TUNNELING NEEDS TO BE ADRESSED ASAP

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  • WW1PilotAce
    WW1PilotAce Member Posts: 61
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    that is fine by me, i would give base corrupt intervention for a base ds

  • Tsukihi
    Tsukihi Member Posts: 56
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    I believe that annihilating everyone is what a murderer enjoys, so I prioritize killing one person first.

    That's how I enjoy it.

    There is no reason for the survivors to complain.

  • HamsterEnjoyer
    HamsterEnjoyer Member Posts: 607
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  • Hexling
    Hexling Member Posts: 657
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    No they got the nerfs because killers still tunneled even when they were strong. Hell they even tunneled in a fun game mode like lights out. Its just they are pre programed because they aren't good at killer and cant do anything because its all they know how to do . Take it away and they will be forced to get better at killer.

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,800
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    That is fine but tunnelling does need to be addressed as it is potentially harming the game.

    I am seeing streamers (I know they aren't an authority on all things DBD) who are not top tier players pretty much tapping out of DBD and switching to another game due to the proxying and tunnelling off hook constantly.

    It harms the newer player experience which is not good for the future of DBD, as when new players don't continue to come in and replace the old players who have simply moved on, the game will die

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,147
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    People have been saying dbd is dying for the past few years now. It's really the most empty statement people love to parrot.

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,800
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    No I get what you are saying and I do agree people have been saying DBD is dying pretty much since day one.

    But there has never been a hard tunnelling meta like there is now and newer players were not subjected to the misery of not being able to play matches at all as they just get proxied and tunnelled out constantly.

    Will it kill DBD? Maybe not but it will start to harm the game if new players quit after a few hours and never come back.

  • Pulsar
    Pulsar Member Posts: 20,725
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    They didn't say it was killing the game, they said it was POTENTIALLY harming it.

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,800
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  • bodilystew_
    bodilystew_ Applicant Posts: 32
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    I've played like 50 survivor matches and haven't been tunneled once lmfao

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,800
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    Well I guess that clears it up then, there is no problem at all because random poster guy/gal in the forums says they haven't been tunnelled for 50 matches.

    Thread over I guess

  • Hannacia
    Hannacia Member Posts: 1,178
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    I play both sides, though lately i've stopped playing killer due to the "stress" that side gives me.

    I agree tunneling is really high at the moment. I play on EU servers and tunneling is quite common here at 5 gens. When i see blights i always expect them to play like comp blights and tunnel 1 person out in before 1 gen is done. This isn't fun and usually means easy kill for the killer whoever it might be.

    Now from killers point of view. I like to play fair, but there are matches where i tunnel. I tunnel if you get unhooked near me and you start bodyblocking me with your BT or Off the Record. I'll put you back to hook. Don't bodyblock me and you are safe. There are also matches where i literally lose 2-3 gens during first chase. Some maps are impossible and changing target can be risky too. Those matches i might have to be naughtier to get back pressure, but i don't enjoy those games. Do survivors enjoy games where you just sit on gens?

    I do think winstreaks and just sweaty killers who want easy 4k and brag about it in endgame are causing issues to the game but basekit DS is def not going to help. These killers will tunnel through that and i personally don't believe any "meta" perks should become basekit ever again. Honest...i don't think there can be a solution to this as long as winstreaks and killers who just want to tunnel exist. Also as long as 3 gens can pop during first chase tunneling will happen.

  • PotatoPotahto
    PotatoPotahto Member Posts: 250
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    Basekit DS can be an option only if survivors will be prevented from taking hits with it.

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,800
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    Yes but this isn't reality, the majority of the DBD player base are low skill casual survivors. Worse still is I find that when killers identify they have a baby survivor, instead of maybe going a little easier on them they instead will often target them to tunnel them out of the game first which is a horrible experience for new players .

    As I have said many times, the first 1000 hours in DBD is just the tutorial...

  • Blueberry
    Blueberry Member Posts: 13,589
    edited March 20
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    Tunneling can be removed when the balance isn't so bad that it's no longer required.

    A 12 hook game should be possible if the killer plays well enough. Just like a 4 man escape is, if they play well enough. 12 hook games are not possible right now unless the survivors play badly, regardless of how well the killer plays. Both sides need agency.

    Also the amount of tunneling is ridiculously exaggerated. The amount of times I hear people call the killer a tunneler and they actually tunneled, is less than 10% of the time. Survivors call it tunneling basically anytime the same person gets hooked twice in a row, that is not tunneling. If the killer just happens to run into you twice in a row you can't just ignore them and welp let's go look randomly for someone else and let him get back on the gen as I turn my back.

  • Unknown2765
    Unknown2765 Member Posts: 2,011
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    Gen timers are way too fast with perks and toolboxes, but tunneling defo also needs to be addressed.

    Its optimised for fast moving killers and most of the slow moving killers gets screwed, so they needed to tunnel to compensate, but now the strong and fast moving killers tunnel, on 5 gens too.

  • CursedPerson
    CursedPerson Member Posts: 62
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    Survivors need to do this to even have a chance at winning to deal with the immediate tunneling of killers and the killers that stack 4 gen regression perks causing you to lose 2-3 gens worth of progression

  • xltechno
    xltechno Member Posts: 1,026
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    I think I was a little slow in acting because I only experienced skill checks twice at this stage. And at this stage, it is a bad idea for two people other than you to be involved in one gen. If all three players don't act to complete separate gens, the match will play out more in line with the killer's intentions. If the killer comes to the two of you, there will be no one to complete the gen except you, and the three of you will not be able to do your best. It is presumed that such a small mistake led to this situation.

  • CursedPerson
    CursedPerson Member Posts: 62
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    This is only acceptable if survivors had comeback tools available to them. The fact is there will always be a weak link in public matches. So if the killer downs the survivor that sucks in chase then chains back to back gen regression it makes the game really hard for the rest of the players regardless of their skill. There's no safeguards in place to deal with being down a player, most games have tools to deal this via comeback mechanics. Additionally the killer gets stronger as the match goes on since there less safe areas for survivors after pallets have been destroyed and less areas needed to patrol

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,147
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    There's no comeback for losing a survivor, because it's an elimination game.

  • CursedPerson
    CursedPerson Member Posts: 62
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    No it's an asymmetrical game. That's not a reason it can't have quality of game mechanics.

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,147
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    It can both be a asymmetrical game and an elimination game. The killer has the task to eliminate survivors and Survivors have the task to do gens and escape before being eliminated.

    It seems like you want an asymm game that isn't elimination style which is not what DBD provides.

  • Chaosrider
    Chaosrider Member Posts: 489
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    The problem is that people like you are still trying to defend tunneling and this regression meta while having zero arguments. The only thing you repeat is "it is needed" and "winning is the only fun". Tunneling is common cause it is the cheapest way to win consistently without needing much skill. Dozens of things have changed in favor of killers on a noticeable level. Zero arguments!

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,147
    edited March 20
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    Tunneling is simply a result of the game being an elimination game. If killers are unable to eliminate survivors then you would have to change the entire game to focus on killers endlessly hooking survivors and survivors endlessly completing generators. No more escapes and no more kills.

  • Chaosrider
    Chaosrider Member Posts: 489
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    That would mean tunneling has been a issue since the beginning, but it hasnt. Again no argument. The rest doesnt make sense at all. Just saying something for no reason.

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,147
    edited March 20
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  • Chaosrider
    Chaosrider Member Posts: 489
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    Just because someone complained about it 6 years ago doesnt mean it was an issue. Its basically a selfullfilling prophecy by now. Someone started it and others followed it by being as unreasonable as the ones before. You just dig a hole for yourself even deeper. Just stop pretending tunneling is anything worth for this game to be played. You have no arguments.

  • Crowman
    Crowman Member Posts: 9,147
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    Tunneling has always been considered an issue. It's why basekit BT was added, because killers just downing survivors immediately off hook was a problem.

    Though I have to question why you are on a discussion board if you have no interest in actually discussing anything and immediately dismissive of anything you don't agree with.

  • MrPenguin
    MrPenguin Member Posts: 2,412
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    What do you consider an "argument"? Because you're calling everything brought up to you "not an argument" so what are you even looking for?

  • Chaosrider
    Chaosrider Member Posts: 489
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    Basekit BT came into the game 2022, but surely you can tell me how thats related to 6 years ago. Just accept you have no arguments. I dont need to discuss if someone has no arguments.

  • Wadely
    Wadely Member Posts: 6
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    This is a pretty reasonable and rational sort of compromise. It could also be used to fix the rampant slugging problem as well.

  • xltechno
    xltechno Member Posts: 1,026
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    If the survivors worked hard to complete the gen without slacking off, the killer would not be able to easily dig a tunnel, but there are many people who refuse to admit that at all.

    It's like playing Rock, Paper, Scissors, and saying, "I only have scissors, so I'm at a disadvantage! You should hand me the paper!" while letting go of the rock. Characteristics of people who complain about tunnels.

  • bodilystew_
    bodilystew_ Applicant Posts: 32
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    Obviously it's subjective but it really isn't that big of a problem. There's so many players who jump into the forum the second they get tunneled like OMG CLOWN TUNNELED ME TREASH NOOBN!!11!!!! And then there's players that get tunneled, laugh it off, and hop into another match. It's not a balance problem, it's really how you handle it tbh.

  • MaTtRoSiTy
    MaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 1,800
    edited March 21
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    Clearly it is a problem, I have 4k hours in this game now and I have never seen tunnelling so bad as it is now. Of course that is just my anecdotal claim but it seems to be a common complaint at this point.

    It isn't like I don't understand that killers gotta kill and when there is 1 gen left and they have nobody dead I can kinda get it.

    But what I am seeing is the most cowardly plays of identifying the least experienced player and shamelessly tunnelling them out of the game even at 5 gens, so they really don't get an kind of match and most definitely a negative experience. This potentially hurts DBD as it makes it a very unwelcoming experience for new players who likely will not stick around.

    For me, the best match I had in ages was a Bubba that hard tunnelled me as I am experienced enough to make him pay dearly for that decision, plus I rarely see Bubba anymore and chases with him are awesome. But for a new player this is just a miserable experience and I have to speak up for the defenceless who are bullied by unscrupulous killer players.

  • Mazoobi
    Mazoobi Member Posts: 1,526
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    What I don't like is how rewarding tunneling is.

    The risks are abysmal compared to the reward as once a survivor is out, the killer immediately gets to control the remaining survivors so much easier.

    "Survivors can just do gens while someone is being tunneled" That's where perks like Pain Res, Dead Man's, Grim Embrace, and more anti-gen perks come into play. It seems like the devs are starting to incorporate this pattern of hurting gen progress while getting hooks. This not only slows down gen pressure but leaves the tunneled survivor closer to their death.

  • bodilystew_
    bodilystew_ Applicant Posts: 32
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    Ah okay I see what you mean. I thought you meant tunneling on a personal level, which is annoying but not bad if you're a good player. But yeah, seeing the claudette with 50 hours get insta tunneled really sucks because after that there's nothing you can do. I have 3.2k hours so I'm pretty experienced at running, but when your teammates get hard focused it's a problem.

  • Starrseed
    Starrseed Member Posts: 1,760
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    but tahts not only a tunneling problem. bhvrs matchmaking is freaking joke and there should not be a weak link that is so obvious to identifie if all players where on a equal lvl

  • bodilystew_
    bodilystew_ Applicant Posts: 32
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    That's also true, but if the MMR was anywhere CLOSE to accurate queues would be ludicrously long for good players

  • LazyClown
    LazyClown Member Posts: 171
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    Heck let's just make every killer extremely useless at what they do, makes total sense.

  • Starrseed
    Starrseed Member Posts: 1,760
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    Yeah thats true but I think right now it still could get better without making qs longer.

    I think most importantly they need to make the mmr more accurate in the lower lvls and when it gets higher it loses up a little so you don't have people with 100 hours facen people with 5k hours

  • bodilystew_
    bodilystew_ Applicant Posts: 32
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    Fair point. I think they should just remove mmr all together, the matches were a lot more fun in my opinion

  • GeneralSkien
    GeneralSkien Member Posts: 122
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    Unrelated but that text effect is cool, how did you do it?

  • Starrseed
    Starrseed Member Posts: 1,760
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    I think the games where more fun cause wirh the emblems the game atleast tryd to be fair cause it was not only kills and escapes but how you played overall