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Killer behaviour is appalling during events
Comments
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Hi, thanks for the kind response. :)
I personally was not around when BNPs were instant, but I have played for some time and heard the horror stories. These days, I would define "genrushing" as either anything intended tactically to do generators extremely quickly (which is valid and strategic), or whenever multiple gens get done quickly in succession, often in chase, and usually one right after the other like bingbingbing. I don't consider number of hooks done beforehand to be part of the definition. Generally, anytime Survivors REALLY focus gens and are bringing stuff to facilitate that. It's a tactic, like how some slugging is a tactic or how some amount of gen control is a tactic. It's part of the game, and while it's annoying it is valid. It doesn't hurt any less to be stung by though especially when you get that rare team you simply can't really catch.While gens can no longer be instantly done and many changes to gens have occurred to fix this, I believe it is still possible in a neutered form, the same way that "bully squads" no longer holds the same weight but still can be present in a neutered form (see some of the common nuisance SWF builds like the wiggle-sabo or head on flashbang squads for example). Much of the teeth has been taken from genrushing as a tool, but it still remains a powerful tool in the Survivor arsenal and even I still tell my SWF to "rush gens" if the game starts to go south for us, meaning I want them to focus the gens as hard as they possibly can.
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There, I like this guy. You're cool. You know how to play a game without getting played. You're a player.
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You can bet if it reached a point where a majority of survivors run full anti-tunnel/anti-slug builds killers will just complain until they all get nerfed.
How do I know? Because its happened before. Doesn't anyone else remember the forum tales of insert sad violin theme "I hate tunneling default meg at 5 gens with Nurse, but if I don't, she could have DS available during end game! Just nerf DS and I swear I'll never need to tunnel again. Oh and also dead hard. And Adrenaline."
Every iteration of "just blanket nerf survivors again and I'll play in a fun way" has ended the same way. Maps being nuked, anti-tunnel perks being nuked, gens taking longer. Every time it just makes the same boring 9 year old killer playstyles stronger.
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Oh for sure. It's on BHVR to implement a solution to address it, because certain player types are always going to behave like that. The Bartle taxonomy of player types is an interesting read. It's pretty clear what type these players fall under. It's really no different than any competitive sport. Basketball had to introduce a shot clock because teams would hold the ball and stall. Baseball had to introduce a pitch clock. There are many examples.
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It's such a sad state that we have to thank people for being kind just for talking about a vidoegame haha but I do appreciate it (and I do understand it's unfortunately kind of rare on here to have polite conversations especially when people disagree) I see your perspective, and even though I don't necessarily agree as I belive gen-rushing, much like tunneling, has very strict 'requirements' I appreciate you taking the time to answer my question.
I won't discuss it further on this post, (only because it's not necessarily in line with the topic and I dont want to clog it up more than I already have haha) but perhaps on a different post on this specific topic or message or something we can talk more on it. Always looking for more perspectives to better understand other people. Have a good one, gliyn! :)
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Not a kiler-only problem. Both sides seem to be upping the ante when it comes to sweating now that they dont have their meta builds. It's been horrendous, really.
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Imagining the football equivalent: "Cheap shotting the opposing team's quarterback and breaking his knee is just the most efficient strategy to win!"
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Exactly :)
The person I was responding to was defending tunneling by saying DBD is essentially a game of Tag. But it would be really weird if I were it and then tagged someone and then just kept chasing them. The analogy didn't make much sense to me :/
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Literally. Hip drop tackles on the QB used to be commonplace until the 2010s. Ended Joe Theismann's career.
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Never demanded anything??
I'm just asking for a basic amount of human decency when everyone is here to have fun. Why would anyone want to still participate if their experience is repeatedly ruined by others who only care about themselves? It's crappy and selfish. No one HAS to go out of their way to ruin it for others just to secure a win.
Again it's sad some of you can't discern that when interacting with other people. You can still be mindful of others and play to win, they aren't inherently tied.7 -
Right?
It doesn’t matter why you’re doing it. Whether you’re doing it to grief or doing it because you feel it necessary, the match is still ruined for everyone else.
Not being able to understand why people find it disagreeable is indicative of a lack of experience in similar real-life situations IMHO.
Reminds me of a guy I used to play football with who’d intentionally kick the ball super far out of the court when things weren’t going his way. Like there’s no specific rule about kicking the ball hard, but it’s still bad manners because now someone has to walk through all the long grass to retrieve it. No one is going to want to play with you if you’re constantly finding ways to interrupt or subvert normal play. And it’s bizarre to me how people aren’t getting that.
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THIS 100%
I don't know why it's so hard for people to grasp that it still sucks no matter how to try to paint it. There's no reason that makes it better or okay.
Damn, I feel that. Had a similar situation with a friend during basketball. She would turn when things didn't go her way and start getting rough. Even purposely keep the ball away because she wanted to be the only one to make the shot.
And yeah, no one wants to play with people like that. This is the kind of stuff you learn even in kindergarten.9 -
Right, you are just asking with a little emotional blackmail on the side. Nevermind that gamers who actually do that are unlikely to read this in the first place as they are too busy making another lobby miserable. Fact is that is within the laid out rules of the game. I'm not a fan of this either and if I had the choice I would skip those lobbies, too, but this is what the current state of the game allows.
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Right, you are just asking with a little emotional blackmail on the side
It’s not emotional blackmail to tell someone that their behaviour is disagreeable and ask them to cease it. Especially when said behaviour is almost universally disliked lol
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Either way none of that changes anything.
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I find your post very interesting and you're clearly a person with an investigative and analytical attitude. I like that.
I asked myself the same question, also analyzed the general consensus and found that there is none. It's a lack of cohesive definition on a macro level since on the micro level the individual definitions do not align.
This is not exclusive to this specific term, but to the perception of Dead by Daylight in general, which is in my opinion a prime factor contributing to the current "disorderly" state of the community.
But to answer your question:
To me personally "Genrushing" is neither negative nor positive as it is a strategy that can be employed in order to achieve a goal. On a macro level the entire team of survivors knowingly has to participate in this strategy in order for there Genrush strategy to reach its maximum potential. On a Microlevel this means that Perks and Items which focus on maximizing this strategies potential must be chosen. It is also necessary to utilize these perks and items in a meaningful way to the best of ones ability to rush gens. In other words if I have the perks and hide in a corner, am I a genrusher?
Given that all survivors knowingly chose to utilize this strategy to whatever success, we can say that the gamestate is thus such, that the gens are getting rushed. From a killers perspective this is an apparent fact of the gamestate. Whether or not the survivors are successful depends on an incredibly complex set of circumstances.
Given the unpredictable nature of SoloQ, true genrushing in its maximum potential is probably exceptionally rare.
Here we could easily philosophize the nature of time, the experience of time and what "rushing" really means. And here, naturally you will again come to the conclusion that there is no clear definition.
The inherent difficulty in defining Genrushing lies in the overall loose definition of what Dead by Daylight is, as well as a myriad of ideas of what Dead by Daylight ought to be.
Personally, I play both sides equally, and I do believe that I have a strong grasp on the games fundamentals. The soloQ experience is very varied with games lasting from mere minutes to 25 minutes+. Mind you the the majority of my playtime both on Survivor and Killer is spent playing without any perks, addons and items.
From experience, the extreme cases of genrushing requires a coordinated swf and is in itself an impressive feat of teamwork that is nonetheless object to the knowledge and skill of the killer they are facing. If I can identify a genrush early and am successful in reading the other teams play style I am now faced with an incredible task of identifying or even creating weakspots.
If the execution of the survivor team is flawless, if I do not manage to capitalize on any mistakes or create weakspots, the defeat can feel overwhelming. I just got genrushed. What an experience, how can I counter it?
I feel a big part of this is the Map Design that can either favor killers or survivors in terms of available resources. On a resource heavy map, given those same survivors from above, the experience of my time rushing by will be a lot more intense than on maps that offer less in terms of defense for survivors.
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Its always the same with events. The moment they go live killers get crazy and just want to make a fun mode being a torture chamber. And devs just refuse to change anything about being able to play like this. Like, why did they have time to make oberlay animations for the perks (though you can even see the perks before on the menu screen) but do not improve a single thing about the mode at all?
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"Emotional blackmail"?? 😂
I don't know how you got that from what I wrote, but I think you need to read it again.
And as OP said, there's nothing about wanting someone to stop said behavior no one likes that has to do with blackmail.Post edited by Nocturnum on6 -
There is a difference between wanting something and the degree of whining you did.
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Can confirm: that person wasn't whining. They just expressed that things like tunneling/proxy camping in the early game can completely ruin someone's match for essentially no other reason than someone was afraid they might not win at a game. And that's not because the person doing it might not be able to participate, it's because they might not outright win. Meanwhile, they deny one person the ability to enjoy the game at all, making them unable to participate in most aspects of the game and instead essentially guaranteeing that they can't survive the match.
Why would someone pay money for a game when that's going to happen? Also, why would someone even wait for a match when that's going to happen? It becomes a waste of time and money.
Also, this isn't a case of emotional blackmail. That person is trying to discuss how those actions make people feel. That's similar to talking about how bullying makes people feel, and why it shouldn't be done. That's different than emotional blackmail, which is a dishonest attempt at using guilt to manipulate people into doing things. This is not a case of dishonesty for such a purpose.
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Because many of us read and upvote comments, but don't want to be directly involved in the drama.
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Thanks for being understanding. And yeah, I never demanded or whined about anything. I'm not trying to guilt or blackmail anyone either. I don't know why some people have to take what I'm saying in bad faith. I simply want the bad behavior in this game to stop so everyone can enjoy their time playing it instead of being an the mercy of someone who's actively denying their ability to play. Nobody likes that, it's pretty cut and dry.
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