There was absolutely NOTHING mentioned for killer gameplay or accessibility improvements!
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1. The survivor HUD is made to help SoloQ with regards to communication. It doesn't really do anything for swf and helps a communication aspect that was sadly lacking from SoloQ, without giving away too much (where on the map they are, for example). This made sense overall as quality of life.
2. Visual Terror Radius helps hard of hearing and, from trying it as survivor, adds barely any extra help for people who do not need it. It's an aid for hearing.
3. Anti-facecamping is an absolute must and punishes the low-effort killer players who aren't that good. A kid could face-camp and get kills. The team also said this meter they're introducing will slow dramatically if survivors swarm it and once the gayes are powered the meter is cancelled entirely, so the one and only time face-camping can be a reasonable play is not affected. Really, you have to be an inadequate player to rely on this. Most players who are even half-decent as killer don't need to fall on this dumb issue. So glad they fixed this.
4. As a killer, I HATE survivors who dc early because they have a hissy fit. The game just feels like a chore to get to a more competitive game. The bots give the other sirvivors a bit more of a chance and makes the game involving for killer. A bot is not likely to be a god-tier player, so whilst it helps survivors out, likewise it's not like the killer now has to face a ninja.
As for what killers have had: 10 seconds extra to gens, quicker recovery on hits and breaking items, nerfs to perks like Dead Hard. Others as well which I may not have to mind currently. Also, the road map can have changes at anu point and in relation to what is happening in-game.
Basically, killers and survivors get buffs and nerfs to their playstyle all the time. It's been proven time and time and time again that the devs are not any-sided and BHVR often reacts to trends. Tunnelling got bad? They introduced BT. Dead Hard way too overused? Nerfed. Gens going too fast? Added time to it.
Whilst I understand it may frustrating to not hear anything about killer changes, maybe it's because currently there isn't a reason to and future game-play changes will react to what is happening at the time. I'm certain if something becomes too abused from the survivor side, it too will change. The game constantly evolves. Players need to evolve with it.
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Exactly my thoughts. Don't know what this person is thinking. Even if I am losing, I still want everyone to finish the game. The only thing less fun than losing is winning on the technicality of a disconnect
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Gotten far enough into it? Sometimes we are given months, or a year advance notice for survivor changes. Why didn’t BHVR say something like “Hey, we’re also working on killer gameplay improvements, so stay tuned for more info in the future”?
Even if you want to argue survivor bots, we still have the survivor HUD, visual terror radius, and anti face-camping announcements, and nothing for killers.
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because killers are in a good spot? lol
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Sure, they could've, but them not saying that isn't somehow an insult or a slight. There's a thousand things, even great things that the game desperately needs, they could have said. It's also worth mentioning that they tend to get given flak for saying "soon(tm)" so I don't blame them for only sharing when they have something concrete to talk about.
The visual terror radius is the one accessibility change they made, the other stuff is just... gameplay improvements, and it's not like killers have been lacking in that. 6.1 had a ton of killer gameplay improvements, and specific killers have gotten noticeable improvements too since then. Add in perk balance changes and map changes, and killers are far from left in the dust.
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killers can't kill lol.
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These are good changes but I understand where you are coming from. Nothing in this patch addresses issues faced by killer players, and just destroys some strategies used by killers to gain pressure.
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Your pretty confident they won't f those up look at there recent maps and reworks.
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Those reworks are most likely gonna be like red forest reworks tho, they'll just update it visually, add some more random stuff to the map, add some more safe pallets and loops and call it a day.
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How many years need to go by, before we can consider it a slight? This isn't the first year this has happened. We knew about the survivor HUD plans a very long time ago, and back then people said "oh, well, just because survivors get something doesn't mean killers need to get something"..... but that was over a year ago, and we now have a roadmap for the next few months, which means about a 2 year timeframe without announcements for killers?
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Yeah, we don't even know if the changes will be killer sided. I know for a fact that the new red forest maps are a lot less fun for Huntress, because they added a million line of sight blockers that make it so much more difficult to try for long ranged hatchets. And let's remember that the new skull merchant shack is so much more annoying than anything from the old red forest maps.
For all we know, they might be reducing the size of the giant deadzones (cornfields), and replacing them with safe tiles, because it is "too easy for m1 killers to hit a survivor that runs into a cornfield"
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Nope, they already reworked. They got their visual updates. They said they will re-balance those maps. Not re-visual.
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There's no amount, it'll never be a slight. At worst it'll be neglectful, not an active slight.
As for the roadmap, the visual terror radius wasn't on the previous roadmap. Things do get added if they make changes on the fly and don't have it concrete enough to share at that point in time, that's just how it works.
There's nothing wrong with advocating for good changes like an FOV slider, but it's a mistake to get so wrapped up in it that you start decrying other good changes because they aren't the one specific thing you've made your biggest concern. Again, killer players haven't been abandoned, there's been plenty of good changes for both sides recently, it's just accessibility specifically that survivors got one thing for and killers didn't.
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They mentioned them and specifically pointed out that they were very Survivor favored maps.
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You need to take this with a grain of salt because when they reworked Gas Heaven it only became stronger for expert level survivors.
Blood Lodge is however more fair than it was before so there is that.
I feel like the first thing they are going to do with Abattoir is make it bigger. Someone will be like why is this survivor sided map so small? Let's make it bigger and even more unfair for the killer!
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Oh it's already bad and it's definitely getting worse. I'm leveling up a prestige a survivor to 100 and riding out the storm. I suggest everyone do the same until they fix the game for killers. I'm not going to juggle the killer meta anymore and get bullied. Also if you win or lose you get toxic messages so I honestly have no interest in killer outside of bloodpoints.
Also you are right about slow down perks getting gutted but generators are still 2 minutes.
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I really don't understand how Killer is so difficult right now?
It feels pretty fair.
Perks like DH are gone. DS is gone. 3-genning (besides a certainly Dull Killer) is gone.
The game for the average Survivor is a lot worse than it is for Killer.
Even if you take the "I only face top teams" sort of thing, it's still winnable as a lot of Killers. Way more than it was 2 years ago.
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And red forest was the worst map and they somehow messed that up and made it worse.
Plus borgo and joy are horrible maps. There track record isn't good lately and wouldn't be surprised if they somehow make the maps worse
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Just playing devils advocate here but considering this was an anniversary stream to celebrate the game and it’s ENTIRE community, them not really having anything significant or even small for killers to look forward to did seem a bit rude.
Maps being reworked will benefit the entire community and there is no guarantee that they will do the rework well. Just look at Gideons.
I’m not big on the Us. Vs. Them mentality as it’s very unproductive but I am a huge fan of inclusivity and leaving out a large portion of your community during a celebration of that community, felt a lot like buying some of your kids gifts for Christmas and not getting your others anything but the opportunity to watch their siblings open gifts.
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Have y'all forgotten about the nerfs survivors tool the last Mid-Chapter patch? Healing speed nerfs, med kit nerfs and killers finally got their COH nerf they cried about. I'm not sure I understand why killers want survivors nerfed hard to the ground. As a killer main, I feel that while there can be improvements to killers, killer side is the easiest it's ever been.
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Read my comment above. Killer is the easiest it's ever been. I'm a killer main for over 2 years now. With my main Pig, I usually can get 3 kills the majority of my games without camping or tunneling. It's not needed. And it's not fun for the survivors.
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-"I really don't understand how Killer is so difficult right now? It feels pretty fair."
The survivors still have the ability to win the game in under 3 minutes. Old and ineffective killers still need 6-8 minutes to finish their objective.
In what world is that fair?
-"Killer is the easiest it's ever been."
I've been a killer for 6 years and you're wrong. The easiest time to play killer was the era of super bloodlust that existed before DH was a perk available to survivors.
-"with my main Pig, I usually can get 3 kills the majority of my games without camping or tunneling."
So are you better than CMWinter who is the #1 pig playing DBD? He plays against strong teams all the time and sometimes he flattens them but sometimes they just comp drop all the pallets and he gets zero kills.
You're probably not playing the same caliber of people that he plays against - no offense.
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Can someone tell me if killer is easier or harder? I thought the existance of old (pre-rework) DH, no Blood lust, infinite loops etc. meant survivors bullied killers back in the day.
Was the game better for killers then and worse now? What is the truth? Or are people wearing nostalgia goggles and just think that the game was better cause it was still new to them when they started.
DH got nerfed, medkits nerfed, self-healing nerfed in general, CoH nerfed as well. What gives? I thought everyone was on the same page about face-camping. We supposedly got Re-assurance and although it seemed strong when it hit live it was not the same. The radius is pretty small that you need to reveal yourself and put yourself in harm's way for it to work. Now I would be happy if the change we got was only some radius increase for Reassurance but it still is a pay to maybe counter camping kind of perk.
We don't even know if the change for anti-camping will go live. Basekit UB didn't go live either, but slugging for the 4k still remains an issue.
An interesting point Scott makes about the anti-camping mechanic:
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Wait, the meter fills up even if survivors are nearby? Alright that I really dislike, even if it's a slower rate. I'd also hope killers would be notified that the bar is filling up (not necessarily the exact level) just because I also don't like the idea of a survivor still being able to unhook themselves if the killer is checking in a nearby area unaware that there are or are not survivors nearby.
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I liked everything about the steam including the presentation.
I was disappointed to not hear anything about killers being reworked or their addons.
Can only hope…
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If you lose a game in 3 minutes, that's usually on you.
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I want nothing more than updated kill rates and statistics right now.
I feel like BHVR is metrics driven, and will generally only change something if the data agrees.
I'm still convinced that them expediting the Eruption nerf up by at least 6 weeks was a break glass event. Like kill rates north of 65% or so.
I know seeing kill rates won't quell the complaining, but it would be nice to know. I feel like a lot of people are expecting killer buffs when BHVR's data is saying killers are doing 'better than fine' overall.
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Yeah that was disappointing. I'm sure changes like they will come but I'd rather hear about it than 70% of what was covered (bots and camping were great though)
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Killers will probably eventually get buffs, but things are going to get bad before then.
- Survivors will eventually realize that DH was given a placebo nerf and start running it again (it's still annoying as hell when you do see it; the only thing the "nerf" did was make sure most people don't run it anymore), which will be doubly effective since killers don't check for it or try to bait it out anymore.
- Survivors are focusing less on healing and more on gens, use of perks like Resilience are up, and there's no reliable way to regress gens anymore, so I'm already seeing my games become much shorter on average. (Still winnable, but it means playing nasty and aggressive and going for snowballs as much as possible.) This will only get worse with time.
- And then bots will probably measurably decrease kill rates as well, even if DC'd survivors don't count towards official kill rate statistics. (I still think this is a good change in general.)
- Survivors are getting good at ignoring the healing changes by running multiple healing perks (my most successful build on solo at preset is Botany/Desperate/Overcome/Self-Care - I have gotten 5-6 game winstreaks with this); if one or more survivor runs such a build, it can largely or completely negate the so-called anti-heal meta, and the more survivors figure this out, the lower kill rates will plummet.
- If current trends continue, tunneling will be nerfed, Deadlock will be nerfed to ten seconds, and they'll rework PR.
At some point, all this will come to a head, and kill rates will start dropping. At that point, we'll probably get another 6.1.0.
How do bots work? I'm not familiar, but if they hit every skillcheck every time, can perform perfect flashlight saves, and actually (unlike most solo queue survivors) focus on gens, it seems like that'll affect game balance and kill rates.
I have no idea how much he is exaggerating, but.
Can someone explain this to me, please?
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Yeah, I remember Sadako and Dredge being top 5 really confused people (they were top 5 at top 5% MMR) and people were looking all ways to explain it. I dunno why they had such a hard time, both can teleport and cover ground faster than other killers and most games aren't playing comp. Heck in comp you can't use everything you can use in pubs anyway sp it's expected that some stuff can be broken on killers especially vs a team of randos (even if two are SWF).
Everyone and their mother run Eruption, CoB, etc.The justifications we got and all the arguments of them not being OP cause you can just call when your teammate is going down with aura reading can rival the don't swing for DH that killers hated. Both got nerfed. Dh is as good as dead now (unless it gets changed or something), CoH is much weaker and self-healing is slow af. Heck after the healing nerf I still had a killer complain to me about healing in after game chat, even though we mostly healed each other.
Even if we got killrates people would still justify that survivors kill themselves or survivors are bad or something or that actually killers should average 3k because he should be the power role or something.
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Running around unwinnable tiles isn’t fun for killer. What’s your point? You can win with pig because most people aren’t good at the game, as can any other killer who learns the game. Low level play isn’t an accurate picture of the meta.
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Bots will hit skill checks, unless you interrupt them.
Bots do have good flashlight save timing, but they are also bots. They aren't exactly...smart.
They do stay on gens, but they are genuinely awful in chase.
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They are bad at chases but they are effective on gens. So if you chase them, you can use this on your advantage because they won't greed god - pallets.
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He's a Survivor main who got called out on the other thread. I already spotted the Survivor mains and they tryna act like they play Killer xD
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So, are you just gonna ignore the fact that you can see how much I've played Killer on the screenshot I posted?
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They will use the bots from custom matches. I'm fairly sure that this is a buff for killer since the bots are so bad.
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It's kinda an even trade.
Bots do gens. That's more than a DC'd teammate will do.
They also, theoretically, allow Killers to get achievements and BP when people DC.
They are also very bad in chase.
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I guess we’ll see how long survivor queues get once the changes go live. We’ve seen in the past that killers have gotten buffs when kill rates got too low. My initial thought is the same as many others that these changes are unbalanced in favor of survivors, but I’m willing to see how it goes. If killer becomes too miserable I will stop playing killer and so will many others. BHVR will have to make balance changes if they want to keep their game alive. But let’s wait and see how the changes play out first.
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Yes, it was a very very common request lol and I never saw anyone comment against it. Suddenly it's a bad thing? This community...
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I mean you aren’t going to get anything without giving some constructive criticism. All the survivors changes you mentioned are features that players have been vocal about for awhile.
Personally I feel like killer balance changes have been slow lately. I wouldn’t mind at least 1 killer being forcused on per chapter or during each mid chapter patch. There’s few killers that I rarely see in my games and when I do they’re a pushover.
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Ok so.... some of these big updates sound better then getting nothing
Bot Survivors when someone DC's is really good
Planning on changing Coldwind Farm is really good but the sooner the better (IMO)
So what about Killer what good thing do they get...
Bot Survivors when Survivors DC... so it doesn't turn into either farming or getting an easy 3K and little to no points
Seems that maps have made their way it's still up in the air... it depends on what they do to them
but alas it seems like it matters how they word everything... it's kinda sad to say the least
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The HUD and heartbeat weren't announced at last year's roadmap. Hardly comparable.
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1) We have a short m1 attack bug that can steal hits from the killer, but BHVR won't even comment on this issue. BHVR also admitted that aim dressing can steal hits from killers... is that still happening? Are the "aim dressing problems" really just the short m1 attack bug, and people are mislabeling it? If aim dressing can still steal hits from the killer, that should be fixed too. Both these issues fall under the killer gameplay issue of reliable attacks, which this game doesn't have sometimes, because the double validation of the short m1 attack bug, and the double validation of aim dressing, can be disorienting, and possibly can steal hits from the killer.
2) FoV slider has been mentioned multiple times on these forums, but zero feedback from BHVR. Not a "we don't want to do this". Not a "maybe in the future, but not anytime soon".... Just zero feedback from BHVR.
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Play solo survivor for 20 games straight and watch your sanity leave. Everytime killers are asked about solo survivor they either act like they are pro (but they never post a guide lmao) or don't address it at all and just turn the conversation to high MMR and SWF. Every killer main here is top MMR apparently.
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I would never tell if I lose to bots, because it would be so embarrassed.
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So they are going to remove the thing Killer players like to do when you hurt their feelings by looping them or hitting them with a pallette? Good change 👍️
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Remember we're not talking about me.
I'm talking about games I have seen on the streams of killer mains like : Otz, Truetalent and CoconutRTS to name a few.
When we have extreme veteran professional players losing the gens in 3 minutes it's a pretty clear sign that something is wrong with game balance.
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Coconut almost never uses gen perks, at least when i watched him. That's probably why his games are over fairly quickly.
Otz usually uses a variety of builds, but often doesn't stack slowdowns and generally plays pretty nice. He also usually admits where he messed up and what he could have done differently.
Tru is...not someone I would call extremely skilled. Knowledgeable? Certainly, but he seems like he's stuck in 2018 or 2019 DBD and isn't willing to move on. Which is totally fine, but he's just not anywhere near Otz or Coconut's caliber, imo.
Better examples would be Hens, Zaka, KnightLight etc etc
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Tbf mothers dwelling change went from good for survivors to amazing for survivors, so I personally do not trust them with maps, I disagree with OP as I as a killer player disagree with that sentiment but asuming bhvr understands how to fix a map shows either incredibly good faith on them or a lack of memory on their past misdeeds.
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Abattoir is one of the fairest maps in the game. It is at the end of the priority list of maps in need of rework. Also, nothing ensures that Cowshed won't become even more survivor-sided just like with what happened with Gas Heaven and Mother Dwelling recently...
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