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The Decisive Strike Problem (Rework)

2

Comments

  • Lowbei
    Lowbei Member Posts: 2,637
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Thetruth said:

    @Condorloco_26 said:
    As a killer I think your rework idea is a good one. Upvoting this.

    ofc it is. anything to give you a iwin button easy win

    Excuse me, isn't Decisive Strike exactly that? An easy iescapeforfree button? Hilarious

    lol the irony. yet another derp survivormain laughed off the forums. so many of them today.
  • Dreamnomad
    Dreamnomad Member Posts: 3,850

    I think the idea is okay, but it belongs in the balance feedback section.

  • yeet
    yeet Member Posts: 1,832
    Thetruth said:

    @Condorloco_26 said:
    As a killer I think your rework idea is a good one. Upvoting this.

    ofc it is. anything to give you a iwin button easy win

    He says in defense of DS without a hint of irony.
  • yeet
    yeet Member Posts: 1,832
    Thetruth said:

    @Lowbei said:
    Thetruth said:

    @Condorloco_26 said:

    As a killer I think your rework idea is a good one. Upvoting this.

    ofc it is. anything to give you a iwin button easy win

    hows rank20? must be lonely.

    Actually I'm rank 5 was one but i enjoy d/cing to piss people off get fan mail and give players the hatch to win. Again you thinking rankn mean anything in this game shows youre without a doubt trash cause any newb can achieve level 1 so easy.

    You know for someone named "the truth" you sure are full of it.
  • Lowbei
    Lowbei Member Posts: 2,637
    edited October 2018
    Thetruth said:

    @Lowbei said:
    Thetruth said:

    @Condorloco_26 said:

    As a killer I think your rework idea is a good one. Upvoting this.

    ofc it is. anything to give you a iwin button easy win

    hows rank20? must be lonely.

    Actually I'm rank 5 was one but i enjoy d/cing to piss people off get fan mail and give players the hatch to win. Again you thinking rankn mean anything in this game shows youre without a doubt trash cause any newb can achieve level 1 so easy.

    lol irony that you are so bad at lying that you dont know the difference between level1 and rank1

    everyone here is laughing at you. enjoy rank20 :)
  • Condorloco_26
    Condorloco_26 Member Posts: 1,714

    @Lowbei said:

    lol the irony. yet another derp survivormain laughed off the forums. so many of them today.

    Why are they oblivious about the problem? I'm a killer main and completely acknowledge the ubersuckness of NOED, a perk that shouldn't be there in the first place. And the fact it's getting buffed in this PTB makes me question the direction this stuff is taking.

    OP @Nickenzie is taking the time to propose (something few people do) a good idea to change survivors' NOED equivalent. Arguing is not adding anything to it.

  • Lowbei
    Lowbei Member Posts: 2,637
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    lol the irony. yet another derp survivormain laughed off the forums. so many of them today.

    Why are they oblivious about the problem? I'm a killer main and completely acknowledge the ubersuckness of NOED, a perk that shouldn't be there in the first place. And the fact it's getting buffed in this PTB makes me question the direction this stuff is taking.

    OP @Nickenzie is taking the time to propose (something few people do) a good idea to change survivors' NOED equivalent. Arguing is not adding anything to it.

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.
  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    Lowbei said:
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    lol the irony. yet another derp survivormain laughed off the forums. so many of them today.

    Why are they oblivious about the problem? I'm a killer main and completely acknowledge the ubersuckness of NOED, a perk that shouldn't be there in the first place. And the fact it's getting buffed in this PTB makes me question the direction this stuff is taking.

    OP @Nickenzie is taking the time to propose (something few people do) a good idea to change survivors' NOED equivalent. Arguing is not adding anything to it.

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.
    Your comments of smoking a salty survivor main @Lowbei is literally making me cry out laughing! :lol:
  • Condorloco_26
    Condorloco_26 Member Posts: 1,714

    @Lowbei said:

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.

    I've tried to stay out of turd flinging, but this was just too much and just had to take part in it

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.

    I've tried to stay out of turd flinging, but this was just too much and just had to take part in it

    I just get popcorn and watch @Lowbei destroy survivor mains who don't want a balanced game, it's hilarious!

    Anyways, I wonder if the developers have thought of this idea?
    Umm, @Peanits sorry for crowding your notification system but can you say your opinion on this?
  • Lowbei
    Lowbei Member Posts: 2,637
    edited October 2018
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.

    I've tried to stay out of turd flinging, but this was just too much and just had to take part in it

    sometimes we just have to shovel the survivor main turds out of here to keep it clean! grab a shovel bro!

    Nickenzie said:
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.

    I've tried to stay out of turd flinging, but this was just too much and just had to take part in it

    I just get popcorn and watch @Lowbei destroy survivor mains who don't want a balanced game, it's hilarious!

    Anyways, I wonder if the developers have thought of this idea?
    Umm, @Peanits sorry for crowding your notification system but can you say your opinion on this?
    thanks! im sponsored by Orville Reddenbacher!
  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    edited October 2018
    Lowbei said:
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.

    I've tried to stay out of turd flinging, but this was just too much and just had to take part in it

    sometimes we just have to shovel the survivor main turds out of here to keep it clean! grab a shovel bro!

    You'll probably need to bust out the BIG guns if you wanna get all the survivor main turds out lol.
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Nickenzie said:
    Condorloco_26 said:

    @Lowbei said:

    you will have to ignore the salty survivormains like thetruth that we have laughed off the forum

    he will ragequit in embarrassment soon and make a new account. its common.

    I've tried to stay out of turd flinging, but this was just too much and just had to take part in it

    I just get popcorn and watch @Lowbei destroy survivor mains who don't want a balanced game, it's hilarious!

    Anyways, I wonder if the developers have thought of this idea?
    Umm, @Peanits sorry for crowding your notification system but can you say your opinion on this?

    It's about as fun as destroying killer mains that say one thing and then something contradicting that a few sentences later in the same post.

    There's less than ahem quality posters on both sides who manage to talk out of both sides of their mouth at the same time.

  • thekiller490490
    thekiller490490 Member Posts: 1,164
    How about they just remove the free getaway entirely and increase the stun.
  • TheShowtime7
    TheShowtime7 Member Posts: 22
    I wish you guys would leave the perk alone as it is. First you have to be the obsession, skill checks difficult to hit if skill check comes early or  with dr or unnerving presence it’s harder. And the killer can still dribble you  to the hook. Please devs leave the perk alone.
  • Ashkiin
    Ashkiin Member Posts: 52
    This is a great option for DS if you wanna  keep the original intent imo. Good job op
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @MandyTalk said:
    I think there is a lot of merit to the this idea, some things would probably need to be adjusted (obsession requirements etc) but in general I think it's a good idea.

    I'm moving this topic to Balance Feedback - as it is going to get lost in General Discussions (plus it belongs there anyway).

    Thanks for the feedback.

  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Giche said:

    @NoxiousOnnyyxx

    "DS doesn't even need to be nerfed. You killers whine about everything. "

    She’s not lying @Giche ..if it wasn’t DS there would be something else to ######### about , the devs could give you every buff you specifically would like to see and there would still be a cryfest on here
  • DeadByFlashlight
    DeadByFlashlight Member Posts: 1,642

    So lets look at your suggestion.

    The activation condition only hurts bad survivors that dont manage to loop the killer long enough, but DS on a bad survivor never has been a problem.

    Then the bleedout timer, its basically a cap on the time that DS can waste. This means that a competent survivor cant loop you longer than1 minute before he goes down automatically.
    This means that a single perk can waste 4 minutes of the killers time. Seems balanced right?

    Now compare this to the genspeed, in the fastest game from the depip squad they were done with all gens in less than 3 minutes, that the equivalent of 3x DS (not even counting the time needed to down the DS first).

    compare this to the strongest delaying perk of the killer, ruin.

    Even if ruin doesnt get cleansed the whole game, survivors can simply power through and ruin wont even delay the game by 4 minutes.

    Now take into account that survivors can literally spawn on the hex and that it can get killed in a few seconds.

  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    edited October 2018
    Giche said:

    @lyric said:

    She’s not lying @Giche ..if it wasn’t DS there would be something else to ######### about , the devs could give you every buff you specifically would like to see and there would still be a cryfest on here

    That's what we've been told for the last 2 years.

    By peoples defending infinites or 20s cooldown Sprintburst.

    Today it's for DS.

    Get lost.

    Or you can just git gud and quit crying in the forums because you’re ass at the game and afraid of a perk
  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Giche said:

    @lyric said:

    She’s not lying @Giche ..if it wasn’t DS there would be something else to ######### about , the devs could give you every buff you specifically would like to see and there would still be a cryfest on here

    That's what we've been told for the last 2 years.

    By peoples defending infinites or 20s cooldown Sprintburst.

    Today it's for DS.

    Get lost.

    If that picture was @NoxiousOnnyyxx then this has to be you @Giche
  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Shocking resemblance 
  • KingB
    KingB Member Posts: 747
    edited October 2018

    @Nickenzie I only had time to glance over it earlier, didn't see the bleed out timer part my mistake! I wouldn't mind it if this happens but I would tweak one thing and make it to where you can't heal yourself but in turn maybe extend the timer a bit. Maybe that's too far but I'm not very good at survivor but I don't like using decisive regardless. 
  • yeet
    yeet Member Posts: 1,832
    lyric said:
    Giche said:

    @lyric said:

    She’s not lying @Giche ..if it wasn’t DS there would be something else to ######### about , the devs could give you every buff you specifically would like to see and there would still be a cryfest on here

    That's what we've been told for the last 2 years.

    By peoples defending infinites or 20s cooldown Sprintburst.

    Today it's for DS.

    Get lost.

    Or you can just git gud and quit crying in the forums because you’re ass at the game and afraid of a perk
    I can tell you've never seriously played killer.
  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    DeadByFlashlight said:

    So lets look at your suggestion.

    The activation condition only hurts bad survivors that dont manage to loop the killer long enough, but DS on a bad survivor never has been a problem.

    Then the bleedout timer, its basically a cap on the time that DS can waste. This means that a competent survivor cant loop you longer than1 minute before he goes down automatically.
    This means that a single perk can waste 4 minutes of the killers time. Seems balanced right?

    Now compare this to the genspeed, in the fastest game from the depip squad they were done with all gens in less than 3 minutes, that the equivalent of 3x DS (not even counting the time needed to down the DS first).

    compare this to the strongest delaying perk of the killer, ruin.

    Even if ruin doesnt get cleansed the whole game, survivors can simply power through and ruin wont even delay the game by 4 minutes.

    Now take into account that survivors can literally spawn on the hex and that it can get killed in a few seconds.

    To be honest with you @DeadByFlashlight, I would rather have this nerf to DS even through it can be extremely powerful than having the old DS that's literally broken. Here's my reasoning and justification for your argument:

    "This means that a single perk can waste 4 minutes of the killers time. Seems balanced right?"

    -The new DS has a condition that needs to be satisfied to be used and getting hooked before you completed your condition will permanently lock the perk. The bleed out penalty just prevents another long loop and it adds pressure to the survivor which can lead to them causing a mistake in a mind game!

    This means that it's likely that every survivor, assuming they are all have DS, won't be able to use the perk since 60 seconds is A LOT of time to find a survivor and down them. Remember the perk doesn't charge when they are in a chase so they can't loop you for 60+ seconds and get their DS.

    "Now compare this to the genspeed, in the fastest game from the depip squad they were done with all gens in less than 3 minutes, that the equivalent of 3x DS (not even counting the time needed to down the DS first)."

    -That's a problem with the core game mechanics, generators need to get reworked to at least guarantee a 6+ minute game and Ruin needs a nerf to compensate for the generator nerf.
  • NoxiousOnnyyxx
    NoxiousOnnyyxx Member Posts: 343
    lyric said:
    Shocking resemblance 
    Omg I love you dude 
  • Jonathanskilz
    Jonathanskilz Member Posts: 403

    Make it so only 1 person in the lobby can use the perk tbh

  • RWoodrow
    RWoodrow Member Posts: 270
    Jonathanskilz said:

    Make it so only 1 person in the lobby can use the perk tbh

    The problem I see with doing that is solo que survivors. Say 4 survivors solo que into a lobby. All want to use DS, so all equip it. 1 gets to use it, the other 3 get shorted a perk. 
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @RWoodrow said:
    The problem I see with doing that is solo que survivors. Say 4 survivors solo que into a lobby. All want to use DS, so all equip it. 1 gets to use it, the other 3 get shorted a perk. 

    Welcome to the world of Hex perks.

  • RWoodrow
    RWoodrow Member Posts: 270
    Orion said:

    @RWoodrow said:
    The problem I see with doing that is solo que survivors. Say 4 survivors solo que into a lobby. All want to use DS, so all equip it. 1 gets to use it, the other 3 get shorted a perk. 

    Welcome to the world of Hex perks

    Hex perks at least have to be cleansed and make it into the trial and I can choose to run them or not. These survivors don't get that option. This is literally giving the finger to the survivors who choose to play it the way the game was designed and balanced.
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @RWoodrow said:
    Hex perks at least have to be cleansed and make it into the trial and I can choose to run them or not. These survivors don't get that option. This is literally giving the finger to the survivors who choose to play it the way the game was designed and balanced.

    Pre-game chat exists, you know.

  • RWoodrow
    RWoodrow Member Posts: 270
    Orion said:

    @RWoodrow said:
    Hex perks at least have to be cleansed and make it into the trial and I can choose to run them or not. These survivors don't get that option. This is literally giving the finger to the survivors who choose to play it the way the game was designed and balanced.

    Pre-game chat exists, you know.

    Not on all platforms and I can see many arguements starting in the pre-game chat and more DC's during the following loading screens.
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Orion said:

    @RWoodrow said:
    Hex perks at least have to be cleansed and make it into the trial and I can choose to run them or not. These survivors don't get that option. This is literally giving the finger to the survivors who choose to play it the way the game was designed and balanced.

    Pre-game chat exists, you know.

    Yes but what if a person is going for the Adept achievement or more than 1 is, they can't both run it. You could do the activation requirement but have the obsession automatically meet it.

    The others would have to do something to activate it and no chasing the killer around isn't a good way since that doesn't solve the problem.

    If it's a mix of say generator or altruism stuff activating the perk it'd be a fair way to balance it and the 1st person hooked shouldn't get screwed.

    So either 1 full gen done either solo or in conjunction with others overall or 1 full health state solo or in conjunction or 1 safe unhook.

    The 1st person hooked if they're running DS should get a chance to earn the needed objective conditions. If they get hooked again before meeting those conditions they're out of luck.

    Once the 1st person is hoooked everyone else is on their own if they don't get the conditions met unless they're the obsession.

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @powerbats said:

    @Orion said:

    @RWoodrow said:
    Hex perks at least have to be cleansed and make it into the trial and I can choose to run them or not. These survivors don't get that option. This is literally giving the finger to the survivors who choose to play it the way the game was designed and balanced.

    Pre-game chat exists, you know.

    Yes but what if a person is going for the Adept achievement or more than 1 is, they can't both run it.

    Sure they can. The achievement doesn't require you to use the perk's effect, and one of them would get the benefit.

  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Giche said:

    @lyric said:

    Or you can just git gud and quit crying in the forums because you’re ass at the game and afraid of a perk

    And then he proceed to play with his own poop.

    Toxic survivors mains being man-child, as usual.

    No I’m just giving you what you give to everyone else on here , so I guess you are a man child that is accurate otherwise you would stop bitching and play the game
  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Giche said:

    @lyric

    no u

    How it's goin' under the bridge ?

    Lol right, says the guy who posts survivor pics on every survivor post and ######### talks anything they say
  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    yeet said:
    lyric said:
    Giche said:

    @lyric said:

    She’s not lying @Giche ..if it wasn’t DS there would be something else to ######### about , the devs could give you every buff you specifically would like to see and there would still be a cryfest on here

    That's what we've been told for the last 2 years.

    By peoples defending infinites or 20s cooldown Sprintburst.

    Today it's for DS.

    Get lost.

    Or you can just git gud and quit crying in the forums because you’re ass at the game and afraid of a perk
    I can tell you've never seriously played killer.
    That’s your opinion I made rank one last season as a killer but no I’m not a killer main, just because I don’t have the problems you do doesn’t mean I don’t play 
  • grtf47
    grtf47 Member Posts: 371
    What about juggling? The killer hooks you and the perk is useless. I would remove the obsession status so the killer doesent know who to juggle. 
  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    grtf47 said:
    What about juggling? The killer hooks you and the perk is useless. I would remove the obsession status so the killer doesent know who to juggle. 
    The killer can't juggle you, the perk instantly stuns the killer the moment that the pick up animation is finished. However the killer will still see that you are the obsession because with this version, they can't counter DS besides hooking them before they meet their requirements! :)
  • SnakeSound222
    SnakeSound222 Member Posts: 4,467
    I like this rework. I’m not the biggest fan of having the Survivor escape instead of staying on their shoulder. I like how you have to charge up the perk in order to get the escape. It’s not a free escape anymore.
  • RWoodrow
    RWoodrow Member Posts: 270
    TheDonald said:

    Why not just remove the perk? Boom. Done. I saved Behavior months of pussy-footing around and now the game has significantly better balance.

    The one problem with this, which seems like a small thing until it's done and then people lose their minds over it, is that it locks people out of the adept achievement by removing it.

    I wish it was this simple but rework is the only fix.
  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    edited October 2018
    RWoodrow said:
    TheDonald said:

    Why not just remove the perk? Boom. Done. I saved Behavior months of pussy-footing around and now the game has significantly better balance.

    The one problem with this, which seems like a small thing until it's done and then people lose their minds over it, is that it locks people out of the adept achievement by removing it.

    I wish it was this simple but rework is the only fix.
    Decisive Strike definitely needs a nerf so my version would make both sides happy. The perk will remain strong but the survivor's need to work for it! :)
  • Blood_Coil_Viper
    Blood_Coil_Viper Member Posts: 199
    This change to the perk would almost certainly fix most of it's issues. The current version is no risk high reward. A simple skill check isn't hard enough to call it a risk.. I do hope they consider this version of the perk.