Can BHVR make game changes to encourage survivors to work together, to help bridge solo q / SWF gap?
"Q: Although the gap between SWF and solo survivors has been reduced quite significantly since the addition of the survivor activity HUD in 6.5.0, there is still a notable power imbalance. In my opinion, this is caused particularly because of two reasons: (1) the lack of shown progression for non-repairing and non-recovery actions in the activity HUD and (2) a lack of information about ally perks/items.
Are there any plans to further bridge the SWF and solo survivor gap by providing solo players with more information about their allies?
A: We always monitor the difference between survivor groups (SWF and solo) and our current stance is that lack of information is not the crux of the problem, but rather that friends work together by nature and solo survivors don't (as much). -Mike"
Can BHVR make game changes to encourage survivors to work together, to help bridge solo q / SWF gap? Above, BHVR said the Solo q / SWF gap current happens because "friends work together by nature and solo survivors don't (as much)". That means we should have game changes to encourage solo q survivors to work together, right? We do want to bridge the gap between solo q and SWF, right?
Comments
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They basically said a whole lot of nothing. 🤐
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Their response got a ton of downvotes (rightfully so). Even Otz commented on it
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I don't understand why we aren't getting updates to encourage solo q survivors to work together. BHVR literally just said that is what they feel is the main gap between solo q and SWF, so obviously they should we working on this, right? Does BHVR still want to bridge the gap between solo q and SWF?
I understand BHVR gave an answer that many people didn't like, but if we got updates to encourage teamwork, that would be great, right?
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Then killer would complain about that and the circle continues.
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Its a fact a lot of Solo survivor is selfish, look at the perk they use : Self Care or spamming meta perk every match.
SoloQ is okay, the player just don't know how to work with random.
You don't need BHVR "encourage" for doing something right.
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Encouraging people to play in a certain way is very difficult, we give perks to survivors to counter tunnelling - has that encouraged killers not to tunnel for example?
You can only do so much, you can give people the tools, it's up to them how they use them.
We even have perks for those that do not want to play as a team, Sole Survivor comes to mind.
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I don't understand why BHVR gives players perks that help enable lone wolf builds. I understand that people are free to play the game how they want, but actively giving survivors anti-team perks feels like it's just causing frustration for many players on both sides of the game.
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They need to really redo the point system. This is what will solve it. I play with one other person so we have either two randoms or a two SWF. The other night the one player ran the killer the entire game and escaped. They did not touch a gen did not heal anyone, did not rescue anyone just ran them and got hooked twice, they ended up with double the amount of points than everyone else who did ALL the gens. THE GENS ARE LITERALLY THE OBJECTIVE. I mean the PIP system is garbage too.
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Which perks effectively counter tunneling though? Decisive Strike was the only one that came to mind but now it's become an obsolete perk. Killers wouldn't even care if the whole team ran DS, it's pretty much that useless. I've seen a Nurse get stunned by it and down the survivor in one blink. For The People might also help but now it's used for more selfish measures of annoying the killer to just tunnel them even harder. I'm really glad it's getting addressed (Buckle Up + For The People), but it's far from an effective counter by itself. Off The Record is also completely negated by a killer hitting you immediately off hook. If they are tunneling, there's a high chance they are camping. Dead Hard is the only actual perk that can do something unless you get hit off hook, and even that has one use. After you use it once, the second time will be expected and that's the perk gone.
Tunneling was definitely decreased due to Decisive Strike stunning for five seconds for fairly obvious reasons. If you provide survivors with an actual counter to it, they will use it - no one likes getting tunneled off hook. The endgame deactivation was a justified nerf and then the perk just got stomped on without explanation after that. I'm glad there's a rework coming but it being so far off is just irritating to say the least.
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Being in a game as a solo queue survivor and realizing you have a teammate who is only in it to wait for everyone else to die so they can escape with Left Behind/Sole Survivor is extremely discouraging for all the other survivors in the match who actually want to work as a team.
I realize that survivors need to look out for themselves sometimes and that's completely fine, that's just how the game is, but there are still 4 survivors in every match and I don't think using those perks to play selfishly should be a desirable strategy as it makes the game worse for everyone else involved, both the other 3 survivors and the killer too. It's one thing if you tried to do generators, loop the killer, unhook/heal teammates, etc. and the match still went south and it's clear that the killer is going to win, so now you have those perks as a backup plan. That's fine. But it's another thing when a teammate hides for the entire game/almost the entire game and makes little or no effort to progress the game in any way even when a game is still within reach for survivors (or would be within reach, if it wasn't essentially a 3v1).
To be clear, I'm not saying survivors always have to be altruistic. There are some cases where it's not realistic when the game is essentially already over. But working as a team should always be encouraged the most, at least up until the point that a game is clearly lost for the survivors. Seeing 3 survivors working together, and ultimately fail, only to then see the 4th survivor get an easy escape with a perk or item after making little or no effort to help their teammates, is frustrating regardless of whether I'm one of the 3 dead survivors, or whether I'm the killer who just got an easy and uninteresting win because only 3 survivors were trying to finish the generators and help their team. I don't want to be handed free wins as killer just because my opponents were basically missing a teammate. That's not fun and it's even less fun for the other survivors.
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Thank you for giving a completely reasonable answer here. People should play how they want. Sometimes it can be frustrating if a player is good at loops. Sometimes it's frustrating when the killer tunnels. There are lots of ways to skin it, just make it fair. Sometimes you will play with cowboys. Sometimes you will swf.
I play for my own fun. If you have fun too, that's great.
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rightfully so. it is such bad response.
How do you expect people to heal if they cannot tell where their teammate is on the map? Healing is group-action. Telling me on UI that someone is injured is irrelevant if i don't know where the person is to heal. Empathy/Bond
How do I know what pallet my teammate dropped in killer chase if I have 0 aura on the pallet drop? Window of opportunity helps with this. Giving me UI that my teammate is being chased is not helping me know where my teammate is dropping pallets.
What about going for hook saves? How do i know if my teammate will save that person on hook across the map with 0 aura? (Kindred)
there answer: "our current stance is that lack of information is not the crux of the problem," Information what allow you to do teamwork actions. Soloq doesn't help each other. no kidding, there is 0 base-kit aura reading to do any of these actions properly.
This is not even going into other macro elements like... bodyblocking, flashlight saving, sabo, looping away from teammates that are on generators, knowing what your teammate brought as perk so you can count on them to use said perk to deal with x situation.
what a terrible answer.
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I’m fine with the answer of “the problem with solo q is they don’t work together as often”, because that is a major problem with solo q.
What I’m not fine with, is the “we don’t want to do anything to fix this problem, because survivors should be able to play the game how they want”.
Does this mean we’re officially done with bridging the gap between solo q and SWF? If the official problem is lack of teamwork, but BHVR doesn’t want to fix that…. then we’re done bridging the gap?
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I'm sorry but I really don't get the logic here.
BHVR has no plans for tools to allow survivors to see their teammates' loadouts because the problem is actually the lack of teamwork.
BHVR also has no plans to improve said teamwork because they can't force solos to use the tools.
BHVR actually encourages the lack of teamwork and rewards selfish plays with perks like sole survivor that are apparently completely fine.
So survivors aren't getting teamwork tools because they don't use teamwork enough in a game that rewards not using teamwork ?
Edit: Like, we're not asking for buffs we just want to see the loadouts in the lobby how hard can that be for real 😭
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I really feel like players own sense of game knowledge should carry them through this issue.
Survivors have a HUD that now allows them to see what action each player is doing. Running a perk like Bond (or even Kindred) will allow you to see where a person is generally.
We don't need comp callouts or "I'm over at X/Y/Z!". Just use your head. If you saw someone on Kindred (which should be a perk everyone is running on solo queue if they want to play optimally) working on a gen, don't take the killer in that direction in a chase if you haven't seen that gen pop.
All of these complaints on the topic are pretty easily debunked/explained.
Kyto has some good Youtube videos on tips for solo queue. If you guys struggle with solos so much, I'd advise his channel!
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