to force injury it needs Iron Will + Bleed negation. The exception being activatable/usable perks that are optional, like Deliverance.
Just make No Mither have 100% Pain and Blood negation at Tier 3, with some added benefit to being one-shottable that isn't obvious like being able to get up.
The concept of a "hard mode" is completely idiotic as it punishes all survivors for one full-of-themselves person's choice, so maybe running it gives a benefit to all survivors in turn, like Up The Ante but not for Luck. Action Speed would be nice, especially healing/searching/gate opening/unhooking.
But since there are plenty of Action Speed perks, maybe Time on Hook increase so they can hang 10/20/30% longer and reflect upon their terrible life choices, and allow the other survivors some time to make up for what would have been a longer chase if they had Healthy State.
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@Damon22441 said:
This would make it OP. So many times you stun the killer with a pallet and get downed, and with this you can just continue the chase after? No. No instant ups from Dying State.You would only get one insta up. And after using the insta up you become Broken through out the trial so it's a double edged sword like Deliverance but for the rest of the trial. The anti-bleeding is the major perk of this idea. It sucks that you have to be Broken in order not to bleed. It makes the no bleeding part of the perk not important and it should be.
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Consider the following scenario:
A player being chased eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses Decisive Strike to break free, heals up with Anti-Hemorrhaging Syringe or Styptic Agent, runs away, eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses your No Mither perk to get back up, runs away, is hit again and downed, then is picked up and finally (hopefully) hooked.
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@TAG said:
Consider the following scenario:A player being chased eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses Decisive Strike to break free, heals up with Anti-Hemorrhaging Syringe or Styptic Agent, runs away, eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses your No Mither perk to get back up, runs away, is hit again and downed, then is picked up and finally (hopefully) hooked.
Yeah but wouldn't the survivor be broken afterwards AND not have decisive strike AND not have a instant-heal. Same thing would happen if they were still running decisive strike, instant-heal AND adrenaline or a flashlight save or a body block hook. No matter what you'll have to deal with situations like that. In this situation, they'd be broken afterwards. Either way, No Mither does need to be reworked. It sucks right now.
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@ThePizzaGuy said:
@TAG said:
Consider the following scenario:A player being chased eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses Decisive Strike to break free, heals up with Anti-Hemorrhaging Syringe or Styptic Agent, runs away, eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses your No Mither perk to get back up, runs away, is hit again and downed, then is picked up and finally (hopefully) hooked.
Yeah but wouldn't the survivor be broken afterwards AND not have decisive strike AND not have a instant-heal. Same thing would happen if they were still running decisive strike, instant-heal AND adrenaline or a flashlight save or a body block hook. No matter what you'll have to deal with situations like that. In this situation, they'd be broken afterwards. Either way, No Mither does need to be reworked. It sucks right now.
Right, but consider how much time could potentially be wasted at the start by one Survivor without any help at all or without having to wait until the last gen is about to be finished.
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@TAG said:
Right, but consider how much time could potentially be wasted at the start by one Survivor without any help at all or without having to wait until the last gen is about to be finished.
It's true they'd waste the killer's time, but that's what all decisive strike players do. Grab the killers attention and loop them. Once they're down they can decisive strike and run away. Here, they'd be broken for the rest of the game. Remember when they were going to do that with decisive strike? Plus, if you down someone and then they get up right in front of you, pallet or window, you can easily catch up and one hit them. And they screw themselves when they do this.
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I'm saying that their power in wasting the Killer's time is increased a decent bit when their effective hit points (even if only for the first hook) go up from four to five.ThePizzaGuy said:@TAG said:
Right, but consider how much time could potentially be wasted at the start by one Survivor without any help at all or without having to wait until the last gen is about to be finished.
It's true they'd waste the killer's time, but that's what all decisive strike players do. Grab the killers attention and loop them. Once they're down they can decisive strike and run away. Here, they'd be broken for the rest of the game. Remember when they were going to do that with decisive strike? Plus, if you down someone and then they get up right in front of you, pallet or window, you can easily catch up and one hit them. And they screw themselves when they do this.
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@TAG said:
I'm saying that their power in wasting the Killer's time is increased a decent bit when their effective hit points (even if only for the first hook) go up from four to five.
Yes but it'd be easier to down them, because they're broken.
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@TAG said:
I'm saying that their power in wasting the Killer's time is increased a decent bit when their effective hit points (even if only for the first hook) go up from four to five.
But they'd become Broken making it easier to catch/down them. Them getting back up the last time they're about to get hooked is a bit of a game delayer but so is Decisive strike.
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I counter ds simply by hitting obsession then not chasing obsession(butcher compensate for that)others gen rushing anyway easy to find them. No obsession ds counters by hooking survivors fast not to mention ds is not free escape. Your NM rework is basicaly free escape combined with dead hard. At the best case scenario when that survivor is going to get hooked 4 gens re going to get repaired if not 5 so your downside wont really be a downside. Your rework is way stronger than ds not to mention that u can take both.ThePizzaGuy said:@TAG said:
Right, but consider how much time could potentially be wasted at the start by one Survivor without any help at all or without having to wait until the last gen is about to be finished.
It's true they'd waste the killer's time, but that's what all decisive strike players do. Grab the killers attention and loop them. Once they're down they can decisive strike and run away. Here, they'd be broken for the rest of the game. Remember when they were going to do that with decisive strike? Plus, if you down someone and then they get up right in front of you, pallet or window, you can easily catch up and one hit them. And they screw themselves when they do this.
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The main part of this perk I want to focus on is the anti-bleeding part of it. I added the insta-up so No Mither could still get you up. How about you can use the insta up action once your recovery progress is at 25%?
Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button when recovered to 25% in the dying state. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trial0 -
@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
The main part of this perk I want to focus on is the anti-bleeding part of it. I added the insta-up so No Mither could still get you up. How about you can use the insta up action once your recovery progress is at 25%?Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button when recovered to 25% in the dying state. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trialI'd be ok with this. It'd still be annoying to use because killers don't usually leave people on the ground but in this case it'd be ok. I'd run Unbreakable, Tenacity and this No Mither so I'd have a better chance. Better than No mither now.
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Seems balancedCL4P_TRAP_ER said:The main part of this perk I want to focus on is the anti-bleeding part of it. I added the insta-up so No Mither could still get you up. How about you can use the insta up action once your recovery progress is at 25%?
Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button when recovered to 25% in the dying state. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trial0 -
Yes, but by then you've already hit them enough times that under typical circumstances, they'd be one hit away from (most likely) dying assuming they were able to heal up after every unhook. In total, you'd have to hit them seven times to knock them oit of the game (eight if they happen to hit Adrenaline at the right time), except five of those times are just to get the first hook.TheEdgeGamer said:@TAG said:
I'm saying that their power in wasting the Killer's time is increased a decent bit when their effective hit points (even if only for the first hook) go up from four to five.
Yes but it'd be easier to down them, because they're broken.
And all this is assuming you just tunnel the hell out of them until they die. Suppose you spend 5 hits going for one person, hook them, and then go after someone else. That was 2.5 hooks' worth of hits just to get one actual hook. The amount of effort you spent to start your momentum was 250% the time it would have taken under normal circumstances.0 -
I think this seems a fair bit more balanced? One thing to note is that if the Killer notices that your blood leakage seems to be mysteriously absent, they will probably suspect that you have No Mither and will never let you use the insta-revive. The question then becomes "Would no blood be good enough if I can never use the insta-revive?"CL4P_TRAP_ER said:The main part of this perk I want to focus on is the anti-bleeding part of it. I added the insta-up so No Mither could still get you up. How about you can use the insta up action once your recovery progress is at 25%?
Rework: You no longer can receive hemorrhaging and bleed 50% / 75% / 100% less while injured.
You can also instantly recover from the dying state by pressing the action button when recovered to 25% in the dying state. However, you will receive the Broken status effect for the rest of the trial. This effect can only be used once per trial0 -
@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
@Damon22441 said:
This would make it OP. So many times you stun the killer with a pallet and get downed, and with this you can just continue the chase after? No. No instant ups from Dying State.You would only get one insta up. And after using the insta up you become Broken through out the trial so it's a double edged sword like Deliverance but for the rest of the trial. The anti-bleeding is the major perk of this idea. It sucks that you have to be Broken in order not to bleed. It makes the no bleeding part of the perk not important and it should be.
Yes, bleed negation is a good perk idea, but being able to instant revive is absolutely broken.
@TAG said:
Consider the following scenario:A player being chased eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses Decisive Strike to break free, heals up with Anti-Hemorrhaging Syringe or Styptic Agent, runs away, eventually gets hit twice and downed, uses your No Mither perk to get back up, runs away, is hit again and downed, then is picked up and finally (hopefully) hooked.
And then afterwards they had Deliverance and safe unhooked previously. Holy lord, the minutes lost to one person being nigh unkillable. 3/4 gens for two hooks. Sprint Burst/Dead Hard, too, if the killer is angrily camping them, buys even more time.
@ThePizzaGuy said:
It's true they'd waste the killer's time, but that's what all decisive strike players do. Grab the killers attention and loop them. Once they're down they can decisive strike and run away. Here, they'd be broken for the rest of the game. Remember when they were going to do that with decisive strike? Plus, if you down someone and then they get up right in front of you, pallet or window, you can easily catch up and one hit them. And they screw themselves when they do this.
They only "screw themselves" if they are dumb and just pop right up with no plan. Getting downed ends Bloodlust, not to mention if they use it as the killer is on top of them under a pallet you get the free stun as well. This only doesn't apply to unloopables, like Nurse and Legion, before the Exit Gates are open.
Yeah but wouldn't the survivor be broken afterwards AND not have decisive strike AND not have a instant-heal. Same thing would happen if they were still running decisive strike, instant-heal AND adrenaline or a flashlight save or a body block hook. No matter what you'll have to deal with situations like that. In this situation, they'd be broken afterwards. Either way, No Mither does need to be reworked. It sucks right now.
The point of DS and Styptics are to be used TO escape, not horde them the whole match. If it's used at all it fulfilled its purpose, so who cares if you no longer have it available to you?
"Same thing would happen if they were still running decisive strike, instant-heal AND adrenaline or a flashlight save or a body block hook. No matter what you'll have to deal with situations like that." Yeah, now imagine having the added ability of picking yourself up. You literally just made an argument against this perk idea.0 -
I always thought that No Mither only needed a deep wound injury for a few seconds (5/10/15s) when the killer hurts you. In this way, it gives you more possibilities in chases, and we would benefit better from the ability to recover the dying state.
And it would work well against Exposed status or other instakill.
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@Damon22441 said:
Yes, bleed negation is a good perk idea, but being able to instant revive is absolutely broken.We're changing it so you have to be at 25% recovery now to do it. I'm going to edit it right now.
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@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
We're changing it so you have to be at 25% recovery now to do it. I'm going to edit it right now.Can you still get up unlimited times? But it always has to be at 25% recovery?
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@Jim_Halpert said:
Can you still get up unlimited times? But it always has to be at 25% recovery?You can only get up once but you'll be Broken. It would not effect Unbreakable.
The main part of the perk I want to be is anti-bleeding. If they were to rework it this way, I wouldn't care if they left in the recovery thing or not. But I wanted to included a way people could still become Broken with No Mither and the insta-recovery at the cost of being broken sounded like a good addition. But people didn't like it so I adjusted my idea to 25% recovery progress. I want to focus on making No Mither being anti-bleeding without having to be broken to have this benefit.
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@CL4P_TRAP_ER said:
The main part of the perk I want to be is anti-bleeding. If they were to rework it this way, I wouldn't care if they left in the recovery thing or not. But I wanted to included a way people could still become Broken with No Mither and the insta-recovery at the cost of being broken sounded like a good addition. But people didn't like it so I adjusted my idea to 25% recovery progress. I want to focus on making No Mither being anti-bleeding without having to be broken to have this benefit.That's the thing about No Mither too. I like the not bleeding effect but it sucks that you have to be broken. So having no bleeding doesn't matter because your broken. You go down in one hit. Plus, the killer knows when you have No Mither because you're broken from the beginning of the game so he or she won't let you stay on the ground. Because they know you're gonna get back up. Having an no bleeding perk would be nice to have. Counters Bloodhound and Sloppy Butcher's hemorrhaging effect.
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My question with the current No Mither is why you have to start the trial already injured.1
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Ran this idea with my buddies and they think it's a good idea too. But the recovery thing is too much like unbreakable. Keep the "get up unlimited times once fully recovered" but once you recover once you're broken for a certain amount of time and you can't recover yourself to 100% when you're broken.
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I actually like the idea. Though I don't think the survivor should be completely immune to bleeding at rank 3. Nor should the survivor be immune to hemorrhage. But I'm on board with the part about picking yourself off the ground at the cost of being broken for the remainder of the game.
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The main problem with No Mither is it doesn't help the survivor at all. You can't self revive yourself because the killer knows your running No Mither so he's not gonna leave you on the ground. You make it easier for the killer because he can one hit you at all times. And there's no benefit to running the perk. True it makes it hard mode but for what? You don't get extra bloodpoints for running No Mither and they won't make it give more bloodpoints because Prove Thyself 2.0 does that pretty well already. You can average making 36,000 bloodpoints with Prove Thyself. They won't give No Mither more bloodpoints because you'd make WAY to much from one match with those two together. No Mither is a meme perk and is bad in it's current state.
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I hope they rework No Mither either way
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