So you want a Second Objective?; An Alternative to Pressing M1!
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You had my answer ages ago. You simply decided to close your eyes;
In a multi-route environment neither routes are mandatory. Neither are they side-quests. Both are doing the main quest, but there are simply multiple ways to do so.
In case you still don't understand it after hearing it over 5+ times:
If you have to go to Rome and there are 5 pathways going directly to Rome, taking neither route is mandatory, but picking any of the routes is you doing the main objective.
In my OP there are 2 pathways. The existence of 1 allows you to ignore the other.
In the Handle example there is only 1 route, meaning that doing that route is mandatory.
In a multi-route environment no route is mandatory, but choosing (a mix) between the routes IS still mandatory, by definition of them being you doing the main objective.0 -
I can't believe you all are still talking about side questing lol.
You want to go to Rome (fix a gen).
You have a car. (mouse 1 button on a plain gen)
There is a plane that goes to Rome (a gen with parts installed on them), but you don't have a ticket for it (the parts that need to be installed).You can either take the car, or buy a ticket for the plane (producing a part and installing it) and then board the plane.
Buying the ticket is a side quest. Once the side quest is completed you open the alternative route to Rome. If you don't buy the ticket, you can still complete the main quest.
Now please, please, PLEASE stop this non sense everybody
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You don't need a car; You didn't need a gen. You needed a flower and parts.
Aka, you didn't need a flat gen; you needed a part-gen. Doing a gen is no longer 1 process. It's 2.
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You need a generator (remember the color scheme?).
The car is the generator.Producing a part is a side quest, deal with it and move on.
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@Edys said:
You need a generator (remember the color scheme?).
The car is the generator.Producing a part is a side quest, deal with it and move on.
So I cannot complete the game through just parts and the flower?
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@Edys said:
You need a generator (remember the color scheme?).
The car is the generator.Producing a part is a side quest, deal with it and move on.
So I cannot complete the game through just parts and the flower?
yes you can: once you complete your side quest an alternative route is opened.
Still, you need to complete the side quest in the first place.
It's the same as a Hex Ruin.
Hex Ruin slow the progression of generators (indirectly). You can "complete the game" by fixing hexed generators or plain generators, but in order to do the latter you first need to complete the side quest "cleanse the hex totem".Why is it so difficult for you to just say "ok, building parts is a side quest"
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I can do flowers and parts. I never have to do generators. See how generators are a side-quest? After all, for something to be a main objective route, it has to be mandatory. Didn't you listen to what Paddy told you?
Why is it so difficult for you to just say "ok, building parts is a side quest"
Because that'd be lying. Lying isn't difficult.
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there are no flowers in dead by daylight, sorry, stick to reality please.
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there are no flowers in dead by daylight, sorry, stick to reality please.
Flowers refers to what I mentioned earlier. I said:
See the OP, but 1 thing changes: the generator transforms into a flower when a part is installed.To do the thinking for you: Do parts >>> Do flowers >>> end the game without ever putting a charge into a single generator.
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
Flowers refers to what I mentioned earlier. I said:
See the OP, but 1 thing changes: the generator transforms into a flower when a part is installed.Why would it matter if generators become flowers or zombies or a bit of common sense?
before their transformation in Tyrannosaurus Rex, you still need to accomplish the side quest produce and install parts
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Nope as I said in the simple context of your example.AlwaysInAGoodShape said:You had my answer ages ago. You simply decided to close your eyes;
In a multi-route environment neither routes are mandatory. Neither are they side-quests. Both are doing the main quest, but there are simply multiple ways to do so.
In case you still don't understand it after hearing it over 5+ times:
If you have to go to Rome and there are 5 pathways going directly to Rome, taking neither route is mandatory, but picking any of the routes is you doing the main objective.
In my OP there are 2 pathways. The existence of 1 allows you to ignore the other.
In the Handle example there is only 1 route, meaning that doing that route is mandatory.
In a multi-route environment no route is mandatory, but choosing (a mix) between the routes IS still mandatory, by definition of them being you doing the main objective.
yoi can’t do it because you know exactly what’s coming, I’m taking you evasion to conclude as the sign you agree and you acknowledge you’ve been mistaken.
Further reply’s evading will cement this idea further.1 -
What makes something a side-quest; simple question inherently?
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I thought emery moved on from that a while ago now, lol.Edys said:I can't believe you all are still talking about side questing lol.
You want to go to Rome (fix a gen).
You have a car. (mouse 1 button on a plain gen)
There is a plane that goes to Rome (a gen with parts installed on them), but you don't have a ticket for it (the parts that need to be installed).You can either take the car, or buy a ticket for the plane (producing a part and installing it) and then board the plane.
Buying the ticket is a side quest. Once the side quest is completed you open the alternative route to Rome. If you don't buy the ticket, you can still complete the main quest.
Now please, please, PLEASE stop this non sense everybody
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LINE 1: x + 5 - y
LINE 2: x = 4.
LINE 3: y = 9
That is not evading telling you what y is.LINE 1: In a multi-route environment no route is mandatory
LINE 2: My op is a multi-route environment.
LINE 3: Doing parts is not mandatory.0 -
I have already given the definition to what I believe a side quest to be:
Side Quests are additional or extra quests that a player can attempt. Side quests are not necessary to complete a game.
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I have already given the definition:AlwaysInAGoodShape said:What makes something a side-quest; simple question inherently?
Side Quests are additional or extra quests that a player can attempt. Side quests are not necessary to complete a game.
the addition being the collection of parts before doing a gen.1 -
And I showed how this makes doing flat generators a side-quest. Since you don't need to do 80 seconds of gen time in front of a gen; that is an option.
I've said that countless of times;
Either both doing parts and doing flat gens are side-questing and there's no main objective or both are main objectives and neither side-questing.0 -
the addition being the collection of parts before doing a gen.
The addition being doing up to 70 seconds more in front of a generator. up to 70 seconds of side-questing.
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@EdysWhat makes something a side-quest; simple question inherently?
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Nothing about doing parts is sidequesting. When you are doing a part you are directly finishing 10 seconds of irregressable gen time. Installing it is directly doing 5 seconds of irregressable gen time; Why would doing 10 seconds of regressable gen time over 35 times more than you actually have to be main questing if it can be skipped over completely?
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370 comments...
Why the ######### is there 370 comments?1 -
Nope your example of:AlwaysInAGoodShape said:LINE 1: x + 5 - y
LINE 2: x = 4.
LINE 3: y = 9
That is not evading telling you what y is.LINE 1: In a multi-route environment no route is mandatory
LINE 2: My op is a multi-route environment.
LINE 3: Doing parts is not mandatory.
just adding time to gens, didn’t give optional routes. And was not the question.
You’ve stated that most people when they want secondary objectives just want to add more time to gens in the form of something else that is mandatory, inherently you believe this to be nothing more than a nerf to prolong the survivors escape, at least that was my understanding, Inasked you for clarity within the context of the example you gave, for some reason you can’t do this...
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Yes
You’ve stated that most people when they want secondary objectives just want to add more time to gens in the form of something else that is mandatory, inherently you believe this to be nothing more than a nerf to prolong the survivors escape
And I don't do that. There's no hypocrisy.
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But only one of those option involves a side quest.....AlwaysInAGoodShape said:And I showed how this makes doing flat generators a side-quest. Since you don't need to do 80 seconds of gen time in front of a gen; that is an option.
I've said that countless of times;
Either both doing parts and doing flat gens are side-questing and there's no main objective or both are main objectives and neither side-questing.
The main objective is to complete the gen,
option 1 do the gen
option 2 do something else before doing a gen.
All you did was add the word flat in front of a gen to deflect form the only difgrence being tha additional step that isn’t required to do the gen.
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@Mc_Harty said:
370 comments...
Why the [BAD WORD] is there 370 comments?Because some people don't believe that progressing generators is the main objective in the game.
Some people believe that if you have to score 100 points and you have 2 options:
Pressing A gives you 1 point and pressing B gives you 5 points but can only be clicked 5 times, then they claim that pressing B is a side-quest to scoring points.0 -
@Paddy4583 said:
AlwaysInAGoodShape said:And I showed how this makes doing flat generators a side-quest. Since you don't need to do 80 seconds of gen time in front of a gen; that is an option.
I've said that countless of times;
Either both doing parts and doing flat gens are side-questing and there's no main objective or both are main objectives and neither side-questing.
But only one of those option involves a side quest.....
The main objective is to complete the gen,
option 1 do the gen
option 2 do something else before doing a gen.All you did was add the word flat in front of a gen to deflect form the only difgrence being tha additional step that isn’t required to do the gen.
No paddy. Doing a part EQUALS doing about 15 seconds of a gen. You are in fact progressing a generator.
If you've done 5 parts' you've simply done 70 seconds of generator progression that is irregressable. That is doing the main objective.
What is a side-quest is doing 35 portions of 10 seconds of regressable generator progress at a generator, while these 35 portions were optional.
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Finally!AlwaysInAGoodShape said:Yes
You’ve stated that most people when they want secondary objectives just want to add more time to gens in the form of something else that is mandatory, inherently you believe this to be nothing more than a nerf to prolong the survivors escape
And I don't do that. There's no hypocrisy.
So in conclusion, there is no debate that your idea is an alternative to completing a generator, but at its basic level, it is still completing a generator with a side step (quest)
you can either just play the standard game we all do now and hold M1 and do the gen in the same time.
Or you can opt to spend time crafting/finding and going backwards and forwards to a gen, which in short will extend the total time of the process of completing a gen, the total time is extend because the buff time doesn’t negate the time it’s taken to craft, find, transport, install.
so basically it’s an optional way of extending gen times from there standard rate, by completing an additional objective in between that’s serves no function but to add time to the game as a whole.
When I when in the linked posts the argument was why do peope want more when there’s so much to do, and the majority were stating: but most of these are optional, and your idea is adding another optional objective, with no real risk reward functionality, which is really what I believe people to want in a secondary objective if it’s optional, but I genuinely believe people do just want additional mandatory steps to complete to escape, extending the much need time for a killer and the difficulty for a survivor.
Using the survial figures is not realivant because it assumes everyone plays to escape, which isn’t the case for all players and it doesn’t reflect a true picture of the game as a whole, so basing a resolution around the incorrect statistics results in errors, of which we have seen plenty.1 -
You just won the internet 😭😭😭Edys said:@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@EdysWhat makes something a side-quest; simple question inherently?
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you can either just play the standard game
Standard game? There's no such things as the standard game. There is just the game.
I'm sorry, but if you've been sitting at a generator for 80 seconds, you've been side-questing for 70 seconds.
Those 70 seconds sitting there putting in regressable charges were not mandatory. If it's not mandatory then it is....?If it's not mandatory then it is............?
Well it's side-questing by your own logic xD
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Nope it’s doing a gen, without side questing to do itAlwaysInAGoodShape said:you can either just play the standard game
Standard game? There's no such things as the standard game. There is just the game.
I'm sorry, but if you've been sitting at a generator for 80 seconds, you've been side-questing for 70 seconds.
Those 70 seconds sitting there putting in regressable charges were not mandatory. If it's not mandatory then it is....?If it's not mandatory then it is............?
Well it's side-questing by your own logic xD
that’s my logic please stop trying to re-define my logic and and how I used the definition. It’s coming across as desperate.
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Nope it’s doing a gen, without side questing to do it
Doing parts equals doing a generator. Creating the part is literally finishing 10 seconds of irregressable gen time.
There is no redefinition. Your definition is; something that isn't mandatory to do for completing your main
Doing 70 seconds on a generator are simply not mandatory. They are just a bonus to what you can already do to parts.
please stop trying to re-define my logic
I'm LITERALLY QUOTING YOU LMAO Go to page 2, bahaha:
From you:
The objective that I'm going to create will not be mandatory..... and if it’s not mandatory Its???
If an objective is not mandatory it is side-questing. (your logic)
70 seconds of not mandatory side-questing you have right there.0 -
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Nope not quoting me your paraphrasing and misquoting.. please do continue I’m sure if you keep doing it you’ll convince me I said what you want me to say.AlwaysInAGoodShape said:Nope it’s doing a gen, without side questing to do it
Doing parts equals doing a generator. Creating the part is literally finishing 10 seconds of irregressable gen time.
There is no redefinition. Your definition is; something that isn't mandatory to do for completing your main
Doing 70 seconds on a generator are simply not mandatory. They are just a bonus to what you can already do to parts.
please stop trying to re-define my logic
I'm LITERALLY QUOTING YOU LMAO Go to page 2, bahaha:
From you:
The objective that I'm going to create will not be mandatory..... and if it’s not mandatory Its???
If an objective is not mandatory it is side-questing. (your logic)
70 seconds of not mandatory side-questing you have right there.
Doing parts does not equal doing a gen, the use for the part is for the completion of a gen, but the locating and crafting transporting, does not equate to doing a gen, that is a side quest for doing the gen...
and I don’t know why you’ve gone back to this topic, in the first place... oh wait yeah I do...
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Nope not quoting me your paraphrasing and misquoting.. please do continue I’m sure if you keep doing it you’ll convince me I said what you want me to say.
Doing parts does not equal doing a gen, the use for the part is for the completion of a gen, but the locating and crafting transporting, does not equate to doing a gen, that is a side quest for doing the gen...
and I don’t know why you’ve gone back to this topic, in the first place... oh wait yeah I do...
Coming back to a wrong position you still hold?
Doing parts does not equal doing a gen
Doing a part DIRECTLY equals doing x amount of seconds in the 420/440 second main bar of progression. THAT MAIN BAR OF PROGRESSION is you doing YOUR MAIN OBJECTIVE.
Doing 5 Parts means minus 5*15 = 75 seconds from the 420/440 main objective bar. Yes that is doing your main objective xD
Doing exit gates also isn't doing Gens you genius. (Spoiler alert: Opening exit gates is doing the main objective)0 -
@Mc_Harty said:
370 comments...
Why the [BAD WORD] is there 370 comments?Because of flowers, steak and other things that probably smell very good.
When are we going to talk about perfume?
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@NuclearBurrito2 said:
@Mc_Harty said:
370 comments...
Why the [BAD WORD] is there 370 comments?Because of flowers, steak and other things that probably smell very good.
When are we going to talk about perfume?
?
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@Paddy4583you can either just play the standard game
Standard game? There's no such things as the standard game. There is just the game.
I'm sorry, but if you've been sitting at a generator for 80 seconds, you've been side-questing for 70 seconds.
Those 70 seconds sitting there putting in regressable charges were not mandatory. If it's not mandatory then it is....?If it's not mandatory then it is............?
Well it's side-questing by your own logic xD
Actually it's 80 CHARGES. It hasn't necessarily taken 80 seconds.
And no matter how many parts you install you still need to give 80 charges to the generator. Yes that is mechanically different from a part giving 10 charges thus reducing the number of charges, since if you work on a generator for 40 charges and then collect and install 3 parts before working on the remaining 40 charges it will take you 60 seconds without any additional modifiers. However if it instead directly granted the charges then installing the 3 parts would instantly complete the generator (renaming it to a flower does not change the fact that it took 80 charges which is the mechanical aspect).
Doing that would take a total of 105 seconds not counting travel time btw
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@NuclearBurrito2 said:
@Mc_Harty said:
370 comments...
Why the [BAD WORD] is there 370 comments?Because of flowers, steak and other things that probably smell very good.
When are we going to talk about perfume?
?
Well we have flowers, known for smelling good. And we have sticks of beef which is delicious and tasty things smell good. So we need perfume next cuz that is also supposed to smell good (in theory anyways)
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We are talking about things that you do. There's no "To charge".
There's To sit still next to a gen for 80 seoncds or to go to workshops and install parts. Both directly subtract from the 420/440 second bar. It has nothing to do with charges.
It has to do with whether it subtracts from the 420/440.
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Main Objective:
That which reduces from the 420/440 second bar resulting in the escape route being opened up, Thus:
-Opening exit gates = -20
-Doing a full generator = -80
-Doing parts = - 15 per partThings that don't subtract from this timer:
Healing: = Still 420/440 left to do
Sabotaging: = Still 420/440 left to do
Cleansing dull totem: = Still 420/440 left to do
etc.0 -
@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@NuclearBurrito2We are talking about things that you do. There's no "To charge".
There's To sit still next to a gen for 80 seoncds or to go to workshops and install parts. Both directly subtract from the 420/440 second bar. It has nothing to do with charges.
It has to do with whether it subtracts from the 420/440.
Generator progress is measured in charges not seconds. This is because the amount of time it takes to progress it by 1 charge is not always 1 second, using a toolbox increases the number of charges per second and great checks suddenly increase the number of charges, hex: ruin decreases it and a brand new part adds 25 charges all at once.
And also having more than one person work on a single generator will both obviously install more than 1 charge per second but will also install less than 2 charges per second given 2 people working on the generator.
Same thing technically applies to the gates but it matters less there.
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So if I have all generators with 5 parts, you're saying that I still have 400 seconds left to do? (+the 20/40)
If not then I've indeed been doing the main objective.
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Only on on installing, which is why I said crafting/collecting and transporting doesn’t equal doing a gen... but do proceed in telling me how that’s incorrectAlwaysInAGoodShape said:Nope not quoting me your paraphrasing and misquoting.. please do continue I’m sure if you keep doing it you’ll convince me I said what you want me to say.
Doing parts does not equal doing a gen, the use for the part is for the completion of a gen, but the locating and crafting transporting, does not equate to doing a gen, that is a side quest for doing the gen...
and I don’t know why you’ve gone back to this topic, in the first place... oh wait yeah I do...
Coming back to a wrong position you still hold?
Doing parts does not equal doing a gen
Doing a part DIRECTLY equals doing x amount of seconds in the 420/440 second main bar of progression. THAT MAIN BAR OF PROGRESSION is you doing YOUR MAIN OBJECTIVE.
Doing 5 Parts means minus 5*15 = 75 seconds from the 420/440 main objective bar. Yes that is doing your main objective xD
Doing exit gates also isn't doing Gens you genius. (Spoiler alert: Opening exit gates is doing the main objective)1 -
@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@NuclearBurrito2Main Objective:
That which reduces from the 420/440 second bar resulting in the escape route being opened up, Thus:
-Opening exit gates = -20
-Doing a full generator = -80
-Doing parts = - 15 per partThings that don't subtract from this timer:
Healing: = Still 420/440 left to do
Sabotaging: = Still 420/440 left to do
Cleansing dull totem: = Still 420/440 left to do
etc.Doing a part is NOT -15 per part. Since again if I do 40 charges of a generator before installing the part then I will not be decreasing the amount of time to do the remaining 40 charges by 15 seconds
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
@NuclearBurrito2So if I have all generators with 5 parts, you're saying that I still have 400 seconds left to do? (+the 20/40)
If not then I've indeed been doing the main objective.
no you have 400 charges. We don't measure progress in terms of time and if we did then cleansing ruin totems, opening chests that contain toolboxes, and healing in the case of thanatophobia would all ALSO be doing the main objective.
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There fixed it for youAlwaysInAGoodShape said:Main Objective:
That which reduces from the 420/440 second bar resulting in the escape route being opened up, Thus:
-Opening exit gates = -20
-Doing a full generator = -80
-Doing parts = - 15 per part + side quest time of collecting/ crafting and transportingThings that don't subtract from this timer:
Healing: = Still 420/440 left to do
Sabotaging: = Still 420/440 left to do
Cleansing dull totem: = Still 420/440 left to do
etc.0 -
Only on on installing, which is why I said crafting/collecting and transporting doesn’t equal doing a gen... but do proceed in telling me how that’s incorrect
No this is how it works:
When you do a part you simply have 10 seconds of generator time. Which can still be undone/regressed. The moment it's installed it adds + 5 seconds and there's your permanent 15 seconds.Also running in between what are essentially small generators isn't doing a side-objective. That is also doing the main objective. Otherwise it'd be playing "lava-floor"; as long as you walk you're side-questing.
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