Do Killer Mains just want survivors to Stand Idle
I’ve seen plenty of killers complain and nag on how survivors loop? Do you want us to do nothing? Some user said looping was an exploit how does that even go through your mind?
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No. We want a good counter for it in their base ability.
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I haven’t heard this complaint in a while from Killers. I hope this isn’t coming up again :/
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they want stealth to be buffed to a point where looping is not the only way for a survivor to win against the killer.
and to explain the whole "exploid" thing: yes, looping is basically an exploid of the game mechanics, as pallets and windows were never supposed to waste all of the killers time and get them genrushed, but actually to break the direct LoS and give the survivor a 2nd chance at hiding. however, the devs knew about this "exploid" and allowed it, so its just a strategy now, like camping, gen tapping or turning around and following the blood trails of a deep wounded survivor.
you gotta understand how frustrating it can be to face a good looper.
imo, all those looping spots where you can see eigther over or through the walls need to be replaced with ones that have solid walls... without a mindgame potential, loops are unbearable.
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I want you to try to lose me rather than stall me.
Using a loop spot to gain distance for a juke is fine.
Looping me just to stall me for your team is extremely frustrating.
That being said keep doing it, you aren't playing for my enjoyment so if my annoyance is a reason not to do it then you are doing it wrong. The fact that such a strategy is optimal is a problem for the devs, you should absolutely keep using it in the mean time.
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I think it's more about how chases are unfun to play as killer when you're getting looped and how time consuming it can be, especially when gens go down so fast.
Loops are mostly beatable though. Just unfun and uninspired, but not to the point of making me dislike playing killer.
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The only nerf looping deserves is taking away the damn infinites, everything else is fine as It is.
Some killers have powers that cancel looping and you even have perks to practically negate some loops... I dont really see why anyone would complain about looping.
Seriously now, remove those freaking infinites. That ######### can be abused by all 4 survivors making It 12 vaults and not even Bamboozle can stop most of them because most of them always have 2 windows...
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We want survivors to not be boring. Abusing chase mechanics to make chases super long while other 3 rush gens is boring.
Killer gets to do nothing but hold w and break pallets.
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Not trying to to sound rude here but i don’t be get when killers loop for a long period why don’t they just leave that specific survivor. I’ve played killer here and there and if i’m getting terribly looped i leaves that survivor
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Basically there is an alternative to looping which is juking back into stealth. It doesn't work well enough compared to looping which is why people don't do it. I consider this a problem that should be fixed.
It comes down to:
Scratchmarks OP.
No really. That Killer ability is the root cause of a really annoying SURVIVOR strategy, simply because Scratchmarks make it almost impossible to shake a Killer who wants you downed, thus the only viable alternative is to make downing you take too long to be worth it (or make it literally take forever).
However ideally your goal in a chase is to go back into hiding. In order for this to be an expected goal it also MUST be viable to achieve in most situations (that means perkless). Once this is the case we can nerf the ######### out of looping, safe in the idea that survivor have a more interesting and intuitive alternative. And the way to do that is to nerf scratchmarks in general.
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@FengMinEqualsWin Because it won't help. Most survivors do it so you'd just be wasting time going for another person who is going to do the same thing while the one you left hops on a gen.
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I think i’m a decent survivor when it comes to chases but i’ve gone up against many GOOD killer mains so it’s not impossible to down a decent survivor
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@FengMinEqualsWin I always operate on the assumption that everyone else is going to be attempting to play optimally. In this meta that means looping, thus if I drop a survivor because I'm being looped then that just means not only do I loose the time from that chase but it also means I haven't solved the problem as the next survivor I find will loop me instead.
Without a Killer who can bypass the issue you will inevitably get looped.
For the record I play Spirit, which is both a Killer who bypasses the issue AND a Killer who can be juked making her one of the most fun Killers to play as or against.
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I really do enjoy chases with spirits cause i’ve seen many good mindgaming spirits when they fake use their power to trick you
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Exactly! Imagine if the other Killers chases were more about mindgames than raw time management. THAT is what I want. Not a free down, not you standing still, certainly not being ran around through a set optimal path. I want a clash of wits.
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That's why I love Spirit. You might win the chase, fine. But you'll do so by outplaying me, not entering a chase which is pretty much an endless flowchart of optimal movement.
I think the game would be more enjoyable for killers if it were less about constant time management and more about mindgames. That's how the strongest killers play anyway.
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@NuclearBurrito That would be nice. Unfortunately, for that you need developers and designers whose strength lies in such mind games and clashes of wits when designing maps, perks, and characters. And unfortunately, so far it doesn't seem that such folks are members of the DbD staff.
So, what we get is, in too many cases, a lowest common denominator of design on those aspects.
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They aren't really mad at you for looping, they're mad at the developers for allowing looping to go on this long in its broken state.
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I've always held that mind games are the ultimate form of PVP. They are the only type of gameplay that inherently requires another player (besides roleplay somewhat) and it is self balancing to a point.
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No rest until 4k under 3min is the balance standard
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@NuclearBurrito What's interesting is that I can mind game enemies quite effectively in Overwatch and Paladins. Herd them to where I want them on the map for my team's optimal positioning, bait out ultimates when we're prepared for them and can counter them, force their healers out of position with feint maneuvers, et cetera.
Here? Here it's a lot less common to be able to do half of the mind games that should be in the game, and for the few you can pull-off, it's just way too much damned effort for very little reward. At least for a majority of the killers.
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you’re saying you want to ben able to get a 4k in under 3min?
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@FengMinEqualsWin r/woosh (I hope)
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Right now the standard against good survivors is "4 gens in 3 min" but I guess that's perfectly fine right?
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i’m very lost (._.)
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And this is completely balanced? Laughable. But yeah let's nerf every killer to the level of Legion.
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Once I faced a Trapper who facecamped a teammate 'cause "she looped him and stunned him" and "he hated that". It was so ridiculous, the rest of us escaped. Other matches I saw killers complaining and acussing me for going on SWF (I play solo), other ones for using Adren, Balanced Landing. Some killer mains just want to be the game so easier and live their lifes complaining about DBD, the only thing we can do is ignore them.
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I’m not a killer main, but I would like stealth to be more viable. Maybe decrease scratchmarks staying to five seconds and making maps darker (not including the basement, I feel for the Freddy mains with the old basement lighting.)
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I play more killer than survivor and even if I get absolutely shat on during the match, I only say something besides gg in the end game chat if people start being toxic for no reason whatsoever.
But yeah, there are extremely toxic people from both sides. Multiplayer games are bound to be like this, especially when the game mechanics sometimes favor a stressfull gameplay, like it often happens in DBD.
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Killer mains want survivors to stand still exactly as much as Survivor mains want killers to not chase them.
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Since when being good running of the killer means "abusing chase mechanics"?. I mean, we are survivors, What are we supposed to do? Let Killers hit us easy and giving them easy hooks or kills? That's not gonna happen
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I don't think scratch marks are the issue. The limiting factor on stealth right now is terrible map design. There needs to be way more objects, grass,reeds, boxes etc to break line of sight mid chase and make jukes. Currently making jukes and losing the survivor is only happening if the killer is just dumb or intentionally letting them go.
Stealth also isn't utlized because looping is just too strong. Why stealth when looping is just faster and better? Looping needs to be weakened and maps improved for stealth.
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I play killer too but not so much as survivor. Once I played with my former main (Hag in fact). I putted a trap near the hatch and then I chased one survivor and hooked him. I had BBQ and I saw the last near the hatch, he triggered the trap and I catched him before he could escape. In the end game chat he called me "BBQ abuser", it was hilarious
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The only thing I love more than being called a BBQ abuser is being called a filthy camper when I hook someone after the gates are opened and don't leave the hook area because there are three other survivors literally dancing around me trying to rescue the other guy.
I mean, sure. Let me stare at the wall and count to 10 while you guys unhook your teammate, heal them up and teabag me at the gate.
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Anyways as for something specific I'd want. How about something like:
Survivors no longer leave scratchmarks, like at all, but:
Survivors now have a stamina bar, when it is full they run at 4.4 meters per second (that's 110% btw) however it gradually goes down to 3.6 over 30 seconds of running.
Lithe and balanced landing now cost stamina to use, Sprint burst is only used at max stamina and Dead hard goes on cooldown when used and stays on cooldown until your stamina goes back to full.
It could recharge at the same rate it drains (1 second of walking gives you 1 second of stamina out of 30) and exhaustion would instead reduce the recharge time (with exhaustion perks no longer actually giving the status) depending on the addon causing it.
This means looping isn't viable as you only get slower over time, however it means that initially you can maintain your distance better than now in order to break LoS at which point no scratchmarks.
Thoughts?
Btw that's 15 seconds of running faster than now.
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@Blueberry I try to play stealthy but losing the killer take a lot of thinking and strategy so looping is easier. Haddonfield is a good example of stealth being more viable with all the LOS breakers. That is why I love it so much. :)
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Yeah i enjoy haddonfield a lot as well for that reason lol
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I don't care what you do to survive. You're behind that screen, not the players trying to make you play differently.
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I haven't read all the comments here, but the problem with looping pallets is that they were meant to block or stun the killer momentarily and then you move to the next one. Once survivors found out they could stall by running in circles, that became the most viable strategy, as wasting the killer's time so teammates could work gens was even more helpful than using pallets to actually lose the killer (thus letting them find someone else and stop progress).
The issue remains that there's really no way to 'remove' the ability to loop without taking away pallets, changing Bloodlust, altering movement speed... they don't know what to do, so for now it stays like it is. No one has fun running in circles, even if you are evading the killer, and imagine how frustrating it is for them, time and time again, each time they chase a new survivor. I'm certainly not trying to take away any defenses against killers, but some sort of change to reduce the repetition in running around a single obstacle might be for the benefit of everyone.
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Just make bloodlust permanent and endlessly stacking
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Technically looping USED TO be considered an exploit, but it isn’t anymore. The devs themselves said it was when the game first released, but then later said it isn’t anymore, probably because of many other changes to the game since then.
People who say it’s an exploit are still living in 2016.
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Not trying to sound super toxic but i love looping the killer. I get some sort of adrenaline rush questioning whether or not i can make it to the pallet
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This is a perfect example of how simple-minded Survivor mains are these days.
Killers are getting tired of looping so they complain. Survivors reaction: LOL should we just stand still? As if looping and standing still are the only two possibilities.
Survivors complaining about tunneling. Imagine Killers reaction: LOL should we just stand still? (because according to Survivors logic, that's the ONLY alternative)
...and here comes the irony: IF Killers actually stand still, Survivors will complain about camping.
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i legit get called pussy and other names for being stealthy and not being found, i dont know what killers want
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I feel sorry for you that you are under the assumption that the only two ways to play Survivors are either looping or standing still.
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Killers can loop aswell
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Stealth is already pretty viable. It just takes skill and requires... To use Claudette. But no matter how strong stealth becomes, unless it's a nurse majority will keep looping cuz it's more fun than evading the killer 99% of the time.
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Killer mains: "I don't find loops to be fun."
You: "So you want us to do nothing, got it, i'll make a thread about it."
Yeah, seems logical.
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Yes, they always want survivors running in a straight line, It's the classic killer brain mentality. Complaining about looping that it would be an exploit in any case is just a pointless excuse because they can't 4K every match when they face good survivors. They can't accept that it's an intended game mechanic because it seems they never played as survivor against sweaty tryhard killerinos.
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