WGLF BUFF
WHY IS WGLF WEAK COMPARED TO BBQ?
The main reason why WGLF is weak is because the requirement to gain a stack isn't the survivors objective and it's not reliable!
On the other hand, BBQ gives you stacks for rewarding the killer for DOING THEIR OBJECTIVE instead of not going out of your way to do something risky such as let's say "Hooking a survivor in the basement to gain a stack".
So here are my two suggestions on how we can buff WGLF while being balanced:
WGLF: (More Ways to Get Stacks)
Your few friends deserve the best protection. Each time you rescue or take a hit to protect a Survivor, repair a generator, stun the killer with a pallet, gain 20 % stackable bonus to all Bloodpoint gains up to a maximum of 60/80/100 %.
The Bonus Bloodpoints are only awarded post-trial.
WGLF: (A Warning if The Killer is Coming)
Your few friends deserve the best protection. Each time you rescue or take a hit to protect a Survivor, gain 25 % stackable bonus to all Bloodpoint gains up to a maximum of 50/75/100 %. When you perform hook rescue, after 3 seconds, receive a notification if the killer is coming to you.
The Bonus Bloodpoints are only awarded post-trial.
The notification will warn you if the killer is coming by looking at how fast the distance between you and the killer is getting smaller! If the distance between you and the killer is getting small real fast then the notification will go off after 3 seconds but it wouldn't if the distance between you and killer gets bigger or it's inconsistent!
Thoughts, opinions? Leave your civil feedback below! 
Comments
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I think it's fine as is.
It's weaker in comparison, i agree.
But Killers are supposed to be stronger than a single Survivor.
It's only natural to me Killer abilities are supposed to be stronger, if they're comparable to Survivor abilities.4 -
I like the second idea better. Maybe it can function a bit like Spine Chill/Premonition. Make a sound if the killer walks toward the hooked survivor within 30m in the first 3s. Something like that. In exchange, stacks should only be rewarded upon the "Safe Unhook" and "Protection" events.
In the end, the perk should encourage people to save other survivors, do it safely, and protect the injured survivors without getting downed themselves.
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I understand that the killer is the power role and needs to be feared but a buff to a BP perk wouldn't make the survivor anymore stronger. Maybe my first suggestion where the survivor has more ways to earn stacks would be good but I can understand your reasoning with the second rework since it gives more power to the survivor.Boss said:I think it's fine as is.
It's weaker in comparison, i agree.
But Killers are supposed to be stronger than a single Survivor.
It's only natural to me Killer abilities are supposed to be stronger, if they're comparable to Survivor abilities.7 -
@Boss said:
I think it's fine as is.It's weaker in comparison, i agree.
But Killers are supposed to be stronger than a single Survivor.
It's only natural to me Killer abilities are supposed to be stronger, if they're comparable to Survivor abilities.“I don’t want the survivors flexing with their wallets”
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While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
- Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
- Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.
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The thing is, survivors and killers are different.
The survivors don't need more incentive to use the perk other than it gives them more BP. That is plenty enough of reason to use it in general, especially during a x2 event.
Killer's try to be as optimized as possible, because they have to be. The DEVs know this, and they know that the killer's would not use BBQ if it only gave bonus BP, it would be a waste of a perk slot. So they gave more incentive through it having the Aura Detection on hooking. Which opens up options for what your next move may be.
I know for a fact I would not use it if all it gave was bonus BP. If It were just the bonus, I would only use it for events such as this. But since it has another thing going for it, and a relatively strong thing, I like to use it.
This is personally how I view it.
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@Swiftblade131 said:
The thing is, survivors and killers are different.The survivors don't need more incentive to use the perk other than it gives them more BP. That is plenty enough of reason to use it in general, especially during a x2 event.
Killer's try to be as optimized as possible, because they have to be. The DEVs know this, and they know that the killer's would not use BBQ if it only gave bonus BP, it would be a waste of a perk slot. So they gave more incentive through it having the Aura Detection on hooking. Which opens up options for what your next move may be.
I know for a fact I would not use it if all it gave was bonus BP. If It were just the bonus, I would only use it for events such as this. But since it has another thing going for it, and a relatively strong thing, I like to use it.
This is personally how I view it.
That doesn’t change that WGLF needs to get some change
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@Jack11803 said:
@Swiftblade131 said:
The thing is, survivors and killers are different.The survivors don't need more incentive to use the perk other than it gives them more BP. That is plenty enough of reason to use it in general, especially during a x2 event.
Killer's try to be as optimized as possible, because they have to be. The DEVs know this, and they know that the killer's would not use BBQ if it only gave bonus BP, it would be a waste of a perk slot. So they gave more incentive through it having the Aura Detection on hooking. Which opens up options for what your next move may be.
I know for a fact I would not use it if all it gave was bonus BP. If It were just the bonus, I would only use it for events such as this. But since it has another thing going for it, and a relatively strong thing, I like to use it.
This is personally how I view it.
That doesn’t change that WGLF needs to get some change
From a certain point of view, I guess you could say that.
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@Swiftblade131 said:
@Jack11803 said:
@Swiftblade131 said:
The thing is, survivors and killers are different.The survivors don't need more incentive to use the perk other than it gives them more BP. That is plenty enough of reason to use it in general, especially during a x2 event.
Killer's try to be as optimized as possible, because they have to be. The DEVs know this, and they know that the killer's would not use BBQ if it only gave bonus BP, it would be a waste of a perk slot. So they gave more incentive through it having the Aura Detection on hooking. Which opens up options for what your next move may be.
I know for a fact I would not use it if all it gave was bonus BP. If It were just the bonus, I would only use it for events such as this. But since it has another thing going for it, and a relatively strong thing, I like to use it.
This is personally how I view it.
That doesn’t change that WGLF needs to get some change
From a certain point of view, I guess you could say that.
From most logical POV‘S. It’s hurting matchmaking. BP needs some boost for survivors.
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This would be great! Now you don't need to waste a perk slot on getting more BP which will make both survivors and killer's happy!Peanits said:While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
- Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
- Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.
@Peanits, unique thinking!1 -
@Nickenzie said:
Peanits said:While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
* Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
* Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.This would be great! Now you don't need to waste a perk slot on getting more BP which will make both survivors and killer's happy!
@Peanits, unique thinking!
Hes a cinnamon bun, too innocent and optimistic for this cruel world. A rainbow in the darkness
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Well, WGLF needs either a secondary effect or more ways to earn stacks. To be honest, I play 50/50 ratio on both sides and I can say that I would be completely fine with WGLF getting more ways to earn stacks!Jack11803 said:@Nickenzie said:
Peanits said:While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
* Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
* Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.This would be great! Now you don't need to waste a perk slot on getting more BP which will make both survivors and killer's happy!
@Peanits, unique thinking!
Hes a cinnamon bun, too innocent and optimistic for this cruel world. A rainbow in the darkness
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The only thing I can see as far as to why they wouldn't is the one major difference to what you are saying in your examples . The event counters for survivors like repairing gens or cleansing totems are fixed items and no challenge in finding or catching them to get the bonus . the killer only gets a stackable bonus if he chases down a survivor and hooks them the first time , so that means he has to hook each survivor once at least before loosing any survivors for the effect to have its max . Take also in consideration that a objective that is fixed cant dc to keep you from getting your bonus either .
Is it weaker in comparison , probably so . But is it easier for a survivor to do ? does a dc effect it ?
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@Nickenzie said:
Jack11803 said:@Nickenzie said:
Peanits said:
While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.
This would be great! Now you don't need to waste a perk slot on getting more BP which will make both survivors and killer's happy!
@Peanits, unique thinking!
Hes a cinnamon bun, too innocent and optimistic for this cruel world. A rainbow in the darkness
Well, WGLF needs either a secondary effect or more ways to earn stacks. To be honest, I play 50/50 ratio on both sides and I can say that I would be completely fine with WGLF getting more ways to earn stacks!
I definitly think it needs it. Don’t get all the resistance to it.
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I disagree. Bloodpoint bonus perks are need on both sides and in fact we need perks to increase xp gained.Peanits said:While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
- Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
- Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.
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I understand @Grimbergoth and your reasoning but hear me out!Grimbergoth said:The only thing I can see as far as to why they wouldn't is the one major difference to what you are saying in your examples . The event counters for survivors like repairing gens or cleansing totems are fixed items and no challenge in finding or catching them to get the bonus . the killer only gets a stackable bonus if he chases down a survivor and hooks them the first time , so that means he has to hook each survivor once at least before loosing any survivors for the effect to have its max . Take also in consideration that a objective that is fixed cant dc to keep you from getting your bonus either .
Is it weaker in comparison , probably so . But is it easier for a survivor to do ? does a dc effect it ?
Well hooking a survivor IS the killer's objective and eventually you'll get someone on the hook! Additionally, it's not difficult to find survivors since nowadays survivors think they are the power role and don't care if the killer finds them! Once you hook a survivor, taking into consideration that BBQ shows you another survivor aura, your already on your second stack on BBQ while a survivor has to risk everything to get theirs! The survivor may not even get a stack if the killer camps as well (And don't worry, I'm not against camping, it's a strategy)! That's why I think a survivor should get more ways to get stacks instead of being limited to being altruistic! 3 -
I agree that it is the killers objective , and unless I missed something bbq doesn't start with a stack until that first hook and at max its 25% per first hook to a max of 100% . the passive ability does let you see a aura for 4 secs if they are outside of 40-53 meter range . the problem with that is the range and as far as I know the survivors perk to block aura reading . if the aura is being blocked then bbq is useless other then for the bonus . And as you said survivors seem to think they are all powerful and usually are in that range . there are downsides and counters for bbq . I do think they might need to add something like taking a hit near a hooked survivor that way in a campers case you could still get the bonus even without the unhook . if the killer doesn't follow you away and you heal and take another hook then its on him for feeding you like that . Just my thoughts there .
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You could take your idea and add to it like this, they get the bonus tokens for doing the objectives, gens/totems/healing but unhooking and safely unhooking at that will always give more points.
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@Jack11803 said:
@Swiftblade131 said:
@Jack11803 said:
@Swiftblade131 said:
The thing is, survivors and killers are different.The survivors don't need more incentive to use the perk other than it gives them more BP. That is plenty enough of reason to use it in general, especially during a x2 event.
Killer's try to be as optimized as possible, because they have to be. The DEVs know this, and they know that the killer's would not use BBQ if it only gave bonus BP, it would be a waste of a perk slot. So they gave more incentive through it having the Aura Detection on hooking. Which opens up options for what your next move may be.
I know for a fact I would not use it if all it gave was bonus BP. If It were just the bonus, I would only use it for events such as this. But since it has another thing going for it, and a relatively strong thing, I like to use it.
This is personally how I view it.
That doesn’t change that WGLF needs to get some change
From a certain point of view, I guess you could say that.
From most logical POV‘S. It’s hurting matchmaking. BP needs some boost for survivors.
That's cool.
Whatever suits you bud.
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I think the point a lot of people are missing out on for bloodpoint perks like WGLF and BBQ is that bloodpoints can be used on ANY character. If you earn a ton of bloodpoints as a killer, you can use them on survivors and vice versa. Buffing bloodpoints gains in perks that boost them does not affect trials in any way. WGLF is entirely a bloodpoint perk, whereas BBQ has a secondary benefit to help the killer.
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BBQ has a secondary component because if it were strictly used for BP gain then no killer in his right mind would remove 1/4th of his perks for it while trying to rank up (we are, in theory, supposed to be trying to rank up, right?).
If someone takes WGLF then that's only 1/16th of the survivor team's perks.
While I agree the tokens should be more easily obtainable (the current requirements assume that a killer is doing well enough that there are plenty of unhooks to go around), a secondary effect is unnecessary. Perhaps make consistently hitting great skillchecks be a trigger for a token? Or repairing the equivalent of a full generator?
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@HP150 said:
BBQ has a secondary component because if it were strictly used for BP gain then no killer in his right mind would remove 1/4th of his perks for it while trying to rank up (we are, in theory, supposed to be trying to rank up, right?).If someone takes WGLF then that's only 1/16th of the survivor team's perks.
While I agree the tokens should be more easily obtainable (the current requirements assume that a killer is doing well enough that there are plenty of unhooks to go around), a secondary effect is unnecessary. Perhaps make consistently hitting great skillchecks be a trigger for a token? Or repairing the equivalent of a full generator?
Yeah, it needs a buff. Tokens need to definitly be easier. Or simply require less
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Agreed, WGLF needs more ways to earn stacks besides be limited to being altruistic!Jack11803 said:@HP150 said:
BBQ has a secondary component because if it were strictly used for BP gain then no killer in his right mind would remove 1/4th of his perks for it while trying to rank up (we are, in theory, supposed to be trying to rank up, right?).If someone takes WGLF then that's only 1/16th of the survivor team's perks.
While I agree the tokens should be more easily obtainable (the current requirements assume that a killer is doing well enough that there are plenty of unhooks to go around), a secondary effect is unnecessary. Perhaps make consistently hitting great skillchecks be a trigger for a token? Or repairing the equivalent of a full generator?
Yeah, it needs a buff. Tokens need to definitly be easier. Or simply require less
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It needs to be easier but if any generator gets done you get a stack or just ones you do? Does it go to 4 stacks or 5? It would also completely switch the way 2x bp events are played because it would be easier to get more bp while just holding m1 on a gen.
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@Global said:
It needs to be easier but if any generator gets done you get a stack or just ones you do? Does it go to 4 stacks or 5? It would also completely switch the way 2x bp events are played because it would be easier to get more bp while just holding m1 on a gen.It should just be gens you do, to follow the theme of doing objectives. And unhooking is still the easiest and fastest way to get BP, so I think it would just be an alternative.
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This here ^^^Visionmaker said:@Global said:
It needs to be easier but if any generator gets done you get a stack or just ones you do? Does it go to 4 stacks or 5? It would also completely switch the way 2x bp events are played because it would be easier to get more bp while just holding m1 on a gen.It should just be gens you do, to follow the theme of doing objectives. And unhooking is still the easiest and fastest way to get BP, so I think it would just be an alternative.
Couldn't have said it any better than @Visionmaker
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we are all excited for the changes, especially this guy
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@fcc2014 said:
Peanits said:While I don't mean to steal your thunder, I also want to suggest a third option:
* Remove the bloodpoint bonus from both, make that passive for everyone.
* Add an effect to WGLF.
That way the end result is the same (faster progression for everyone), except that way you're not forced into using a specific perk just to level up faster. BBQ and Chili is a perfectly good perk on its own, you don't need extra bloodpoints to make it more desirable. I'd rather have that be a passive increase across the whole game. That way you're free to use another perk if it doesn't fit your playstyle.I disagree. Bloodpoint bonus perks are need on both sides and in fact we need perks to increase xp gained.
The point in making it 'passive' means it's always on all the time for everyone, without needing a perk. So you'd still get the faster bloodpoints, but you don't have to use the bloodpoint-meta build just so you can level up faster. You'd be free to use whatever perks you want without slowing yourself down, whereas now you have to either choose between bloodpoints or variety.
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If you think it's not good - don't take it.
Why should they but already good perk??
You compare it to BBQ? Well, you can't. It's stronger because it's killer perk.
Want it buffet? First but all killer perks.
So far, the most broken perks are for survivors, so why don't you solve that first?0 -
i think wglf should let you see killer for 4 seconds when you unhook, to balance out bbq.3
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@ZombieGenesis said:
IMO they should just combine WGLF and Borrowed Time. I always hated the name of Borrowed Time and I think it fits better as part of WGLF. This way both parties get something. The rescuer gets a stack and the rescued gets extra time to live.I don't think stacks need to be easier when I run WGLF as a survivor I never had any problems getting my stacks. It may take some sacrifice, taking a hit for a survivor during a chase and becoming the target, but I get them pretty much every time.
The problem with that is that Borrowed Time guarantees all unhooks are safe unhooks, since the unhooked Survivor can't be put in the dying state quickly enough.
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@ZombieGenesis said:
I don't really see that as a problem I guess. And with certain perks it may still lead to a down since the killer may have a super fast cooldown on his successful attack.Guaranteed safe unhooks and stacking BP bonuses with a single perk are not a problem?
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It’s fine for what it is. If you want a BP boost, run WGLF, but do so at the cost of 1/4 of your perks. Adding other abilities or effects on would just be giving survivors more power, in a game where they already control much.
BBQ needs a secondary effect or use because it’s a killer perk, they have 1/4 the perks a survivor team does.1 -
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@Well_Placed_HexTotem said:
It’s fine for what it is. If you want a BP boost, run WGLF, but do so at the cost of 1/4 of your perks. Adding other abilities or effects on would just be giving survivors more power, in a game where they already control much.BBQ needs a secondary effect or use because it’s a killer perk, they have 1/4 the perks a survivor team does.
I’m ok with it not getting a bonus, though it wouldn’t hurt. But it’s tokens are definitely harder to get than BBQ,
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@SariefSarief said:If you think it's not good - don't take it.
Why should they but already good perk??
You compare it to BBQ? Well, you can't. It's stronger because it's killer perk.
Want it buffet? First but all killer perks.
So far, the most broken perks are for survivors, so why don't you solve that first?
I'm not comparing the power of the two perks, I'm comparing how one perk will get more tokens than the other perk. I could careless of BBQ gave everyone the exposed status effect or something when you hook a survivor, I just want more ways to get stacks on WGLF! Seriously, a BP bonus doesn't make a survivor any stronger and adding more ways to get tokens won't hurt! 3 -
@Nickenzie said:
Sarief said:If you think it's not good - don't take it.
Why should they but already good perk??
You compare it to BBQ? Well, you can't. It's stronger because it's killer perk.Want it buffet? First but all killer perks.
So far, the most broken perks are for survivors, so why don't you solve that first?@Sarief
I'm not comparing the power of the two perks, I'm comparing how one perk will get more tokens than the other perk. I could careless of BBQ gave everyone the exposed status effect or something when you hook a survivor, I just want more ways to get stacks on WGLF! Seriously, a BP bonus doesn't make a survivor any stronger and adding more ways to get tokens won't hurt!And make farming less frequent..... OH MY GOD! Is that why they don’t want it!?
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WGLF should only award a stack if you perform a safe hook rescue so survivors don't swarm the hook lol.Jack11803 said:@Nickenzie said:
Sarief said:If you think it's not good - don't take it.
Why should they but already good perk??
You compare it to BBQ? Well, you can't. It's stronger because it's killer perk.Want it buffet? First but all killer perks.
So far, the most broken perks are for survivors, so why don't you solve that first?@Sarief
I'm not comparing the power of the two perks, I'm comparing how one perk will get more tokens than the other perk. I could careless of BBQ gave everyone the exposed status effect or something when you hook a survivor, I just want more ways to get stacks on WGLF! Seriously, a BP bonus doesn't make a survivor any stronger and adding more ways to get tokens won't hurt!And make farming less frequent..... OH MY GOD! Is that why they don’t want it!?
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@Nickenzie said:
Jack11803 said:@Nickenzie said:
Sarief said:
If you think it's not good - don't take it.
Why should they but already good perk??
You compare it to BBQ? Well, you can't. It's stronger because it's killer perk.
Want it buffet? First but all killer perks.
So far, the most broken perks are for survivors, so why don't you solve that first?
@Sarief
I'm not comparing the power of the two perks, I'm comparing how one perk will get more tokens than the other perk. I could careless of BBQ gave everyone the exposed status effect or something when you hook a survivor, I just want more ways to get stacks on WGLF! Seriously, a BP bonus doesn't make a survivor any stronger and adding more ways to get tokens won't hurt!
And make farming less frequent..... OH MY GOD! Is that why they don’t want it!?
WGLF should only award a stack if you perform a safe hook rescue so survivors don't swarm the hook lol.
It should have more ways, or less tokens needed, AND DEFINITLY fix how buggy and useless protection is
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@Lowbei said:
we are all excited for the changes, especially this guyHe's alive! These forums felt so empty without you!
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@Nickenzie said:
WGLF should only award a stack if you perform a safe hook rescue so survivors don't swarm the hook lol.That would just make BT mandatory for WGLF, unfortunately. WGLF does not need nerfs and that'd qualify as a nerf.
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@UncannyLuck said:
@Nickenzie said:
WGLF should only award a stack if you perform a safe hook rescue so survivors don't swarm the hook lol.That would just make BT mandatory for WGLF, unfortunately. WGLF does not need nerfs and that'd qualify as a nerf.
It needs more ways to get tokens, or just require 2 tokens
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It's ultra easy to get 4 tokens. 2 are almost guaranteed if you play decently.Jack11803 said:@UncannyLuck said:
@Nickenzie said:
WGLF should only award a stack if you perform a safe hook rescue so survivors don't swarm the hook lol.That would just make BT mandatory for WGLF, unfortunately. WGLF does not need nerfs and that'd qualify as a nerf.
It needs more ways to get tokens, or just require 2 tokens
What is the problem with tokens?0
