Are There Any LGBTQ Survivors In The Game Or Planning To Be

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  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
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    I...don't think either of you two are the most constructive participants in this discussion, to be fair.

    I'm not revisiting the debate for aforementioned reasons, but the issues raised by this discussion, on if and how to represent queer people in dead by daylight, deserved to be treated with a bit more care. The discussion would fair better if it were remade and presented with adequate nuance, and the two of you have agreed to excuse yourselves from it.

  • PigNRun
    PigNRun Member Posts: 2,428
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    Wahara said:

    I feel like people have begun to stop seriously engaging with me. The goal posts have been moved all over the damn place. First, I went up against the idea that the request for LGBTQ characters implies an irrational fixation with gender or unnecessary identity politics. Then, I go up against the idea that it "doesn't matter" Then, I go up against the notion a character's identity cannot inform their lore. Now, the argument is but it's too likely to end up portrayed in a damaging manner so we shouldn't try.

    Nah. I ain't play'n this game of whack-a-mole. You dears have fun.

    So, you were politely refuted each time with valid points in a public board. -Sarcastic "Oh no!"-
  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
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    @Wahara said:
    I...don't think either of you two are the most constructive participants in this discussion, to be fair.

    I'm not revisiting the debate for aforementioned reasons, but the issues raised by this discussion, on if and how to represent queer people in dead by daylight, deserved to be treated with a bit more care. The discussion would fair better if it were remade and presented with adequate nuance, and the two of you have agreed to excuse yourselves from it.

    Don't need to be constructive in a topic discussion such as this where a 17 yr old believes everyone is wrong for sharing objective opinions and saying we are derailing a discussion that is on-topic.

    This isn't really a "debate" and we don't have to excuse anyone it's a public forum not a "He shouldn't state their opinions because we feel it's not fair." and news flash we don't have to treat anything with any care when it's not that "big of a deal" like many people have stated here once again.

    A debate is civil between all parties with 0 bias/toxicity and this thread became toxic beyond discussion due to the fact someone here wishes we were wrong when uh yeah new flash WE AREN'T as no "OPINION" is based on pure facts just one judgment and view as stated by MULTIPLE people here! it's not a NECESSARY concept it's just a trivial level stuff which has no gameplay relevance whatsoever! if you don't like it then make your own forum and have discussions there if not you can't tell people they can't do this or that because you feel sensitive about the responses.

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
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    @PigNRun said:
    Wahara said:

    I feel like people have begun to stop seriously engaging with me. The goal posts have been moved all over the damn place. First, I went up against the idea that the request for LGBTQ characters implies an irrational fixation with gender or unnecessary identity politics. Then, I go up against the idea that it "doesn't matter" Then, I go up against the notion a character's identity cannot inform their lore. Now, the argument is but it's too likely to end up portrayed in a damaging manner so we shouldn't try.

    Nah. I ain't play'n this game of whack-a-mole. You dears have fun.

    So, you were politely refuted each time with valid points in a public board. -Sarcastic "Oh no!"-

    I'm not even insulting or belittling or even being negative it's like playing chess with a pigeon!

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
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    @PigNRun said:
    Wahara said:

    I feel like people have begun to stop seriously engaging with me. The goal posts have been moved all over the damn place. First, I went up against the idea that the request for LGBTQ characters implies an irrational fixation with gender or unnecessary identity politics. Then, I go up against the idea that it "doesn't matter" Then, I go up against the notion a character's identity cannot inform their lore. Now, the argument is but it's too likely to end up portrayed in a damaging manner so we shouldn't try.

    Nah. I ain't play'n this game of whack-a-mole. You dears have fun.

    So, you were politely refuted each time with valid points in a public board. -Sarcastic "Oh no!"-

    If you feel the need to indicate sarcasm with a tag, you're probably wiser to leave its usage to people that grasp it better than you.

    I hope this helps.

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    edited October 2018
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    "for sharing objective opinions"

    "as no "OPINION" is based on pure facts"

    Yeah. Playing chess with a pigeon about sums it up. sigh

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
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    People have to indicate it or else people (like you) won't get it and take it as a hostile remark.

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675
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    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:
    I want to be able to play as a gay character. Why the hell not?

    And you are playing as a gay character, as far as you know. Just because the devs haven't said they're LGBT doesn't mean they're not LGBT. I said it in my first comment in this thread: just assume they're whatever orientation you are and be done with it.

    I understood what you said the first time, but you haven't articulated what threat the explicit inclusion of a sexual orientation would present to the game.

    I have previously argued that it has the capability of adding depth and intrigue to characters, whereas you seem to be under the impression that it would do harm, or take away from the game some how. Okay, I'll bite, but you gotta give me something to work with.

    I think it's irrelevant to the lore and the characters, the same way it's irrelevant in real life unless you want to know if you can date and/or have sex with someone. I also think it's usually done as a token inclusion, and those always suck.

    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    In this thread, there are more people against it than there are for it, and a large portion of the ones against it are LGBT themselves. Stop trying to frame your position as the morally correct one or even the popular one, because it's simply not true. Having LGBT characters in a game isn't going to help LGBT teenagers who become homeless due to their homophobic parents kicking them out. It's not going to help the high suicide rate due to bullying. It's not going to change anything.

  • xmenfanatic
    xmenfanatic Member Posts: 816
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    @Orion said:

    @xmenfanatic said:

    @DocOctober said:

    @xmenfanatic said:

    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    i didnt say you had to leave i said you should since there is no reason for you to be here except to constantly tell me im wrong for wanting this so again why are you here whats the reason other than to bother me? just go away please.

    1. I do have a reason for being here and that's posting
    2. I never said you were wrong
    3. No one is bothering you and you playing the victim card because no one agrees with you? how old are you? 12? Like listen man I stated my opinion and clearly the majority agrees with me and even a user who is gay agreed they don't care.

    a reason for being here is not to just post it states in the rules of the fourm you are not aloud to de-rail the post which you are by not even participating in the question i asked, also yes you said we shouldnt add a LGBTQ character since it isnt necessary. and yes you are bothering me and i am not playing the victim card since multiple people on here agreed with me and want this, i am 17, you can state your opinion all you want but you dont need to contantly post on this thread because of the sake of posting and the majority is not just agreeing with you its about 50/50 and not everyone has posted here. just because one gay person agreed with not adding this its probably because they dont like labels and i understand that but if your like me you take the label Gay and you make it you, it enpowers you and you say it with pride. if you dont say that your gay because you dont like labels then you probably arent sure that your gay or you went threw some kind of trauma that caused you not to want to label yourself. so again for like the 4th time just go, there is no reason for you to be here if your not going to participate in the thread and basically say no im not when i say you are. i say your bothering me and you sau no your not. i say you have no reason for posting here and you say your reason is to post. I say you stated that this is wrong and you say no you didnt.

    You are the only one derailing it and I don't care for the rest of the things you said here now like I said no one really cares for a trivial concept such as "sexuality" for characters in such a video game if you care so much write a fanfic or something because I said "it doesn't really matter."

    then if you dont care about it go away from my post theirs no reason for you to de-rail it any longer. and yes multiple people care about the concept of sexuality for characters in video games. look again i say he is de-railing it and he provides on proof and says i am. also i say there are people who care about a LGBTQ+ character being added and he says no one does. see guys? this is the exact definition of a internet troll. and i will just be igrnoring his posts for now on until they add the block feature to the fourms

    YOU ARE THE ONE DERAILING IT! Stop quoting me back here! I'm not even trolling you just butthurt because everyone isn't agreeing with your "I need to force my sexuality to feel empowered!" Concept and yes block me! Jeeez for a 17 yr old you act like a 5 yr old.

    this poster has plenty of people supporting their desire to talk about queer characters being in the game. ;)

    Since I knew that that statement is bullshit, I had a look at every single comment in this thread again and noted down if the people who posted them were pro OP, contra OP or either undecided or had an "off-topic" comment.

    Excluding OP, there are only 4 people so far who support OP's request for an LGBTQ character to be added to the game.

    9 people were undecided or didn't contribute to that question.

    But a big fat majority of 15 people are against adding an LGBTQ character for the sake of having one. That's almost 4 times as many as are for adding one. Of at least 3 of those people, I know that they are gay or bisexual themselves.

    Stop talking crap and don't call 4 people "plenty".

    There is a big queer community that enjoys dead by daylight, just because they didn’t all postndoesnt mean there aren’t people whom
    Read these threads and play the game. There are plenty who support this.

    You claim that many people support this, but the actual, verifiable evidence shows that almost four times as many people oppose this. Your imagined support just isn't coming through in real support.

    PS: Just because they're queer doesn't mean they want this. As @DocOctober pointed out, at least 1/5 of those who oppose this are bisexual or homosexual themselves. Don't presume to know what we want just because we're not heterosexual.

    I didn't say your name, so no I wasn't speaking for you. I feel you have an easy enough time sharing your thoughts already. I don't think someone should assume everyone in a group would simply share the same view of a certain topic. People always vary in beliefs and views. I'm simply sharing a view other people have voiced through facebook groups, or in person or off of playing the game and meeting people through voice chat and games. I know i've seen support and since not everyone is hear to voice it I'm just trying to share some positivity with @TheLegendDyl4n1

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
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    @Orion said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:
    I want to be able to play as a gay character. Why the hell not?

    And you are playing as a gay character, as far as you know. Just because the devs haven't said they're LGBT doesn't mean they're not LGBT. I said it in my first comment in this thread: just assume they're whatever orientation you are and be done with it.

    I understood what you said the first time, but you haven't articulated what threat the explicit inclusion of a sexual orientation would present to the game.

    I have previously argued that it has the capability of adding depth and intrigue to characters, whereas you seem to be under the impression that it would do harm, or take away from the game some how. Okay, I'll bite, but you gotta give me something to work with.

    I think it's irrelevant to the lore and the characters, the same way it's irrelevant in real life unless you want to know if you can date and/or have sex with someone. I also think it's usually done as a token inclusion, and those always suck.

    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    In this thread, there are more people against it than there are for it, and a large portion of the ones against it are LGBT themselves. Stop trying to frame your position as the morally correct one or even the popular one, because it's simply not true. Having LGBT characters in a game isn't going to help LGBT teenagers who become homeless due to their homophobic parents kicking them out. It's not going to help the high suicide rate due to bullying. It's not going to change anything.

    FACTS THANK YOU!

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293
    edited October 2018
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    Is this snowflake still complaining about the fact there's no bright neon sign above the survivors head that state 'LBGT' ?

    Nobody wants forced diversity. Nobody wants a gay character to exist simply because they're gay. They would much rather the character be part of the world rather then the world adjusting to the character. 

    We don't even know if the majority of the survivors are straight. Because in the end it doesn't matter, they're still ######### by a malevolent god that tortures them for food.

    Quit being so god damn shallow because you see minorities as a checkbox for your socjus agenda.
    Post edited by Mc_Harty on
  • xmenfanatic
    xmenfanatic Member Posts: 816
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    Sometimes I give Nea the short blonde short hair, and the yellow sweater and jeans, and I pretend I'm Even Degeneres running from psychos like she got suck into this. Lol.

  • ToolboxMotley
    ToolboxMotley Member Posts: 31
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    @Mc_Harty said:
    We don't even know if the majority of the survivors are straight. Because in the end it doesn't matter, they're still ######### by a benevolent god that tortures them for food.

    I think you mean malevolent. The Entity sure as heck ain't kindly and well-meaning. :P

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293
    edited October 2018
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    ToolboxMotley said:

    @Mc_Harty said:
    We don't even know if the majority of the survivors are straight. Because in the end it doesn't matter, they're still ######### by a benevolent god that tortures them for food.

    I think you mean malevolent. The Entity sure as heck ain't kindly and well-meaning. :P

    Edited. Thank you
  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
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    @Mc_Harty said:
    Is this snowflake still complaining about the fact there's no bright neon sign above the survivors head that state 'LBGT' ?

    Nobody wants forced diversity. Nobody wants a gay character to exist simply because they're gay. They would much rather the character be part of the world rather then the world adjusting to the character. 

    We don't even know if the majority of the survivors are straight. Because in the end it doesn't matter, they're still ######### by a malevolent god that tortures them for food.

    Quit being so god damn shallow because you see minorities as a checkbox for your socjus agenda.

    Facts!

  • Peasant
    Peasant Member Posts: 4,104
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    Since we're in the LORE subforum I'll be frank with everyone. If there were going to be a homosexual character added to Dead by Daylight it would likely be a killer. The reason for this is that a majority of the cast and aesthetic themes come from the 1950's. During this specific time in history, folks weren't too keen on the idea of same-sex couples (to the best of my VERY limited knowledge on this subject). So if a homosexual character were to appear in Dead by Daylight they would likely be a killer who was furious after losing their partner. I don't see why they would have a homosexual survivor as the developers never bother to disclose that information in survivor character lore.

    Above all though, there is no current need for homosexual characters in video games. Games are meant to entertain an audience. Dead by Daylight is a horror game above everything else. So unless you want to exploit homophobia there is no direct need for homosexual representation in a horror game.

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    edited October 2018
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    I say I'm leaving and then come right back. I have too much time on my hands. But anyways. cracks knuckles

    "We don't know the sexuality of the characters so you can just pretend."

    It's like people are saying heterosexuality isn't naturally assumed to be the default or something. Weird.

    Also, MichaelMyers, did you know that deep throating every post that confirms your biases with capital letters makes you look really smart? You're doing great, keep it up.

    There was one thing that I feel silly in hindsight for not expanding upon. When xmenfanatic mentioned that falling underneath the queer umbrella encompasses a lot more than who you want to have sex with, I should have added that gender presentation also factors into this. Characters that don't fit into their expected binary would be a welcome change, i.e. a male survivor who wears earrings and lipstick.

    "I don't want their sexuality to just be tacked on."

    I feel a little embarrassed for falling for this, because it's a sneaky trick. Sexuality wouldn't be "tacked on" any more than sex or race is "tacked on" It can be relevant to their story or it may not be. Neither are a valid basis for exclusion.

    Post edited by Wahara on
  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
    edited October 2018
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    @SoylentPixie said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    Did you.....did you just compare your demand for an LGBTQ character in a VIDEO GAME, as the same as fighting for womens rights and the end to slavery?

    Dear gods.....i don't even......i really do not have words for this. At least not very polite ones. I really do hope that was just a badly worded post that was easy to misread, i really do.

    I lost brain cells reading that....its like trying to compare slavery to the holocaust you just CAN'T compare them!

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
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    @PolarBear said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    guys i really dont want to argue i just want to discuss who could be LGBTQ, why they could be, and have fun in another discussion. when people come into these discussions and say stuff like why does it matter or that its irrelevant to the game.
    when you do this is saddens me because all i wanted to do was start another post about something i believe in why cant you just let me ask what i want and not campaign against it if you dont believe in it.
    i want a confirmed LGBTQ character in this horror game that i have many hours into because i want to be able to relate to a character for real not just say oh this persons gay and i believe that.
    so when i ask for them to confirm if in any characters lore, they believed they were LGBTQ so that i can personally relate to them for real, not just in my head its something thats reasonable.
    if you dont want to talk about who you think is LGBTQ and try and find reasons why they are by looking in the current lore or coming up with lore yourself for if they were LGBTQ then leave
    so, again if you dont agree with any of LGBTQ, you want to constantly go against anything any of us put, or just come up with reason after reason why this question i ask cant be added to the game's lore as a small part of it thats only one sentence long if that.
    so, if you qualify as anything i said before then just go, leave, get out of this thread because no one needs you negativity in a thread thats asking for a small thing to be added that will not effect your quality of life unless you are a homophobe or transphobe or anything against LGBTQ and if you are then give good, solid reasons why its wrong to be LGBTQ (LGBTQ stands for everyone that is not strait just because there is not a letter there does not mean it is not represented) and if you can do that then go ahead and try.

    i am gay, i am also a Baptist Christian going to a Christian Baptist School who believes in God. so if your argument is that it is a sin against God then your argument is invalid because we are all sinners in Gods eyes and every sin is equal.

    so, if your going to be negative then just go and let me and other people who want to participate in this thread participate peacefully.

    (side note if your color blind and cant read this post tell me and i will post a different version that has no color)

    You want to relate to a character by them being gay. How can I then relate to that character if I'm straight? If they can't implement the sexual orientation of a character in a meaningful way then why should they?

    if your strait then your already accepted for your sexual orientation so you dont go what most LGBTQ+ people do

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
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    @Peasant said:
    Above all though, there is no current need for homosexual characters in video games. Games are meant to entertain an audience. Dead by Daylight is a horror game above everything else. So unless you want to exploit homophobia there is no direct need for homosexual representation in a horror game.

    ^This

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
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    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:
    I want to be able to play as a gay character. Why the hell not?

    And you are playing as a gay character, as far as you know. Just because the devs haven't said they're LGBT doesn't mean they're not LGBT. I said it in my first comment in this thread: just assume they're whatever orientation you are and be done with it.

    I understood what you said the first time, but you haven't articulated what threat the explicit inclusion of a sexual orientation would present to the game.

    I have previously argued that it has the capability of adding depth and intrigue to characters, whereas you seem to be under the impression that it would do harm, or take away from the game some how. Okay, I'll bite, but you gotta give me something to work with.

    I think it's irrelevant to the lore and the characters, the same way it's irrelevant in real life unless you want to know if you can date and/or have sex with someone. I also think it's usually done as a token inclusion, and those always suck.

    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    Slavery=/=A Video Game
    Women Rights=/=A Video Game

    Those are some horrible anologies to your "argument" don't compare REAL events for FICTIONAL ones.

    Dude! READ WHAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING! There isn't a ARGUMENT BECAUSE THIS ISNT A DEBATE as there no need for a LGBTQ type concept for characters! Again WRITE FANFIC about it don't try to tell everyone they are "Bullying" you or we are derailing because we are sharing objective opinions.

    My mom just got married to her long time girlfriend and she would not care about this trivial concept you want "enforced" because people "demand" for it.

    its not just about a video game its all LGBTQ+ people in general that arent accepted for being who they are and by adding LGBTQ+ people to videogames it would be another step to normalizing LGBTQ+ which is one very small step by adding one to this game

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
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    @SoylentPixie said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    Did you.....did you just compare your demand for an LGBTQ character in a VIDEO GAME, as the same as fighting for womens rights and the end to slavery?

    Dear gods.....i don't even......i really do not have words for this. At least not very polite ones. I really do hope that was just a badly worded post that was easy to misread, i really do.

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:
    I want to be able to play as a gay character. Why the hell not?

    And you are playing as a gay character, as far as you know. Just because the devs haven't said they're LGBT doesn't mean they're not LGBT. I said it in my first comment in this thread: just assume they're whatever orientation you are and be done with it.

    I understood what you said the first time, but you haven't articulated what threat the explicit inclusion of a sexual orientation would present to the game.

    I have previously argued that it has the capability of adding depth and intrigue to characters, whereas you seem to be under the impression that it would do harm, or take away from the game some how. Okay, I'll bite, but you gotta give me something to work with.

    I think it's irrelevant to the lore and the characters, the same way it's irrelevant in real life unless you want to know if you can date and/or have sex with someone. I also think it's usually done as a token inclusion, and those always suck.

    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    Slavery=/=A Video Game
    Women Rights=/=A Video Game

    Those are some horrible anologies to your "argument" don't compare REAL events for FICTIONAL ones.

    Dude! READ WHAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING! There isn't a ARGUMENT BECAUSE THIS ISNT A DEBATE as there no need for a LGBTQ type concept for characters! Again WRITE FANFIC about it don't try to tell everyone they are "Bullying" you or we are derailing because we are sharing objective opinions.

    My mom just got married to her long time girlfriend and she would not care about this trivial concept you want "enforced" because people "demand" for it.

    its not just about a video game its all LGBTQ+ people in general that arent accepted for being who they are and by adding LGBTQ+ people to videogames it would be another step to normalizing LGBTQ+ which is one very small step by adding one to this game

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
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    @Mc_Harty said:
    Is this snowflake still complaining about the fact there's no bright neon sign above the survivors head that state 'LBGT' ?

    Nobody wants forced diversity. Nobody wants a gay character to exist simply because they're gay. They would much rather the character be part of the world rather then the world adjusting to the character. 

    We don't even know if the majority of the survivors are straight. Because in the end it doesn't matter, they're still ######### by a malevolent god that tortures them for food.

    Quit being so god damn shallow because you see minorities as a checkbox for your socjus agenda.

    please enlighten us to how every character in this game was added to be apart of the world. every character or at least every chapter (a killer, a map, and a survivor) has its own DIFFERENT backstorys none of them were added as apart of the world to make a whole single story to come together. also just because they are being eaten by a god that tortures them doesnt matter since if your LGBTQ+ is apart of a characters lore and we are in the lore section

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
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    @Peasant said:
    Since we're in the LORE subforum I'll be frank with everyone. If there were going to be a homosexual character added to Dead by Daylight it would likely be a killer. The reason for this is that a majority of the cast and aesthetic themes come from the 1950's. During this specific time in history, folks weren't too keen on the idea of same-sex couples (to the best of my VERY limited knowledge on this subject). So if a homosexual character were to appear in Dead by Daylight they would likely be a killer who was furious after losing their partner. I don't see why they would have a homosexual survivor as the developers never bother to disclose that information in survivor character lore.

    Above all though, there is no current need for homosexual characters in video games. Games are meant to entertain an audience. Dead by Daylight is a horror game above everything else. So unless you want to exploit homophobia there is no direct need for homosexual representation in a horror game.

    if they were to add a LGBTQ+ killer it would still add a little something to this game. although it isnt a survivor i have slowly started playing killer so i could main that one since i go off of story and not appearance or powers

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
    Options

    @Orion said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:
    I want to be able to play as a gay character. Why the hell not?

    And you are playing as a gay character, as far as you know. Just because the devs haven't said they're LGBT doesn't mean they're not LGBT. I said it in my first comment in this thread: just assume they're whatever orientation you are and be done with it.

    I understood what you said the first time, but you haven't articulated what threat the explicit inclusion of a sexual orientation would present to the game.

    I have previously argued that it has the capability of adding depth and intrigue to characters, whereas you seem to be under the impression that it would do harm, or take away from the game some how. Okay, I'll bite, but you gotta give me something to work with.

    I think it's irrelevant to the lore and the characters, the same way it's irrelevant in real life unless you want to know if you can date and/or have sex with someone. I also think it's usually done as a token inclusion, and those always suck.

    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    In this thread, there are more people against it than there are for it, and a large portion of the ones against it are LGBT themselves. Stop trying to frame your position as the morally correct one or even the popular one, because it's simply not true. Having LGBT characters in a game isn't going to help LGBT teenagers who become homeless due to their homophobic parents kicking them out. It's not going to help the high suicide rate due to bullying. It's not going to change anything.

    "a large portion" where i see a few but most have just said stuff about the subject not about thier sexuality i said i am gay and another said they were gay but other than that there arent any other claims.

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    Options

    I'm gay. The whole numbers game isn't really a valid basis for any argument anyways. It is interesting to note that several people who are LGBT aren't really as against the idea as they appear to be, once you pick away through the nonsense like "it's not needed" and such, they're concern ultimately boils down to a deep cynicism.

    I understand it, but like I said, it's a bit sad and defeatist.

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
    edited October 2018
    Options

    guys when i campared womens sufferage, and the freeing of the slaves i meant to the LGBTQ+ community and that we LGBTQ+ had to fight to get married and be accpeted and we still are fighting for all the rights of a strait person that obvisouly is not a felon. by adding a LGBTQ+ person to this game its not checking off a list its adding something people are asking for. LGBTQ+ people go threw hell everyday with some jobs like in Florida being allowed to fire someone with no reason at all and you cant go to court about it. i play characters based on backstory not powers or apperance so when i picked what survivor i would main it was based on Nea's story. so like i said earlier this would be a small step in normalizing being something other than Strait. if your LGBTQ+ and dont like labels then your most afraid to say it unlike me who make my label of "Gay" a strength not a weakness.

  • Peasant
    Peasant Member Posts: 4,104
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    @TheLegendDyl4n1 I'm all for supporting LGBTQ people for who they are, there is just a time and a place for it. During the time in history at which Dead by Daylight occurs (the 1950s) there was little to no open homosexuality. Knowing this I cannot in good faith recommend that the developers and designers focus time and effort on a character that has little business being there. Dead by Daylight has two priorities:

    • meeting the horror genre trends
      and

    • meeting the asymmetrical genre trends

    To suggest that the developers and designers should change their objectives and focus all of their efforts on two LGBTQ characters is delusional, to say the least.

    It is the duty of the developers to produce a product for a market. Dead by Daylight is an asymmetrical horror game. While I have no issues with a LGBTQ chapter coming out, the focus shouldn't be on supporting the LGBTQ movement as that's not what I and over tens of thousands other customers bought Dead by Daylight for. We bought Dead by Daylight for an asymmetrical horror game. That day that the focus of the developers shifts from horror and asymmetrical gameplay is the day that a very large group of players will become very angry.

    I'm not against LGBTQ characters being released, there just needs to be a reason for them to be here that is based on the main game itself. We do not need LGBTQ characters in Dead by Daylight just to help LGBTQ people accept themselves, that is not Dead by Daylight's purpose and it would be an insult to Dead by Daylight and the LGBTQ acceptance movement.

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
    Options

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    its not just about a video game its all LGBTQ+ people in general that arent accepted for being who they are and by adding LGBTQ+ people to videogames it would be another step to normalizing LGBTQ+ which is one very small step by adding one to this game

    WHAT? JUST WHAT? literally, people been telling you it's not important because this is a video game! a HORROR VIDEO GAME! Being Gay or Lesbian or Transgender is openly free right now in 2018 ACCEPTABLE and been ACCEPTABLE for a long time! but who cares over a VIDEO GAME!

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
    Options

    @Wahara said:
    I'm gay. The whole numbers game isn't really a valid basis for any argument anyways. It is interesting to note that several people who are LGBT aren't really as against the idea as they appear to be, once you pick away through the nonsense like "it's not needed" and such, they're concern ultimately boils down to a deep cynicism.

    I understand it, but like I said, it's a bit sad and defeatist.

    No just stop they said their thoughts and you cant twist it around.

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
    Options

    @Peasant said:
    @TheLegendDyl4n1 I'm all for supporting LGBTQ people for who they are, there is just a time and a place for it. During the time in history at which Dead by Daylight occurs (the 1950s) there was little to no open homosexuality. Knowing this I cannot in good faith recommend that the developers and designers focus time and effort on a character that has little business being there. Dead by Daylight has two priorities:

    • meeting the horror genre trends
      and

    • meeting the asymmetrical genre trends

    To suggest that the developers and designers should change their objectives and focus all of their efforts on two LGBTQ characters is delusional, to say the least.

    It is the duty of the developers to produce a product for a market. Dead by Daylight is an asymmetrical horror game. While I have no issues with a LGBTQ chapter coming out, the focus shouldn't be on supporting the LGBTQ movement as that's not what I and over tens of thousands other customers bought Dead by Daylight for. We bought Dead by Daylight for an asymmetrical horror game. That day that the focus of the developers shifts from horror and asymmetrical gameplay is the day that a very large group of players will become very angry.

    I'm not against LGBTQ characters being released, there just needs to be a reason for them to be here that is based on the main game itself. We do not need LGBTQ characters in Dead by Daylight just to help LGBTQ people accept themselves, that is not Dead by Daylight's purpose and it would be an insult to Dead by Daylight and the LGBTQ acceptance movement.

    this game doesnt only take place in 1950's they said that the entity is everwhere and that it takes people from any time

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
    Options

    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    its not just about a video game its all LGBTQ+ people in general that arent accepted for being who they are and by adding LGBTQ+ people to videogames it would be another step to normalizing LGBTQ+ which is one very small step by adding one to this game

    WHAT? JUST WHAT? literally, people been telling you it's not important because this is a video game! a HORROR VIDEO GAME! Being Gay or Lesbian or Transgender is openly free right now in 2018 ACCEPTABLE and been ACCEPTABLE for a long time! but who cares over a VIDEO GAME!

    its not fully acceptaed if you would of refered to my whole post then you would of saw that in places like Florida people fire others for being LGBTQ+ and that although we are tollerated we arent acceptated since their are still people who beat up LGBTQ+ in public at nightime in alleys or other places we arent accepted and we dont have every right of a strait person. and yes this is a videogame and most other videogames dont contain LGBTQ+ people. in Overwatch the character tracer is gay but you dont see them announcing that in the game except in a few sprays. it just that i would like to relate to a gay character and just because this is a videogame does not mean it cant be added.

  • BMAN
    BMAN Member Posts: 12
    Options

    I'm down for lore and learning lots about the survivors and killers, not sure knowing sexual orientation is necessary though. I'm more interested in how they survive in the entity's world and if they could ever get out.

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
    Options

    @BMAN said:
    I'm down for lore and learning lots about the survivors and killers, not sure knowing sexual orientation is necessary though. I'm more interested in how they survive in the entity's world and if they could ever get out.

    FACTS!

  • MichaelAMyers
    MichaelAMyers Member Posts: 292
    Options

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @MichaelAMyers said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    its not just about a video game its all LGBTQ+ people in general that arent accepted for being who they are and by adding LGBTQ+ people to videogames it would be another step to normalizing LGBTQ+ which is one very small step by adding one to this game

    WHAT? JUST WHAT? literally, people been telling you it's not important because this is a video game! a HORROR VIDEO GAME! Being Gay or Lesbian or Transgender is openly free right now in 2018 ACCEPTABLE and been ACCEPTABLE for a long time! but who cares over a VIDEO GAME!

    its not fully acceptaed if you would of refered to my whole post then you would of saw that in places like Florida people fire others for being LGBTQ+ and that although we are tollerated we arent acceptated since their are still people who beat up LGBTQ+ in public at nightime in alleys or other places we arent accepted and we dont have every right of a strait person. and yes this is a videogame and most other videogames dont contain LGBTQ+ people. in Overwatch the character tracer is gay but you dont see them announcing that in the game except in a few sprays. it just that i would like to relate to a gay character and just because this is a videogame does not mean it cant be added.

    Overwatch=/=Dead by Daylight

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293
    edited October 2018
    Options

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    please enlighten us to how every character in this game was added to be apart of the world. every character or at least every chapter (a killer, a map, and a survivor) has its own DIFFERENT backstorys none of them were added as apart of the world to make a whole single story to come together. also just because they are being eaten by a god that tortures them doesnt matter since if your LGBTQ+ is apart of a characters lore and we are in the lore section

    The developers have a certain theme with each character for each DLC.

    Clown and Kate are both travellers that affect the communities they visit.
    Spirit and Adam represent the benefits and downfalls of hard work.
    Nea and Nurse both have tales that tell their struggles of a 'fresh start'.
    Etc, etc.

    The character make sense to the world since they were either abducted by the Entity or taken from a place of great tragedy. The Entity harvests the emotions of these people to increase it's power.

    And yes, it doesn't matter if it abducts a straight, gay or a black tranny. The Entity shouldn't give a ######### about representation because it's not a human, nor does it think like one and since it doesn't think like a human, why the ######### should it care about the gender politics of human society?

    That's why it doesn't matter. Because either way the Entity doesn't give a #########.

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    edited October 2018
    Options

    "when you almost militantly march forward forcing your ideas on everyone and injecting them into every single medium you can get your hands on my tolerance for the whole group drops."

    Is Claudette throwing her blackness in your face? Is Feng Min throwing her Asianness in your face?

    All of you are being obtuse cowards about this very basic and ######### simple question. Why is the representation of race and sex permissible but the representation of sexuality is not? If you cannot answer, you must accept the possibility of having an irrational double standard and take some time for a bit of self examination. Seriously.

    I'll be waiting while you ignore me to regurgitate your tired points at Legend over and over again.

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293
    Options

    @Wahara said:
    "when you almost militantly march forward forcing your ideas on everyone and injecting them into every single medium you can get your hands on my tolerance for the whole group drops."

    Is Claudette throwing her blackness in your face? Is Feng Min throwing her Asianness in your face?

    All of you are being cowards about this very basic and [BAD WORD] simple question. Please justify why the representation of race and sex is permissible but the representation of sexuality is not.

    I'll wait.

    Simple. No one gives a #########. Not about race, sex, or who ever you want to #########.

    Stop acting so offended.

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    edited October 2018
    Options

    @Mc_Harty said:

    @Wahara said:
    "when you almost militantly march forward forcing your ideas on everyone and injecting them into every single medium you can get your hands on my tolerance for the whole group drops."

    Is Claudette throwing her blackness in your face? Is Feng Min throwing her Asianness in your face?

    All of you are being cowards about this very basic and [BAD WORD] simple question. Please justify why the representation of race and sex is permissible but the representation of sexuality is not.

    I'll wait.

    Simple. No one gives a #########. Not about race, sex, or who ever you want to [BAD WORD].

    Stop acting so offended.

    "No one cares, therefore no." - Arguing a neutral and a negative at the same time.

    YouTried

    Next on down!

    I am also not acting offended, but I am acting aggressive. I am acting aggressive because several of you are ignoring my points to repeat tired arguments that have been properly addressed. If I have to behave a bit more brutishly in order to force others to engage with an argument, so be it.

  • ToolboxMotley
    ToolboxMotley Member Posts: 31
    Options

    @Wahara said:
    I'm gay. The whole numbers game isn't really a valid basis for any argument anyways. It is interesting to note that several people who are LGBT aren't really as against the idea as they appear to be, once you pick away through the nonsense like "it's not needed" and such, they're concern ultimately boils down to a deep cynicism.

    "Once you pick away the nonsense like "viewpoints opposed to my own". PSSSH. Stoopid disagree-y people."

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    if your LGBTQ+ and dont like labels then your most afraid to say it unlike me who make my label of "Gay" a strength not a weakness.

    This isn't even about the suggestion anymore, this is for you: you NEED to stop obsessing. Your entire personal identity seems to be wrapped up in your sexuality. It is not healthy, at all. This label isn't your strength or weakness, it's your everything.

    @Wahara said:
    "when you almost militantly march forward forcing your ideas on everyone and injecting them into every single medium you can get your hands on my tolerance for the whole group drops."

    Is Claudette throwing her blackness in your face? Is Feng Min throwing her Asianness in your face?

    All of you are being obtuse cowards about this very basic and [BAD WORD] simple question. Why is the representation of race and sex permissible but the representation of sexuality is not? If you cannot answer, you must accept the possibility of having an irrational double standard and take some time for a bit of self examination. Seriously.

    I'll be waiting while you ignore me to regurgitate your tired points at Legend over and over again.

    Can you represent their sexuality visually? Race is blatantly obvious at a glance. Sexuality is something you have to go out of your way to convey. Perhaps a shirt or hat or something with a rainbow or gender symbols?

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
    Options

    @Wahara said:
    "when you almost militantly march forward forcing your ideas on everyone and injecting them into every single medium you can get your hands on my tolerance for the whole group drops."

    Is Claudette throwing her blackness in your face? Is Feng Min throwing her Asianness in your face?

    All of you are being obtuse cowards about this very basic and [BAD WORD] simple question. Why is the representation of race and sex permissible but the representation of sexuality is not? If you cannot answer, you must accept the possibility of having an irrational double standard and take some time for a bit of self examination. Seriously.

    I'll be waiting while you ignore me to regurgitate your tired points at Legend over and over again.

    what i was going to say thank you

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    edited October 2018
    Options

    @ToolboxMotley Oh, you know that's an improper characterization. You yourself were argued down from "Quit being so God damned shallow" to "Okay, actually yeah it is kind of nice if it's done right" Orion, as well.

    Er, to your question, I'm not sure exactly how to respond but I cannot tell whether you're phrasing your question rhetorically or whether they're being asked in good faith. Some clarification?

    @Legend. I didn't mean that offensively. I mean that the members here in this discussion are blatantly picking on you so they can ignore points they don't want to deal with, and that's not cool.

  • TheLegendDyl4n1
    TheLegendDyl4n1 Member Posts: 1,493
    Options

    @Mc_Harty said:

    @Wahara said:
    "when you almost militantly march forward forcing your ideas on everyone and injecting them into every single medium you can get your hands on my tolerance for the whole group drops."

    Is Claudette throwing her blackness in your face? Is Feng Min throwing her Asianness in your face?

    All of you are being cowards about this very basic and [BAD WORD] simple question. Please justify why the representation of race and sex is permissible but the representation of sexuality is not.

    I'll wait.

    Simple. No one gives a #########. Not about race, sex, or who ever you want to [BAD WORD].

    Stop acting so offended.

    if no one gives a ######### then why do i?

  • fcc2014
    fcc2014 Member Posts: 4,388
    Options

    The avatar you play can be whoever you make them to be.

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293
    edited October 2018
    Options

    @Wahara said:
    "No one cares, therefore no." - Arguing a neutral and a negative at the same time.

    YouTried

    Next on down!

    Okay then.

    1. A characters race is only shoved down your throat if they are subjected to racial stereotype. Currently we have an Asian who failed her grades, a socially awkward, shy black girl and a black man that is self taught. No stereotypes as far as I'm aware
    2. Race and sexuality aren't the same thing so 'hashtag' you tired.
    3. It's incredibly racist to assume that a racial character merely existing is shoving their identity down your throat. Unlike you gender studies students, they can't change whatever gender they're on the fly.
    4. Doesn't even make sense in terms of the game since (A) most players don't give a ######### (B) the Entity is not a human and is impossible to understands it's motivations. The only reason it interacts with humanity at all is too use them as food so again, why should it give a #########?
    5. Just because people are neutral doesn't mean they agree with you.
    6. No one enjoys forced pandering, and is actually considered a disservice to some communities. That's why people are against you and the OPs bullshit.
    7. You act like anything that isn't 100% labelled LBGT is 100% straight. Again we don't even know if the majority of the characters are even straight.

    Stop trying to force people to care about your interests.

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293
    Options

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
    if no one gives a ######### then why do i?

    Because you're a very shallow individual that needs neon signs to relate to something.

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675
    Options

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @TheLegendDyl4n1 said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:

    @Orion said:

    @Wahara said:
    I want to be able to play as a gay character. Why the hell not?

    And you are playing as a gay character, as far as you know. Just because the devs haven't said they're LGBT doesn't mean they're not LGBT. I said it in my first comment in this thread: just assume they're whatever orientation you are and be done with it.

    I understood what you said the first time, but you haven't articulated what threat the explicit inclusion of a sexual orientation would present to the game.

    I have previously argued that it has the capability of adding depth and intrigue to characters, whereas you seem to be under the impression that it would do harm, or take away from the game some how. Okay, I'll bite, but you gotta give me something to work with.

    I think it's irrelevant to the lore and the characters, the same way it's irrelevant in real life unless you want to know if you can date and/or have sex with someone. I also think it's usually done as a token inclusion, and those always suck.

    so when the men said women didnt need the right to vote did they just say yeah its irrelvant yes they did until they fought for it. when african americans wanted freedom from being slaves did they just sit down, no they fought and got thier freedom in the civil war. so if there was no black person in this game it would be weird right? yes it would. if there was no women in this game it would be weird right? yes. my arguement is that they should add a LGBTQ+ character not to check off a list but because people are requesting it.

    In this thread, there are more people against it than there are for it, and a large portion of the ones against it are LGBT themselves. Stop trying to frame your position as the morally correct one or even the popular one, because it's simply not true. Having LGBT characters in a game isn't going to help LGBT teenagers who become homeless due to their homophobic parents kicking them out. It's not going to help the high suicide rate due to bullying. It's not going to change anything.

    "a large portion" where i see a few but most have just said stuff about the subject not about thier sexuality i said i am gay and another said they were gay but other than that there arent any other claims.

    Like DocOctober pointed out, 15 people disagreed with you. Of those 15, 3 (20%) are LGBT themselves. I'd say one fifth is a large portion.

  • Wahara
    Wahara Member Posts: 237
    edited October 2018
    Options

    @Mc_Harty

    1) Your point implies that the inclusion of sexuality is innately more "shoved down one's throat" than race or sex.
    2) Duh? I'm not sure what point you were trying to make here. That's the whole point of comparison, you describe similarities between two things that are different. The similarities being that they are both immutable characteristics.
    3) YES I AGREE THAT IS THE ######### POINT YOU DENSE MOTHER #########. Neither is the mere existent of LGBTQ people. You're making me facepalm into a coma.
    4) I can repeat the main argument, here. If no one gives a #########, then there's no reason not to include it.
    5) You didn't understand the point. It is logically contradictory to argue a neutral stance and also a negative stance. You either don't care or you do care, not both.
    6) Who said anything about forcing anyone to do anything? What the hell do you think I'm discussing? Marching into BHVR HQ with armed drag queens? Don't be ridiculous.
    7) Heterosexuality is the naturally assumed default.

This discussion has been closed.