Matchmaking System Update

If winning or losing a lot of times should broaden the matchmaking range, this does not sound like something which was "unintentionally broadening the range of potential opponents and teammates". More like something which worked as intended, but you did not realize that this would also imply that a player who wins a lot of times and is very good will get weaker and weaker opponents, the more they win. Which is basically what was the issue with the MMR Reset, we have seen Streamers go on insane winstreaks, because they faced brand new Survivors.

But hopefully this is now fixed, but to be fair, you dont need to be a game Dev to see that widening the range of potential opponents will lead to errors, even if I completely understand the intention that someone winning a lot should get more stronger opponents and someone losing a lot should get a lot weaker opponents, but both can work in the other range as well, if there is no limit. Which happened.

Will monitor if it got better. A few days ago my SWF mate and myself got a Wraith with only a fraction of our hours followed by KnightLight, a comp player. Which was pretty odd, maybe it is better now.

Sadly there will be no appropiate place to give more feedback anymore if the Matchmaking is working or not.

Having less variance in player skills levels overall sounds better in theory, but with how often this MMR system was complained about, whether or not this is actually the case remains to be seen.

Well, we will see it now that 2v8 is over and we are returning to the regular queue, at least until the Halloween event I presume.

Might be the last matter that we will be able to properly give feedback about, considering soon there won't be a good way of doing so.

I'm not trying to be rude here. Have you ever actually participated in a Discord server that uses the threads in an attempt to have longer conversations? It really is no where near close to the format of forums and really is not a good replacement. It is still Discord format that is unappealing and overall still not good for discussions, especially when coming from using forums.

Just simply following a conversation here when someone quotes someone else I can see the entire previous text. On Discord if someone is responding directly to someone else I can only see part of the previous persons first sentence. I need to click on that little preview to be pulled up to where ever that comment was made and then scroll all the way back down to where I was in the conversation. It is much easier/user friendly on the forums to catch up and keep track of the conversation. That is just one issue and it's an issue on small servers, it'll be worse on a large server with 800k members. Discord format is great if you want a chatroom, it's terrible if you are looking for forum type discussions.

I just think maybe it would've been a better plan to have this proposed section of Discord up and running first because right now I think you're throwing out a great resource (forums) for something you think looks good on paper (discord "forum"). At the very least if you had something currently usable you could let people try it and give feedback here instead of "use it or sucks for you" that we currently have going for us.

I'd love to know, though, what would your ideal method of sharing feedback look like? We're always open to rethinking and adjusting how we go about thinks like gathering feedback, so I'm always down to hear!

Ideal method? Probably something where people could make long form posts and reply to each other. It would help if recent comments where bumped to the top. Maybe even a little thumbs up system for people to express agreement instead of commenting. I think having different sub categories would also be helpful to focus discussions around things like the PTB. Different forums if you will. Oh, and if it had BHVR Official on it, that would make it much clearer.

Sorry, I know that's snarky and this isn't your decision, but those of us who like the forums like them because of exactly what they offer. You're saying feedback, we're saying discussions. For things like the matchmaking problems, anything would probably work to express frustration, but there's a lot more possibilities in a game like DbD. If something new comes out and some players like it and some players don't, sure BHVR might want to know 70% like/30% dislike, but it helps for the players to actually discuss what they like or dislike which makes it clearer what, if anything, needs to be addressed.

Discord that seems impossible. Reddit and Steam, which ones? I don't expect those to be official or have any anticipation that BHVR is looking at them and need to find the right ones.

Steam is probably the closest to these forums and once its open its clear to the user that BHVR has people there. Maybe I'm just attached to this design, but it looks like a step backwards (also strange for the many people not on Steam to use the Steam forums).

400 survivor matches in the last month?

Abandons remove the match from your stat history, and since they basically always happen when you're about to die they inflate your visible ER becuase you're deleting many of your failures. Your real number is probably more like 40-45 if you're abandoning.

I won't be playing solo either, because of the survivor nerfs. Killer is probably going to get too easy, and the wait times are going to be long because of that. Add in the MMR reset making things even weirder and the game is in an unappealing spot right now in all ways. I would have rather just stayed in 2v8 where the chaos lacks the competiveness.

@ThatRyanB  After investigating, we identified a matchmaking parameter that was unintentionally broadening the range of potential opponents and teammates. Was this also resolved with lobby dodging? where back fill takes priority over filling slot with correct skill level.

play alot, too much honestly but I think the MMR system is trying to work and do a good job, one of the biggest pain points still tho is that people can lobby shop around leading to these unbalanced matches once someones dodges.

Is there any plans for team to address chronic lobby shoppers? The matchmaking system can be flawless but if the system still works as "back-filling takes priority" needs to be strict backfill, and if people are still dodging too much dodging should be made not possible or penalties like going next mid match gives you.

I'd love to know, though, what would your ideal method of sharing feedback look like? We're always open to rethinking and adjusting how we go about thinks like gathering feedback, so I'm always down to hear!

I think the Forums are the ideal way of giving feedback. They provide good overview and you can have a lot of different topics right next to each other without any conflict. The other options:

• Steam Forums —> Well, they exclude a huge part of the community. Also they are kinda dead. And honestly, if I would want to use the Steam Forums, I would have done it already, since I am on Steam.
• Reddit —> Probably the closest to the current Forums, but I dont really feel it. I feel the Reddit Community is pretty different from the Forum Community and there are far more extreme opinions compared to the Forums. Sure, you have people here who never touched the other side, but I feel that this is way more common on Reddit.
• Discord —> Is just not a tool for discussions. You write something and when you send it, it is gone in seconds. I am on a few Discord Servers and even those with 10 or less people get annoying when it comes to following things, if a lot of people write. With the DBD Discord, it will just be even more. You will have people discuss on different topics in the same place, this is not really something where you can actually talk about game-related things.
• Twitter —> Probably the worst. Character limit and extremely weird community. If you want to write feedback, you will need several posts and you are in between "Add X to DBD!" and "I play as Perkless Trapper and lost, buff all Killers" or "Bring back Old DS!"…

I mean, it is not your decision to close the Forums, but I think it is really bad that the OFFICIAL Forums are closing down and I dont really see the point of it. Sure, there are less people here, but as I said in another post, this is also due to the Warning and Ban System.

Maybe others will look at Reddit or Discord to provide feedback, but all those options are not for me.

I have mixed feelings about the MMR update.
While some matches do feel fine, others has been extremely one-sided, like to a ridiculous degree.
It's like you go from facing off against Momo on his long Blight streaks, to coming up against poor "Billygoat_57"* who just installed the game.
Same goes the other way, when you play killer, you can go from facing a team of brand new players, to facing Team Eternal. There's like no middleground at times.

In my humble opinion, the matchmaking needs to be fairly tight, like it used to be, long before MMR / SBMM was conceived for DBD. Going back to how it used to be like in 2019, where you were normally paired with and against people of your (at the time) rank.
SoloQ should prioritize matching you with fairly equal players for most (if not all) of the time, and SWF's can allow a slightly looser bracket (with a bias towards the highest rated player).

• generic nickname used for illustrative purposes only.

Also the transparency we had back then to see if we were being matched correctly or if time was being prioritized resulting in the match feeling off was so nice. At the end you could see the ranks and when they were mismatched rainbow ranks could go "that makes way more sense that match felt so bad."

My recent survivor games have felt like the killer is at my skill level (very average), but the problem is that they are using the strongest perks, builds and killers in the game, tunnel out as fast as possible and will do absolutely anything to win. Out of 20 games I escaped maybe once because the team actually won, another 2 or 3 because the killer let us go, and then a couple of times the hatch at like 4 or 5 gens (because I had to escape for some Tomes challenges).

I try to help the newer players but they just don't stand a chance.

No offense but why even make this post if you're just going to be deleting all this feedback anyways.


It feels like intentionally trolling the community for no reason.

OK so, I've played 1v4 more and the script did quite a flip. I somehow went from stomping babies with both roles to the sweatiest matches ever.

My recent survivor experience of 40+ matches is the worst I've ever had. I don't usually go for the narrative that every match has tunneling and whatnot but every single survivor match has had some combo of hard tunneling, camping, and egerious slugging. Every. Single. One. I've been bled out, I've been camped into second multiple times and then tunneled. I'm getting the same killer players repeatedly in a session and almost ever killer is VPNing with 100+ ping. It's all A and S tier running meta. I've never experienced anything this consistently awful in this game. I can deal with this stuff here and there but every match is just horrible. I'm not good enough at this game for this.

I've only played 10 killer matches and though it was a 75% KR for the session, I had to tryhard unpleasantly to achieve that. Getting hit with StB three times in 10 games isn't the norm for me. It didn't help that I got my two most unfavorable maps for my main. I will have to see how it goes but so far it's better than survivor but I feel like it's gonna get worse.

Because my stats are alway above goal I suppose this is where I belong? But God, I hate it here. I feel like I skipped the whole 60% of mid players and went from the playground to the collusuem.

I've been saying this for years.

"Well they all might have gotten out, but at least I got 8 hooks" -said nobody ever.

Nobody cares about their invisible MMR. People just want kills. There's been no reason MMR-wise to slug for the 4k outside of adepts yet people still do it because they want the 4k.

Nobody, not a single person, wants harder games after getting 1-0 kills just because they got a bunch of emblems.

The survivor side of this is somewhat more understandable as theoretically you should get better allies at higher MMR in a system that factors in things like chase time and gen efficiency when calculating MMR. Theoretically. In practice for me at least, it has just lead to marginally better allies against WAY HARDER killers. I haven't escaped more than 1 game since this new MMR update rolled out, other than killers having early ragequits. Now sure, in some of those games, I die so my allies can escape, and that feels good… but I'd like to escape once in a while too, you know.

I am a person that says "Well they all might have gotten out, but at least I got 8 hooks." Especially during Bloodmoon and Anniversaries where I want them (and them to get) fat bloodpoints (but I don't farm, I generally start sacrificing after I get 8 hooks). And I prefer to give the Entity sporting matches.

But I agree with you that killers shouldn't gain MMR from matches where they don't get kills, because soon enough I won't be able to get my 8 hooks and then what?

Not gonna lie, the "new" MMR is much worse than the previous one. To the point where I'm playing less and less, and I'm honestly considering just dropping it because I'm no longer having fun on either side due to my main Killer being Nemesis (a mid Killer in terms of sheer strength lets be honest, he's not bottom-tier by any means but he's not the kind of Killer that can compete against good squads while having actual fun) and not really playing into the meta perks all the time as Survivors.

I'm the kind of player that really didn't care about winning as Killer, in fact it was the contrary, I would go for 8 hooks before either turning friendly/farming or help Survivors get some unreasonably difficult achievements. Sometimes, either against a bully quad or toxic/sandbagging Survivors, I would play seriously and get kills, but I usually had fun by not having to play like my life depended on it and making the game less miserable for other people. I'm not bad at the game, but I'm not a pro player either.

Now, a few weeks after the "new" MMR and still playing for 8 hooks games, all I get are navy seals squads as Killer. As Nemesis, or any Killer that isn't among the stronger/faster ones, I literally do not have the map presence and lethality to commit to chases against people that play like they are in a scrim and not pubs. By the end of the game I usually have 5-6 hooks and 0k because I do my best to not tunnel, and there's no fun to be had, if I try to not sweat then the games are over in a matter of less than 10 minutes.

As Survivor, I'm usually the support and/or gen-doer of the group even in SoloQ. I'm decent at chase but not perfect either even if I had some coaching from a couple pro players over the years, so unless I get tunneled out early then I usually end up with very high or maxed Objective and Altruism scores even if I die late-game. Now, after a few weeks, I don't think I've ever faced so many Blights, Billy and Ghouls in terms of frequency (not a lot of Nurses due to sheer skill floor I assume) that play like their life is on the line. Almost all of my Survivors games is one of them, and unfortunately, when it's not one of them, then it's either a complete humiliation (sometimes DC) for them or they get 1 or 2 kills through hard-tunneling while the others go almost untouched. It's just not fun even when I do escape.

I'm happy to see that I'm apparently not the only one thinking this and going through a similar experience. Really, the intention was good, but the new MMR is just so much worse for average players that aren't interested in feeling like they are in scrims almost every game. Ironically, the previous MMR was much better, it wasn't perfect of course, but it was better than what we have now.