http://dbd.game/killswitch
Is dead by daylight really killer sided?
Have you thought about it? because of every update that hurts the Killer side of things especially weak Killers this encourages them to use stronger killers or do unsportsman like things like slugging or tunneling in response
Pallet density and Generator repair speeds are part of this problem. skill or not. if it is based on skill how come more powerful Killers have became more popular/adopted recently the ones that depending on how you look at them, take more or less skill such as Wesker or nurse because of their high mobility?
Even I started to use them more often because I am not trying to slug as Billy sure Billy can destroy pallets instantly with this chainsaw but he still has to rev up the Chainsaw for longer than it would take to just break the pallet.
it does not help when the Survivor can just constantly pre-drop pallets and move on to the next pallet just 10 feet away doing this for the entire maps length as three generators can pop in the first minute of the game because of gen rush perks and tool boxes
I guarantee there's at least one peron, running weaving spiders in a third of every game anyone plays and on top of this.
the new survivor has not only a generator perk that can be paired with other generator perks and items to constantly get great skill checks that can complete the generator in half the time by Yourself.
But a perk that encourages you to be stealthy and not even take up chases but also lets you escape from chases extremely easy because you leave barely any trace or tracks to follow or go off of after the Survivor runs away faster than majority of killers to somewhere out of Sight, but can also be paired with perks that do the same thing without any requirement
I could literally run a circle inside of the shack and have my scratch marks disappear before I can Circle back to them because they disappear just around 3 seconds or less thats about the same amount of time it takes for a killer to damage a generator in
Let me know Your thoughts on this one
Comments
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Three gens within a minute? So everyone on this hypothetical team has a juiced up toolbox and a gen build instead of the very common exhaustion/speed/second chance builds and medkits that I always see?
You GUARANTEE Weaving Spider's every third match? Which game are you playing? Because I see WS like evey 300 games. And when I do, I usually win.
And changes go both ways. Streetwise was a great gen perk and they reworked it into uselessness. Killers recently got the hook counter. OTR and Tenacity were nerfed. I want everyone to take aggro but if someone wants to bring a stealth build, why shouldn't they? Why does everyone want things to stay so meta and samey?
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No, its never been killer sided
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I think it is. That only means that in the majority of scenarios the Killer has the upper hand. It doesn't mean that they will always succeed or that it will always feel fulfilling. And I believe the psychological impact of playing Killer is highlighted more often than the actual gameplay.
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Look at BHVR’s own stats and their statements. They’ve openly said they aim for kill rates to lean in favor of killers, targeting around 60% or higher. That’s not an accident; it’s part of their design philosophy.
Just because some killers are weaker doesn’t mean the role itself is bad. The killer side as a whole is strong, even if individual killers vary in power. And let’s not forget that one of the biggest advantages survivors have isn’t even in the game, it’s outside of it, through Discord and coordinated communication.
On top of that, some maps are simply designed to favor one side or the other. That’s intentional and part of how the game creates variety. So when looking at balance, it’s important to keep all of this in mind instead of judging based on a few weak killers or specific situations.
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it only starts becoming survivor sided at the very top end of gameplay and even then the best killers aren't suffering too much.
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3 people on different gens each having commodious toolbox is enough for popping 3 gens within approx 1 minute. And spread out around map is possible on the start of the match
No perks for this needed. Even without toolboxes, everything it takes is 3 gens, 3 people and within 1.5 minutes
Yet it's pretty unrealistic, because few survivors able to loop that long. So more real time without any perk I find possible is 3-4 minutes if survivors had good pre stealth or killer was busy
Something like this isn't rare if you start with interesting and long chase or use killer without mobility. No, it's not time me killing them. It's the time they finished last gen in 90% cases. All of these matches either went to endgame, or finished on last gen.
As higher my level went, as more common short matches were in the game. If you don't bring slowdown, gens being popped fast aren't sth crazy if levels are relatively same.
Its not something uncommon to genrush for survivors without having dedicated build to it. When all 4 survivors able to hold relatevile long chases while others pressing M1, gen efficiency isn’t breaking the mind or hard to pull. Bad MMR just not allowing doing it a lot :/
Yet I still don't’ agree this game isn’t killer sided, as OP tried to pull. Rather no than yes. Game still can be pretty killer sided yet not satisfying for them and consisting cheesy systems for survivors. Because win conditions in this games are worthless
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I honestly hate this idea that some killers are "weak." I play alot of the killers that people consider "weak" but imo they're just more challenging than others and I prefer that. Some of us dont mind a challenge. Alot of the more recent killers don't require alot of effort to succeed, so there's something for everyone. But I'm probably in the minority for that.
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I never know which killers people even mean when they say this. Different killlers are just different.
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Gen speeds were already nerfed into the ground. We don't need more.
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So true but they don't want to hear that. They lose 1 game to a swf which is like the best teams in the game then they say the games unbalanced. Like dude do you think you're going to beat a coordinated team easily? Plus solo q makes up most of the player base.
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Honestly the game has always been "killer sided" every patch for the last 4 years or so has been survivors get hit with a nerf bat flashlights, self care, distortion. Then they get a shiny new thing I.E. smoke bombs. Nerfed… the first new item in how long? Nerfed into the ground. They care less about hiding it at this point and they build every change around the idea that every game is going to be a swf with coms and a meta team build. You can't build a game around 10% of your player base and have it be fun or even playable for the rest.
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It absolutely is killer sided. I spent most of my years as a killer. I was Sadako for a while, but I use Spirit nowadays. Even as Sadako, regardless of which iteration - I can normally get 3-4 kills. Sometimes I run up against a SWF team, and it ends up being random to how many I kill. Those are rare encounters though. But, being a killer gets old after a while.
I somewhat recently dived deep into survivor. I’m pretty good. But man, the tunneling/slugging/camping is just poor development. It’s terrible to experience, even if you’re part of a SWF team. At least as a killer I’m always playing and always experiencing the entire match; not waiting around on hook or on the ground (or just dead super early).
Remember folks - a killer plays DBD; a survivor watches DBD.
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The majority of games contain SWF's lol Despite what BHVR's internal stats suggest, anyone who plays Killer is aware that the majority of games are against SWF's and games that are against SoloQ aren't even fun since they are over within 30 seconds lol If SWF's were not the majority, then BHVR would not cater the game around them. If SoloQ was the majority, BHVR would not be making SoloQ more unplayable and awful with each and every patch.
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Clearly stats show theres much more solo q. They cater to killers because killers get mad they have to use actual skill to beat a SWF. A coordinated team counters slugging, camping and tunneling easily. Which is why I think BHVR needs to have a comm system for ALL players pc and console. Like friday the 13th and call of duty games have. That would completely solve all three issues without the need for the anti slug/tunnel update.
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The majority of my games are not swf as killer or survivor. One out of 10 legitimately are true swfs sweating and going for beamers or gen rush. The rest fall apart after the first hook, communication and coordination go out the window. 2 go for unhook while one is on gens and if you aren't hook camping/tunneling that gen survivor is easily found and downed. Honestly if it's a swf it's exciting and requires more active gameplay otherwise im just patrolling gens one hook, two hook, etc etc. Tunneling and hook camping are like turning on cruise control, not a lot of effort required.
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Debatable in all honesty.
It all comes down to which killer you play / face.
This is also amplified by the pallet update, which has further widened the gap between the A / S-tiers, and the lower tiered killers. While the S-tier killers are as strong as ever, the weaker ones are definitely struggling to keep up with the increasing survivor efficiency, and easier looping, and more killer players are preferring the higher tiers, because those are significantly easier to do well with.Playstyle also plays a major role in this statement. With how prevalent tunneling has become, the game is further skewing towards the killer side in terms of stats.
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Have you thought about it? because of every update that hurts the Killer side of things especially weak Killers this encourages them to use stronger killers or do unsportsman like things like slugging or tunneling in response
Please. Killers will tunnel and slug in response to buffs as well. They don't tunnel and slug because of nerfs. They do it because they can, and they can't stand losing a single match. It's an addiction that they can't bear the thought of ever losing, and that's the primary reason why the tunneling and slugging reduction system got delayed.
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Have you thought about it? because of
every update that hurts the Killerside of things especially weak Killers thisencourages them to use stronger killers ordo unsportsman like things likesluggingortunnelingin responseHi, welcome to the forums, you must be new here.
So a long time before you joined, killers actually did tunnel a bit less and then we got 6.1.0, which was stacked to the brim with killer buffs to help settle what was, at the time, quite survivor-sided gameplay.
In response to these hefty buffs which dramatically bumped the kill rate, tunnelling massively increased.
It's got nothing to do with any 'nerfs', and everything to do with player mentality and ease of access.
Bring back 5 second DS.
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Yes, it’s worth noting that some killers simply play differently from others, and some players see them as weak because they’re used to killers that offer higher rewards with less risk. Thanks for pointing that out, I completely agree.
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I think the game generally isnt one sided one way or the other currently (a few times in history perhaps before my time), and i think people just keep getting obsessed with the us vs them mentality and keep perpetuating it.
Realistically, assuming players are competent(using bad players as an argument is pointless), the game is survivor 'favoured' (i.e the game is set up with them in the advantageous position to win at the start) and the killer role simply has the agency of being the power role to disrupt that and turn it around.
Im sure i'll get downvoted by the survivor mains who will only ever blame the killer for everything, but the game is literally built on the killer having to play to regain the advantage over the survivor team.
Realistically debating over whether the game is "killer sided" is pointless because of the absolutely massive differences between survivor skill levels. Its going to feel killer sided to worse players (and those paired up with them) and more fairly balanced to the good players who don't have the same issues. It's mostly just personal perspectives and negativity bias forming 90% of arguments.
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Game has always favoured survivor right down to its core mechanics as just from the math alone time is always very much against the killer.
The problem in soloq is a lot of the people you encounter have no idea what they are doing and is usually the most common frustration when you loop the killer for 90 seconds have a good chase but that means nothing when people just don't do objectives.
But get a team that has any level of idea what they are doing and the difference is massive. (Saying this as someone with a 55% escape rate in soloq)
And when it comes to things like slugging, tunnelling and camping I would say that if a killer can win without doing any of this then it was too easy for them and the a team of good survs would force the killers hand into these tactics.
Also the level of power surv perks have now is insane.
- 3 sec scratch marks mainly thanks to Ghost Notes
- 6 second heals thanks to the many buffs that healing perks like resurgence, botany, desperate measures while killer anti-heal gets worse as there is already few to choose from but vigil destroys mangled timers and leverage got nurfed.
- Gen perks have gotten so insane that people can do gen in 30 seconds by themselves!
- Chase perks allow people to play pretty poorly and still get value (Drama + Fineness anyone) and in general most killers cant do anything about perks like lithe giving free distance for doing nothing and unless the killer has some form of movement they just cant keep up.
- Second chance perks keep getting more ridiculous, Conviction is easily one of the most broken perks in the game just recover for 6 seconds and you can just get up and walk away and paired with other perks like it it can just invalidate all the effort the killer put into downing you in the first place.
- Pallet increase has made playing any killer that cant just ignore them miserable providing so much extra safety and often being easily chainable most killers in the game don't have a reliable way to deal with the massive increase and if you get Disturbed Ward its just insane anything lower than A tier is just at a massive disadvantage.
All this leads to a meta where anything less than A tier is just not enough to keep up with competent teams.
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I think that the game has been and still is in most situations slightly to heavily survivor sided. RNG, perks, killer, stuff like this make a huge difference. I think sometimes the game can be even mostly balanced or killer sided. The thing is matchmaking is so horrible. It also seems to me that a large part of the community is either playing casually or is more prone to complaining than adapting. Not really easy to definitively say if the game is killer or survivor sided when both parties are sometimes playing worse on purpose and matchmaking is what it is.
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i never want to play against that
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In order for the game to be killer sided, it would mean every killer in the game would have the advantage no matter the situation. But we know this isn't the case. Many killers frankly cannot deal with skilled survivors and the devs love to indirectly nerf weaker killers while ignoring the strongest killers in the game.
BHVR is balancing killers around Nurse/Blight while balancing survivors around the average leading the game to be unbalanced in favor of the strongest tools in the game regardless of side.
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In pub matches yea.
- All statistics favor the game being significantly killer sided. 63% kill rate with a significant number of games that would be survivor losses thrown out. Why are we still not counting DC matches or "low scoring" matches? It has to have a significant effect on the stats if they're trying to hide it from us.
- Matchmaking system overwhelmingly favors killers. The game never consistently matches you with good survivors. You can be a good survivor with an above average escape rate and still get paired with absolute potatoes. Literally the only way to counter this it to play in a SWF.
- Killer at their absolute strongest is almost always stronger than survivors in a pub match. That's why things like the 2000 game blight win streak or the 1000 game perkless nurse win streak exist. If survivor is so strong then why was no one able to end these streaks? Why did it eventually require stream snipers with builds specifically tailored to the play style of the killers they were against? Meanwhile the best survivors can barely break 200 escapes in a row before they eventually get ######### on by a random Legion or Trickster. Even various B tier killers have higher win streaks than the best survivor squads. If survivor is so strong then why is no one able to put together any insane streaks like killers have managed? Surely someone would have done it by now. Right?
- Devs have admitted they make the game killer sided by design. Don't know how much more clear they can be about it.
Give the game a strict matchmaking system and then we can talk. Until then enjoy beating up on teletubbie survivors and just start dealing with the 1/50 games where you actually have to play against someone good.
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It depends on what mmr you are playing.
- At the lowest levels (aka new players) the game is very killer sided
- At lower half mmrs, the game is slightly killer sided
- At the middle level, the game is pretty balanced (rng can factor in heavily swinging matches one way or the other though)
- At the upper half mmrs, the game is slightly survivor sided
- At the highest levels (aka comp level) the game is very survivor sided.
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It's a shame that 1000-win Blight streak guy didn't make it up to "high MMR" I guess is what you're arguing, huh?
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The game isnt onesided as many people claim its all decided what meets what and players skill plus experience like if you get lobby where is very good bubba main with meta who has like 1000+ hours just on bubba (because he is fricking c-tier and has bad antiloop with basekit without beast marks) against 4 soloq dwights that prefer to just idle around then the match will more tend to killers end but if there is strong 3 man sfw with one random and all survivors are high mmr skilled with meta and swf has medkits with styptic against ghostface with some fun build it will be heavily in survivor favor and that killer will get destroyed in match that wont last even 10 minutes and huge factor is map like its easy to play wesker on map like haddonfield and its hard to play him on map like nostrome where your dashes are so hindered by random rocks same with billy.
So al depends what and whos is put in lobby against its all that makes the big shift like tarpper against 4 man on badham wont preform good unlike trapper against soloq doing challenges more than gens on some playable map for trapper like silent hill map.
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The game has literally always been killer sided unless you think back to the alpha version. And it doesnt matter if killers get 1000 nerfs in a single patch as long as those nerfs do nothing worth it. On the contrary killers always cry that the world will gonna end when survivor got something, ans for some wonderous reason nothing ever happened to decline the reign of killersided stats.
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Win streaks are a horrible example of what i'm talking about. I have seen many of these players on "win streaks" who will say like "oh i'm pausing my blight streak because i just don't want to try hard today, or i'm doing challenges" and then they proceed to play blight and their mmr gets lower so later when its "unpaused" they get easier matches. Win streaks aren't a meaningful thing because they can be manipulated. There are plenty of examples i could give of survivors going on hundreds of game win streaks as well. Otz and Hens often play together doing the "all survivors all perks win streak challenge" periodically and pull it off all the time, are we going to talk about them or just only the one guy who plays blight?
There's also the reality that, 1 single person does not a statistically relevant stat make. Maybe that blight player just is the best player in the world, there's really no way to tell nor can they even "prove" their win streak either because its easy to just not record some matches and keep moving, there's no public record of your matches unless you choose to share it, and even that record could be edited.
But, what i do see is comp leagues make a ton of rules that hamper survivors like locking out certain perks, only allowing 1 of a perk across the team, locking out a ton of items and addons, as well as often playing the killer's best map. The exception to this is usually nurse and blight, but there are 30+ other killers that exist that must be accounted for.
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Ah yes, the magical mystery MMR that is totally in the game and definitely isn't fake. I get matched in 2 milliseconds as SoloQ Surv, yea MMR is functioning? When I lose 15 games in a row and then get paired with ultra comp TTV Blight and Nurse who are playing as if they'll be terminated irl if they let a single gen be completed before slugging us all out, MMR is functioning? There's only two groups of "MMR", new players with fresh installs and everyone else, there are not several MMR brackets in this game.
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On the North American server, it is the killer side.
However, this is because there are problems on the survivor side, such as survivor players on the North American server giving up on the match too quickly, leaving the game unattended, and not prioritizing escape.
Because it is the survivor side on the Asian server, the killer side will continue on the North American server unless the awareness of North American server users changes.0 -
If you look at the math, when a game has a very coordinated SWF, it is survivor sided. The killer has to have extremely unrealistic chase times to get a 3k. Throwing perks into the mix and items make it even worse. ( Ironically the only thing that can change it in the killers favor is tunneling lmfao)
But the majority of matches when it's a killer vs random survivors or even just 2 groups of 2 friends I say the killer has the upper hand most of the time. The only exceptions are probably the super low tier killers like ghosty, trapper and skull merchant. I'll even throw in dredge after the pallet update since that butchered his anti loop entirely. It's just to difficult to coordinate against high pressure killers when you have no communication. And this truly is the majority of matches.
Overall though just being realistic ASYM games are hard AF to balance. Behavior has done pretty good all things considered. Look at games like VHS and TCM. The balancing was so bad it literally killed the game and queue times were terrible. The only other ASYM game I can think of with good balance was F13. BHVR have just put themselves in a bind because they have to choose to either balance around SWFS or randoms and they're trying to do both which isn't working. Example 4 survivors having BNP is completely different if it's a SWF or randoms.
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I feel like survivors tip the scales in favor of killers all by themselves. Anyone who ventures into solo queue can see that.
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Eh, not really
Like sure we've gotten Killers like Kaneki and Krasue, Blight and Nurse still haven't been nerfed, the meta is still quad slowdown, and the majority of killers are hovering around 60% Killrate, but despite that…I don't really see it
Like survivors just got a massive pallet density increase on the majority of maps in the game recently, making every killer besides the top 6 weaker because survivors now have more resources to work with, and numerous perks mix and match together in various ways that are very strong, Survivor has many options, especially in a SWF that communicates, but the reason Survivor is still "weak" is because the majority play solo, and solo Q is chock full of people who not only don't use the tools that are available to them, but can't handle going against the majority of killers because they simply have no effective or efficient way of learning how to play against them without getting friends together in a custom game.
When going up against survivors that are actually competent, have comms, and don't quit at the first sign of hardship as any killer that isn't the top 6, DBD can feel like a nightmare when playing Killer, but the reason this isn't the case usually is because, when playing killer, you're going up against 4 solos the majority of the time, who all might be individually competent, but can't share information on perks or the state of the game with each other. If BHVR decided to ever add a in-game voice-chat and make a tutorial that doesn't completely suck, Survivors would absolutely be way stronger, but they aren't because SoloQ remains as it always has.
As it stands right now, the game is Killer Sided some games, Survivor Sided other games, it is what it is
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Never have been if we consider who was strongest throught the years.
The issue is bad matchmaking makes it feels like killers are too strong for those who are not aware on game's macroplay.
I agree. The more experienced players are, the more game favours survivor AS A TEAM. Thats what people don't get: you can lose individually and still win as a group - like the common 1k 3 escapes scenario.
Edited for clarity.
Post edited by Rickprado on0 -
I think it depends on the killer being played too, the S-tiers the game is absoloutley killer sided especially with full gen regression builds.
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